hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I always hear people's opinions about the 30-30. Some say that they wouldn't shoot over 100 yards with it, some say no more than 125 yards. Some say they have killed deer with it at 220 yards and would do it again if the shot was offered. And then there are some that claim that its not a powerfull enough round to even take deer with it.

Looking at ballistic charts of the 30-30. The trajectory and energyin footpounds, leads me to assume that the 30-30 can still be deadly for deer from 150 - 180 yards. I personally wouldn't hesitate to shoot at a deer 180 yards away if it was perfectly broadside and I had a good scope and a steady rest.

What do you guys think? How far would you shoot at a deer with a 30-30?
Just curious.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I have taken deer about 100 yards with it. as long as it hits that heart or youdon't hit high, the deer will die.

But even at 100 yards, there's not much damage in the deer, and very small blood trails. If I had a choice of shooting a deer at 30 yards with a bow, or 200 yards with a 30-30, I would pick the bow hands down every time.

I know some are saying thats not a fair comparison. I am 100% sure I can connect with both, and have alot with a bow. But for some reason, when I get both lungs with a bow, they don't go more than 80 yards and lay down. But I have seen way too many times a high lung shot with a 30-30, and they go for ever.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I think the general "rule of thumb" indicates you need 1000 lbs. of energy to cleanly kill a deer. At what yardage does the 30-30 fall below that figure? I guess that would be the number you're looking for..........

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

jusge for your self. Personally I wouldnt try more than 150yards. Only way i would attempt 200 would be on something worth the risk, but then if im goin after that im gonna take a bigger rifle =)

bullet drop with 150grain Winchest silver tips

50yard = +0.5" 2390(fps) 1902(ft.lbs.)
100yard = 0.0" 2018(fps) 1356(ft.lbs.)
150yard = -2.6"
200yard = -7.7" 1684(fps) 944(ft.lbs.)
250yard = -16"
300yard = -27.9" 1398(fps) 651(ft.lbs.)


You can go to remington/winchester or any major ammo munufactor and get bullet drops for factory loads. then go the the range and try it out. I had just finished the search on my 300wsm, 223, and 30-30 like a hour ago and printed it out so it was easy for me to get you the info you need.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I always use the 170 grain Flat point. If you hit the vitals at 200 yards, they are not going to go far. With the new lever action ballistic tips, that will increase to 300 yards.

As the 30-30 has a rainbow type trajectory, you have to put some time in shooting it a 200 yards if you expect to get good vital hits. However if you put in the time, the 30-30 will deliever the meat to the table.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

All of you guys bring up very good points in my opinion....and I also have thought the same things.

This is one of the reasons that makes me wonder why people will take very long shots with yet another famous 30 caliber ( 300 win mag)

In other words, if a 30-30 has slightly less than enough energy to kill deer at 200 yards. It would seem that a 300 win mag would have far far less energy than what is needed to kill elk at 700 yards.

I just wonder if the guys that wont take 150 yard shots at deer with a 30-30would take 700 yard shots at an elk with their 300 win mags ?

Alot of hunters that I know personally always nock the 30-30 and 30-06. I wonder why some people think that their magnums are limitless to the distance that they can take game at. (I know one guy that claims he would shoot a deer at 1.5 miles away with his 7mm ultra mag.) In my opinion he is stupid thinking that there would be enough energy left to even kill a deer at 1.5 miles away.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

You got that right. Those shots are even tough to pull off on the internet.:DThats what? 2640 yards.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I won't shoot pass 150 yds with my 30-30.Not because of the energy factor but because my 30-30 is equiped with a williams peep sight.I can hit a milk jug everytime out to that range.After that the bead covers to much of the target. If I used a scope I would shoot out to 200 yds.
Now that everbody has stated their opinion, how far has everbody shot a deer with the 30-30.My farest was 80yds.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

300 wsm Winchester 150gr Ballistic silvertips big diff in ballistics

50Yards -0.3" 3300(fps) 3628(Ft.lbs)
100yards 0" 3061(fps) 3121(Ft.lbs)
150yards -0.6"
200yards -2.2" 2834(fps) 2676(Ft.lbs)
250yards -4.9"
300yards -8.8" 2619(fps) 2285(Ft.lbs)
400yards -15.9" 2414(fps) 1941(Ft.lbs)
500yards -32.4" 2218(fps) 1638(Ft.lbs)

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I never ever heard of someone I know shooting big game at 700 yards. With a 300win or not.

