bigcountry

I myself am not a fan of shooting a second deer without finding the first one. No matter longbow or compound. I am thinking more of one in the AM, and one in the PM.

No biggie on the tail. Just if you come across one. broke my heart to hear that one guy just threw that large tail away. That was a beauty. Never saw a beaver that large. I appreciate your help.

See, my argument is different than most. My thought is why should gun hunters not be able to hunt in the regular archery season. I know I would still be an archer. It works well for places I have hunted like Newfoundland where you have a "moose" season, not just gun moose, or arrow-gun moose, etc.

ezmoover

Nonsense.

A low post count does not define "troll". It is the quality of the posts that matters.

You have broken no less than half a dozen well defined forum rules in this thread over the last 24 hours.

*** Apparently, someone can have thousands of posts in a forum and still behave like a "troll" ***

Now, turn off your computer and review those Bible verses that you seem to enjoy pontificating without understanding...

Pydpiper

No offence taken, I have seen this mindset many times.
First thing I need to address is that I do not in any way think gun hunters are dangerous, but this is a perfect example of what I am attempting to relate to you. It appears you are determined to seek out the worst in your fellow hunters, and I am going to make an attempt at explaining "the mind of an arrow-gun shooter". Before I continue, I need you to know that I do indeed hunt with a crossbow, I also hunt with a compound and as of the last couple years I have been shooting a recurve in hopes of getting good enough with it to pursue game.
You made reference to me saying that gun hunters are unsafe, I will use this to set precedence as to how I am beginning to understand how you think. If you look back you will see that I specifically used the words "where I hunt", I chose those words because it is all I know, here, where I live the hunting parcels are small, a guy with a gun on one side of a 2 acre bush and a bowhunter hidden in a tree on the other has potential to be unsafe. It is becoming apparent that you are going to try to put words in my mouth, but so it is clear right now, I will not let that happen. I do not think gun hunters are unsafe, clear?
Now back to the bows.
I am probably about to show some of my lack of experience here, but I have never heard the term "selfbow", I have spent years reading about bows and bow hunting on forums, in books and I am a bit disappointed in myself for not understanding what you feel is appropriate terminology. When I got to the term "arrow-gun" I figured this thread just may have something new to teach me, unfortunately I was incorrect.
It seems that most people of your prejudice feel that a new crossbow hunter in the woods is going to alter your hunt, be it by reducing numbers or what ever the complaint of the day happens to be. You then mention swapping bows with another person to prove your point, and if you are offering up a long bow or recurve than I would absolutely agree with you, the difficulty level of using one of those bows is significantly harder than using a crossbow. If it is about a compound, then I wholeheartedly disagree. Seeing how you decided to use a doe as a target for your "challenge" opposed to paper then I can only assume that you hunt. What separates you from a gun hunter when you are in the woods? It is range, it is your ability to get "arrow close" to a deer that makes you a bow hunter. So what if every guy in the world can pick up a crossbow and shoot it with enough skill to kill a deer? If a moron can pick up a crossbow that doesn't automatically give him a magical ability to get 20 yards from a deer, does that make sense? Idiots come in all flavors, and I assure you, I have met my share who carry crossbows, but I have met the same amount who carry vertical bows in to the field too. The only people who will succeed at being a "bowhunter" are those with hunting skills, and if you have those skills the tool in your hand is not important.
I am saying that crossbows will have no influential impact on deer herds, only a skilled bowhunter can do that, a skilled bowhunter can harvest a deer with what ever tool he chooses.
If you want a real good look in to the mind of a crossbow hunter, just look in the mirror, you have it in you, but first you will have to step back and look at the facts, put your prejudices aside and understand, if even for a single moment that a crossbow is not a magic tool that kills deer all on it's own, there has to be a man behind that bow, and I assure you, if that man is successful he is indeed a bowhunter.

One more quick peek in to the mind of an arrow-gun guy..
There will be a time when I am proficient enough to take my recurve in to the woods to harvest a deer, when that time comes I will never turn my back on other hunters. I think you will find that with most hunters of every discipline. Our sport of hunting will always be polluted with people who think that what they do is best, and if we ever do see a collapse it will be at our own hands, your post is a perfect example of why, it is derogotory to hunters as well as their ability to choose.
Your profile says you are an engineer, if that is the case than I really don't need to explain to you why a "gun" is comprised of more than just a trigger. My compound has a trigger too.
Most importantly, I do understand that an arrow is just an arrow.

If you are trolling for an argument then I am out, but if you are serious about understanding what the heart of a bowhunter sounds like then keep the questions coming. And please, spare the "I think they just need their own season" for someone who doesn't know better.

bigcountry

Somebody mentioned that gun hunters are too dangerous to hunt with arrow-guns shooters. I can't remember who, and really can't take the time go back and find who they were. As an experienced hunter of all types, I can assure you gun hunters would be fine hunting with arrow-gun shooters.

I just think it would appropiate for gun hunters not to be at such a disadvantage as others. Nobody has of course addressed this.

Then we could all hunt with weapons of choice and no whining or complaining.

A selfbow is a bow comprised of all wooden one peice construction from a "stave". It differs from a laminated longbow as its all one piece of wood. Where a laminated bow could be comprised of fiberglass, sinew, horn, and wood core, or whatever core. Just a quick FYI.

You are correct, a gun is more than a trigger. Its a stock, trigger, can be scopes, reddots even, can be shot without having to draw it or cycle a bolt right when the animal is present. A gun.

bigcountry

We are just having a converstion here ez. You can choose to act like an adult like pydpiper here or like a child. Its your choice.

Why should gun hunters be kept to a different season than archers?

Lanse couche couche

BC,

My comments were not intended to go into ethical gray areas, but were intended to illustrate the relative ease with which one could shoot two deer in one spot with a vertical bow vs. a crossbow to demonstrate that the crossbow does not always necessarily have advantages over the vertical bow. If one gets into wacky anti-vertical bow logic it could be argued that a vertical bow is an unfair disadvantage since it allows people to take second shots which may not be a good thing in some instances such as needing to track two wounded deer.

I also have the heretical opinion that there should simply be one big long season where people can use whatever is weapon is legal to take their deer. But that is coming from the perspective of hunting in an area where deer have reached nuisance levels and I would like to see the local herd reduced by half.

Will know about the tail in aobut three hours.

bigcountry

I think you and I are in complete agreement here.

Pydpiper

Lets not forget the sonic boom that indicates a bullet is leaving the "gun" at several thousand feet per second, the projectile is designed to create damage in a very different way then an arrowhead.
I have seen vertical bows with triggers, scopes, red-dots and even without having to be drawn in the presence of game. I still don't put them in the same class as a firearm?
However, the term arrow gun is growing on me.

ezmoover

Oh stop it. Your disingenuous hyperbole just doesn't fly.

YOU initiated the childish name calling tactics.

YOU are a hypocrite on so many levels that it's obscene.

StoredEnergy

To be honest I don't understand your blanket statement but I can pick up that you are not willing to engage in any form of useful discourse.

That being said you are a credit to your zealotry.