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The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

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The bad rap on Ballistic Tips

Old 02-25-2012, 09:30 AM
  #91  
Spike
 
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Default Nosler Ballistic Tips

I looked this thread up because I am somewhat new to reloading or to even hunting with a rifle (Only the past three years). I am not an expert, and I wanted to see what people were saying about the 7mm 150 grain NBT for elk. I have only shot one elk, and that was a cow with a 180 grain Gameking out of my .30-06 (H414 54.0 grains). I grew up in shotgun country in the east. And honestly...I saw both good and bad in terms of bullet performance from both 12 and 20 gauge shotgun slugs. I even once had a slug fail to penetrate a whitetail buck's shoulder at about 70 yards. I also had shots at both close and long(er) ranges that were total textbook. I guess my point is that it seems that even bullets made of pure lead can fail to do what we expect them to at times. Now that I live in Montana, I hunt with a rifle for big game. My experiences with the Nosler Ballistic tips in both .30-06 (165 NBT, 55.0 grains H414) and 7mm Rem. Mag (150 NBT 65.0 grains IMR 4831) on mulies and whitetails have been good at both close (75 yards) and at long (500 yards) ranges. Penetration was complete (pass through) on all shots. Shoulders got penetrated, and vitals were trashed. The close range shot was on a running mulie doe with the .30-06 and she was hit at an angle and both shoulders were penetrated. She dropped dead mid-stride. I have never seen a running animal just go down like a stone like that. Impressive. I got to watch the whole thing...my friend made that shot. So...long story short, it seems to me that this bullet works ok on game, but like anything else can fail to do what we expect it to do at times, and I am sure for a number of factors. I have to wonder if the bullets that "fail" are simply factory defects that we just can't detect. I think this could be true of any bullet. I think like anything else in hunting...anything can happen. Anyhow...that's my 2 cents.
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Old 02-25-2012, 09:42 AM
  #92  
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Oh one thing I forgot...I tend to try to only take shots behind the shoulder in the rib cage to take out the vitals. No matter what I hit a shoulder with....I lose a good shoulder roast! So...I think that a bullet that expands quickly can work well even for large animals like elk and moose as long as you place the bullet in the lungs.
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Old 02-25-2012, 01:12 PM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by The Rifleman
JMO

But an educated person a long time ago set me down and told me that Ballistic Tip Bullets are not intended for hunting.

Their main design was to be used for target practice only.

Most educated people would agree with me on this one.

The lead on the tip of the bullet, usually burns off while it travels through the air after it leaves the barrel.

Now the lead inside of the bullet is what is the greater part of the mass which makes up the main part of the weight of the bullet. The construction of the bullet - determines how much lead it can hold.

By knowing that, it would be determined that a bullet of the proper construction - made for the harvest of big game would be proportionally better than a bullet designed for target practice.

We did tests on Sierra boat tails in 150 / 165 / 180 gr in 30 caliber / .308 and found that they were poor compared to a 150 gr Hornady PSP bullet.

The weight retention of the boat tail bullet was not consistent compared to a spire point bullet - because the spire point bullet held the lead better and retained more of it's weight. Where as a lot of the Boat tail bullets fell apart when it struck a hard object - such as bone / trees / twigs etc...

Ballistic Tip Bullets should NOT be used for hunting purposes.

Really? Paleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! Between my brothers, father, uncle, grandfather, my daughter and I...we have collectively killed well over 300 deer in 10 different states in the past 3 decades with Nosler Ballistic Tip bullets...we have used them in many different calibers (.243, .270, .308, .300 WM, .300 Sav., 250-3000 Sav., 270 WSM, 7mm Mag, and the list goes on)...and rarely have had one run more than 20 yards when a well placed shot is made.

I am not sure who this "educated" person is you refer to but I am willing to bet they have a lot less bullet technology knowledge than Nosler engineers do...best do your homework.

I can say without a doubt that Nosler Ballistic Tips perform very well on deer and other thin skinned animals.

http://www.nosler.com/Bullets/Ballistic-Tip.aspx
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:21 PM
  #94  
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Would you consider a ballistic tip a hollow point with a filler? I don't use them, but I use Hornady factory ammo in my .223 for deer (Varmit round) and under 100 yards it works great, just about like a hollow point would.

Last edited by Gunplummer; 02-26-2012 at 08:23 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 02-29-2012, 04:42 AM
  #95  
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When the Hornady SST first came out it did have a light jacket and it did get a lot of bad results coming back into Hornady. Between the SST early results and the whole V-max thought pattern of most hunters it's going to be hard to convince any old time shooters to even try ballistic tips. Most of the ballistic tip bullets offer a higher BC over conventional lead nosed bullets. Then you move on to Interbond, Accubond, SST and Sirocco's those bullets jackets have been beefed up. While preforming better than they have ever before they still have a large capability of loosing 30% of their weight retention when hitting bone mass at high velocity's and close range. Saying that most bullets will suffer in that scenario. Heavy bone is heavy bone. In the early years I had my fair share of seeing bullets come apart even on the rib cage. They have become better constructed and bonded. There was a time I would of laughed at using a ballistic tip for big game but manufactures are making leaps and bounds in keeping bullets staying together on impact.

What i'm really curious about is the Berger VLD hunting bullets vs a standard Match bullet design and how they hold up against game? I'm sure they would have thickened the jacket of the bullet.
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Old 02-29-2012, 04:28 PM
  #96  
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Thanks for the great information Ridge. I kinda expected the turn out to be just what you said. I have not seen a cut section of any of their VLD bullets so wasn't sure if the were thicker or not. So they yellow box then for a cut barrel. Nice group BTW.

What's the velocity in your Gibbs with 140gr?
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Old 02-29-2012, 08:38 PM
  #97  
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This reminds me of the good old days. It was kind of cool to go back in time just a little. To bad it will probably never be the same around here.
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:51 AM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by Colorado Luckydog
This reminds me of the good old days. It was kind of cool to go back in time just a little. To bad it will probably never be the same around here.
I don't know that I'd go that far. I started using the Huntingnet.com forums back around 1997 or 1998, frankly, not much has changed. Maybe we'll hit a few hot topics from time to time, and there's a lot more talk about coyote hunting than there ever used to be over on the small game side, idiots come in from time to time, some get frustrated and leave (or get booted), some actually learn a little, knowledgable guys come in, a few stay, a few get frustrated with idiots and leave... Savages are still good rifles, some guys still hate Rem 700's... Some guys swear you need a 12ga to kill a badguy, others still swear you need a 9mm or .45acp...

Ultimately in 15yrs on the boards, I can't say there's a heck of a lot that's changed... There's ups and downs, ebbs and flows, just like any forum about any topic...
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Old 03-03-2012, 06:56 PM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by Nomercy448
Ultimately in 15yrs on the boards, I can't say there's a heck of a lot that's changed.
I guess there is still a little entertainment value here. Just like everything else you choose to argue about, you're wrong again. LMFAO!

If you don't know how much this place has changed, then you weren't here for the good times.
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Old 03-04-2012, 04:30 AM
  #100  
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Right RR I've been keeping up on all the new hype. Just haven't seen a lot on the Berger construction.
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