The guys claiming 1.5 miles is full of it. I think 1000 yard benchrest record is like 10" circle 10 shots from a 300RUM on a very, very solid rest.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

last deer season i shot a 6 pointer at 154 yards with my30-30 and the buck ran no more than 30 yards.he was standing broad side to. My uncle claims to have shot 2 deer with his 30-30 at 416 steps. he stepped it out to the deer.i say claim because i was not with him but he has not been known to blow smoke up your a**.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Shonuff, I understand the ballistics are very different between the 30-30 and the 300 win mag. I have about 65 million gazillion ballistic charts.

But would you agree that at 700 yards the 300 win mag would barely have enough energy to kill an elk?
Yet I have heard guys claim that they have shot elk at almost 800 yards with with 270, 280, 30-06, 300 win mag. All I was saying is , that to me , these stories seem a bit far fetched.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I don't know who came up with the 1000 foot pounds of energy required to kill a deer with a bullet but they are full of it. Deer are not exactly hard to kill. 400 foot pounds or so of KE is all that is needed. I am not talking about shooting it in the eye ball or anything stupid like that. Just a regular ole shot through the boiler room with a regular ole bullet.

Provided the shooter is good enough the 30-30 can easily take deer cleanly with a single shot out beyond 300 yards. If sighted in properly to take advantage of the size of a deers lungs, not what the ballistic charts show with a 100 yard zero, a 150 grain bullet will only be about 7 or 8 inches low at 250 yards and only about 17 or 18 inches low at 300 yards and has plenty enough energy to kill deer sized animals.


BC, The world record 1000 yard smallest group is a 4.2278 inch, 10 shot group, with a 6mmBR. But 2640 yards? I only in a dream and he'd still probably miss.;)[&:]

The longest shot I personally know of anyone taking on an animal was my father some years ago. A big ole cow elk at just over 400 yards with a 7mm Rem mag.


Buckstalker, THe 300 Win mag has what it takes to kill elk to 700 yards. However I strongly question that the person behind the trigger has what it takes to pull it off. There are people that can do it and do it on a regular basis. However, they are not using factory rifles or factory ammunition and they put in many many hours of range time to be good enough to do it.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Those are still some very far shots and not to mention, good sized groups besides.

I really don't think that I would ever take shots at those distances at live game. But thats just me.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

1000 foot pounds of energy for whitetail is a bit over for the deer around here. I've killed them with a lot less!
My farthest kill with a 94 Winchester and a .30/30 is 135 yards. Broke both front shoulders and he dropped right there. That was with factory irons. I'd be comfortable out to 150 yards or a bit more with a good aperature rear sight. If I was using a bolt or single shot rifle with a scope, I would be confident at 200 or a bit more.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I have often wondered want people would say about the old 30-30 if it wre in a bolt rifle with a full lenght barrel and some good lead.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I had the Savage O/U with a 30-30 barrel. It would put three shots in an inch group with 125 grain Nosler Ballistic tips. I have a 30-30 Single shot in the NEF rifle which shoots real well with Nosler Ballistic tips in 125 or 150. No need for round or flat nose bullets in a single shot. This was a unlikely gun to shoot that well but it was a tack driver if I dare say so.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Did you notice much differnce in the ballistics ? I have a NEF .243 bull that shoots real well. My 14 year olddaughter can shoot an 1 in. group at 50 yards and does not even get a cheek well on the stock. Back to the 30-30 I witnessed a 172 in. buck get shot open sights at or about 100 yards and dropped like his life fell out of him. Very impressed with that and guy didnt even mount it what a waste of a great buck. He has several antlers lying in his shop around 150.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

totally, i was just compairing the 30-30 to the 300wsm. I would personally never take a shot with ANY rifle over MAYBE 400yards if i had to. Realy more like 300. Comfortable killing anything where it stands at 200-250.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

My brother has a 30-30 he bought back in the mid 70's. He has killed well over a hundred white-tail deer with it. But he know the limits of the rifle. He can effectively kill with it out to 125 yards. I have killed lot's of deer with this same rifle but never past 125 yards.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I know people who have killed grizzly bears, moose,and elk with factory-loaded .30/30 ammo.

I would take shots with it up to at least 200 yards, if I had the right sights on a .30/30, and a good shot was presented. With me, the limiting factorin .30/30 shooting would be the pretty awful open sights that one usually finds on them. Not the performance of the cartridge.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

It is true that many "experts" say you need 1000 ft/lb to kill a deer, and now some have raised this figure to 1200 ft/lb. Basically, this is very poor advice, because it does not take into account bullet construction, impact velocity,bullet diameter, nor shot placement. For example, a .500" diameterround ball from a muzzleloader will kill deer pretty effectively at 100 yards, at which range it only delivers around 450 to 500ft/lb. Of course, to accomplish this, it has to hit in the right spot, BUT THAT IS TRUE OF ANY BULLET, REGARDLESS OF THE NUMBER OF FT/LB IT IS CARRYING WHEN IT HITS! A near-miss with a 600 Nitro will not kill a deer any better than a near-miuss with a .22 short!

