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The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

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The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

Old 12-01-2007, 07:32 PM
  #11  
Fork Horn
 
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

http://huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=2411340&mpage=2&key=

The doe halfway down page 2 is one that I took a couple weeks ago using a Hornady SST.... No need in explaining as the picture says enough...
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Old 12-01-2007, 08:17 PM
  #12  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

But an educated person a long time ago set me down and told me that Ballistic Tip Bullets are not intended for hunting.

Their main design was to be used for target practice only.
Then why do you suppose that Nosler,the company that sells the Ballistic tip,lists them as a hunting bullet?So are the 40 or so head of big game that I have taken with the Nosler ballistic tip not really dead?

By the way,tell that supposedly educated person that told you such nonsense that he should get a refund on his education as it was obviously faulty.
Perhaps he should be sent back to his village to resume his former position as the village idiot.He is obviously qualified for the job.
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Old 12-01-2007, 08:55 PM
  #13  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

WOW that is impressive. That doe has about the best evidence of a clean kill utilizing a heart/lung shot I have ever seen. That had to be over quick and in a hurry, what we all should be striving for. Thanks for the replies.

Scott
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Old 12-01-2007, 09:25 PM
  #14  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

ORIGINAL: The Rifleman

JMO

But an educated person a long time ago set me down and told me that Ballistic Tip Bullets are not intended for hunting.

Their main design was to be used for target practice only.

Most educated people would agree with me on this one.

The lead on the tip of the bullet, usually burns off while it travels through the air after it leaves the barrel.

Now the lead inside of the bullet is what is the greater part of the mass which makes up the main part of the weight of the bullet. The construction of the bullet - determines how much lead it can hold.

By knowing that, it would be determined that a bullet of the proper construction - made for the harvest of big game would be proportionally better than a bullet designed for target practice.

We did tests on Sierra boat tails in 150 / 165 / 180 gr in 30 caliber / .308 and found that they were poor compared to a 150 gr Hornady PSP bullet.

The weight retention of the boat tail bullet was not consistent compared to a spire point bullet - because the spire point bullet held the lead better and retained more of it's weight. Where as a lot of the Boat tail bullets fell apart when it struck a hard object - such as bone / trees / twigs etc...

Ballistic Tip Bullets should NOT be used for hunting purposes.
Are you trying to say that the Nosler Ballistic Tip should not be used for hunting, or just polymer tipped bullets in general?

If the former is true, you would be partially correct. Some of the Nosler BT's are not designed for hunting (big game), as they are varmint bullets designed for instant fragmentation on impact. But many (most really) are designed for hunting deer sized game and up.

If you mean the latter, then I'd say you better tell all the bullet manufacturers that all the animals killed with SST, Interbond, Scirroco, Ballistic Tips, Accubonds, MRX, and others are not really dead, but simply waiting in animal limbo waiting for someone like you to come along and finish them off with a real "hunting bullet"![:'(][:-]

As far as the polymer tip burning off in flight...well, lets just say that that as only slightly more rediculous than the "it was going to fast to expand" fallacy. I've shot metal plates with polymer tipped bullets at ranges out to 300 yards, and the interesting thing is that as often as not you can see the smear of plastic where the tip hit the plate, indicating that it was still intact at impact.

Mike

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Old 12-01-2007, 09:29 PM
  #15  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

This thread amazes me! LOL

Tell the many many, many, many, big deer I have shot with Ballistic Tips they aren't effective hunting rounds any different.

I've used 95gr BTs out of my 243 up to 140gr BTs out of my 7mm Mag, to 150gr BTs out of my 308, 30-06, and I've never had any sort of failure.
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Old 12-01-2007, 10:19 PM
  #16  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

[8D]Hehehe that post was a classic!! Brings a whole new meaning to the term "hot lead"
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Old 12-01-2007, 10:32 PM
  #17  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

Hehehe that post was a classic!! Brings a whole new meaning to the term "hot lead"
That post is a classic example of someone that knows nothing about the topic taking advice from someone that thinks that they know something about the topic.
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Old 12-01-2007, 11:02 PM
  #18  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips


ORIGINAL: The Rifleman

JMO

But an educated person a long time ago set me down and told me that Ballistic Tip Bullets are not intended for hunting.

Their main design was to be used for target practice only.

Most educated people would agree with me on this one.

The lead on the tip of the bullet, usually burns off while it travels through the air after it leaves the barrel.

Now the lead inside of the bullet is what is the greater part of the mass which makes up the main part of the weight of the bullet. The construction of the bullet - determines how much lead it can hold.