If the "experts" were to describe the type of bullet which needs 1000 ft/lb to kill a deer in terms of construction,weight, diameter, and the impact velocity range needed, then the idea of specifying the number of foot-pounds the bullet must have to kill a deer, or whatever, then the concept would be a lot more valid! For example "to produce clean kills on deer, 1000ft/lb of impact energy is required for bullets between .243" and .323" diameter of cup and draw, softpoint construction, that srike the deer at between the velocities of 2000 and 2900 FPS." Now, this kind of a statement might be more valid-perhaps!!

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I believe ray1301 hit the nail on the head. "Know your limits." I killed several deer with a 30/30 this past season, and they were all while hunting in the woods where shots would be under 100 yards. I also killed a couple of deer and hogs with my 300 WSM, but I didn't take my 30/30 where I knew a 300+ yard shot might present itself. The key is knowing your limits as a shooter, and the effective ranges of the weapons that you take afield.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

let's see.... A .30/30 delivers 944 ft/lb of energy at 200 yards, so it is 56 ft/lb shy of being able to kill a deer at that distance.... But, if we could increase its velocity at 200 yards by 10 fps and thereby give it 1001 ft/lb at that range, then it would kill the deer..... RIGHT!!

Actually, 300 magnum provides a .30-caliber bullet with perhaps a 50 - 100 yard range advantage over the .30/'06, depending on how high the respecive bullets' B.C.'s happen to be. It is even possible for the '06 to deliver MORE energy at extreme ranges than the magnum, if the '06 is usinga better bullet, even if it is launching said bullet at a couple of hundred fps less to start with.

The possession of a magnum chambering does not make one a long-range marksman capable of cleanly killing an elk at 700 yards... Only constant practice at such ranges allow this kind of shooting, regardless of the caliber of the weapon being used!

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Well, the Savage 340 was available in .30/30 as well as .22 Hornet and .222 Remington. In addition, Winchester used to make a Modle 54 in .30/30, and that was a pretty strong rifle in which pointed bullets could be used.....

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

The Savage and Stevens boltguns wererwhat I had in mind when I mentioned bolt action .30/30s. Most people I know who have one aren't inerested in selling it! I know Winchester built 54s in .30/30, and planned to produce it in the model 70 as well, but dropped the idea. I've never seen a model 54 in .30/30 myself, and don't know how many were made.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

The Remington 788 was also chambered in 30-30. I had a Savage pump 30-30 but if I recall correctly it still had a tubular magazine. The 788 had a clip. I never had one of those in 30-30 but I saw some. They also chambered in in 44 Mag.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

My 30-30 has killed many deer but I have never tried to use it out past 110 yds or so. Open sights so that is about my limit. The cool thing about it is that the POI (with my '94) is the same at 100 yds. for 150gr or 170gr so I don't have to worry about re-sighting the rifle in if I'm going to change loads.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

What yawl think about hornadays new 30-30 bullets.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Now take it out of that 18 in. barrel, Put it in a 22 in or 24 in I would bet it would be alot more talked about. No I dont own a 30-30 but It has been here for along time so something is right about it. I can imagine that back in the day having a 30-30 and a 45/70 you probably felt like you had it all.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Marlin has a new rifle out to take advantage of the new ammo. I believe it has a 24 inch barrel.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

I'll never understand why Marlin did this.....why we would give up the only reason to own a 30-30 in the first place. That is to hunt with a short, light, fast repeating deer rifle.

There's several very short light and accurate shooting options available that add at least a hundred yards to the range of the 30-30.

.308, 7-08, 260, 243, and a dozen more. All available in carbines that put first shot placement over fast follow up shots. An option that has bought the bolt action rifle to it's position as King of the hunting rifles.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

Good question Vapo. I would guess that there are just a lot of 30-30 and lever action fans out there.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

A lot of people knock the 30-30 and think that it is good for nothing but whitetails, but my grandfather took his elk hunting and killed the biggest bull in the group. Everybody was telling him he needed to buy a nre rifle before he went but he said he knew how his shot and was comfortable with it. He shot his bull 200 yards from camp at about 75 yards away. I missed the biggest deer I ever seen in my life because I borrowed a friends gun instead of using my Marlin lever action. The deer was 75 yards away walkig off slowly but when I tried to chamber a round in the gun the gun jammed and by the time I got it unjammed the deer was gone. If I would of taken my rifle it would of been an easy shot.

RE: hearing mixed fealings about the 30-30
 

No elk in Fl,but my longest whitetail shot has been 100 yards.