By knowing that, it would be determined that a bullet of the proper construction - made for the harvest of big game would be proportionally better than a bullet designed for target practice.

We did tests on Sierra boat tails in 150 / 165 / 180 gr in 30 caliber / .308 and found that they were poor compared to a 150 gr Hornady PSP bullet.

The weight retention of the boat tail bullet was not consistent compared to a spire point bullet - because the spire point bullet held the lead better and retained more of it's weight. Where as a lot of the Boat tail bullets fell apart when it struck a hard object - such as bone / trees / twigs etc...

Ballistic Tip Bullets should NOT be used for hunting purposes.

That part at the begining.. the JMO... I agree with that part. But the rest.... well.... not so much.

If the tip of bullet, the plastic polymer, acctually melts away... totally away... then wouldn't the heat that could cause such a thing be enough to completely melt the lead core of the bullet. What sort of heat does it take to melt lead... 350 degrees... if that. At what temperature does plastic acctually melt and become molten? Isn't something around 900? Like... phosphorus temperatures? We are talking bullets, not shaped charges here.... and when it comes to penetration... a shaped charge tends to trump a bullet.... don't you think?

Me and stubble have had our respective opinions on ballistic tips in the past. And I still hold that the early models were little more than oversized varmint bullets... and guess what... they blew up on impact. Modern manufacturing has reinforced and tapered the jackets of bullets, causing controlled expansion, even at the high speeds produced by modern flat shooting, light bullets. Enter the bonded bullet... even more controlled expansion, designed to have the benefits of a high ballistic coefficent, with the accuracy of a ballistic tip and the expansion of one as well. All while retaining 70% of its mass and penetrating better than its un-bonded predacessor. All three, the thin jacketed varmint, modern ballistic tip, and the newer accu-bond/scirocco ballistic tips have their place. And that place is in the woods.

I don't know what sort of tests you ran rifleman, but I would like to see the data... and I'd really like to see how it stacks up to the other companies that test ballistic tip bullets... like oh say, Nosler, Swift, Hornady and now Barnes just to name a few.
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Old 12-02-2007, 12:00 AM
  #19  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips


ORIGINAL: The Rifleman

JMO

But an educated person a long time ago set me down and told me that Ballistic Tip Bullets are not intended for hunting.

Their main design was to be used for target practice only.

Most educated people would agree with me on this one.

The lead on the tip of the bullet, usually burns off while it travels through the air after it leaves the barrel.

Now the lead inside of the bullet is what is the greater part of the mass which makes up the main part of the weight of the bullet. The construction of the bullet - determines how much lead it can hold.

By knowing that, it would be determined that a bullet of the proper construction - made for the harvest of big game would be proportionally better than a bullet designed for target practice.

We did tests on Sierra boat tails in 150 / 165 / 180 gr in 30 caliber / .308 and found that they were poor compared to a 150 gr Hornady PSP bullet.

The weight retention of the boat tail bullet was not consistent compared to a spire point bullet - because the spire point bullet held the lead better and retained more of it's weight. Where as a lot of the Boat tail bullets fell apart when it struck a hard object - such as bone / trees / twigs etc...

Ballistic Tip Bullets should NOT be used for hunting purposes.

Classic example of the blind leading the blind[:'(]!

I am with stubblejumper, I have harvested to many animals with BT's to believe they aren't a hunting bullet.I mightadd a number of those animals were the larger subspecies we have here in canada, whitetails upwards of 300 lbs and mulies above 300lbs on the hoof are common. I can think of only one buck that I didn't get a passthruwhich wasan up closeflushdouble shoulder shot -shooter error. Never tracked a deer 100 yards with one yet, majority have been down on the spot orwithin sight. Always had vitals soup. I have never used a bullet that put the spins on our big body deer faster then a BT and thus it continues to my deer bullet.

JMO
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Old 12-02-2007, 08:34 AM
  #20  
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Default RE: The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

ORIGINAL: stubblejumper

If you are both using short mags that is the reason for no expansion. Remember you get what you ask for. A flat shooting bullet that is fast, oh wait I want expansion too!!! LOL
You can't be insinuating that the bullets were going too fast to expand?Does anyone still believe that myth?
That's not what I said. If the short mag BT bullets are shot in moderate distances (@75yds or less) and don't impact something like bone and hit only skin area(no ribs) They will expand very little if at all and will only leave small holes on both sides of a deer. There will also be very little trauma on the lungs as well. This is not myth as some may thing?If they had hit a shoulder it would have been a different story on the expansion and trauma sustained. But everyone has a title to their own opinion.
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