Legalizing Crossbows
 

Here in Wisconsin they want to legalize crossbows in the future for everyone. Right now it is just disabled people and they want good heathly people using a form of cheating method. Correct me if i am wrong but you can shoot a crossbow 100 yards if you want to accurtly. If this passes in the future, then what are the disabled going to be able to do next, shoot with a shotgun or rifle during bow season. One thing leads to the next and then boom its out of control. Tell me what you think

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

Look a few posts down to find some penial sword fighting about crossbows. I'm sure that if you look hard enough....there is some good info on about every 3rd to 4th page of posts.

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

Okay, I will :D

Are guys in Arkansas and Ohio and Georgia "cheating" ? To cheat one must break the rules - so your pot shot at handicap people makes you look retarded.

Okay, I'll correct you. Crossbows are no more able to do that than compounds or recurves. In fact, all the top 3D scores are shot with compounds. Maybe they're the ones "cheating" ?

Why would they allow guns in archery season ? Archery season are for bows - you know, two limbs, a string .... launching an arrow .....

Well, I think the only thing you posted that makes sense. One thing has led to another and compounds weasled their way into archery season and the Pandora's box of archery has opened - except you LIKE what comes out of it in the way of compounds, don't you ?

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

If you are going to fight this, then I suggest you get your facts straight. Crossbows are no more powerfull than a compound. They have a much higher draw weight, but a much shorter draw cycle, these two cancel each other out and you get roughly the same performance from a compound as a crossbow, roughly the same speeds and roughly the same "effective distance".

If you decide to fight against this, do not use performance as your reasoning.

--Bob

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And don't pay any attention to the drivel written about crossbows by the PBS anti crossbow committee. Practically every bit of it is worthless. There are enough differences in method of operation to rely on and keep them out of bow season.

There'd be a much wider cushion to work with if it weren't for extremely high letoff bows and mechanical releases.

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I agree with crossbows 100%.............................When you are only allowed to cock them when the deer is watching.

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Gentle men and use this veerryyy losely. There is nothing wrong with crossbows and you no it, you have no mind of your own ,so you listen to others B/S. The majority of you never even held a xbow let alone shoot one, they are not the magic bullet you think they are. I've hunted with a bow for almost 45 yrs, when you guys were just a dream in your daddys family jewels. But some shoulder problems have me looking to another way to hunt I won't quit I love the sport and the time I spend in woods,with friends,and family. If we quit fighting our selves PETA would not have a chance. Good Hunting And Fishing Rich

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RWK, I am am person who makes their own judgements and does not rely on others to make my own opinions. Using crossbows when health does not permit the use of regular archery gear is a whole issue in itself. One of which I AGREE with. To say that using a cross bow during archery(by a healthy hunter) is the same thing, in my opinion is false. I hunt mainly elk. The hardest issue that any archer hunting elk deals with is getting the bow back on a bull that is trying to pin point you when he comes in to your calling. I could take a great deal more elk if I were using a cross bow. It does not have anything to do with distance or accuracy as my shots are generally 10 to 15 yards. It has to do with the fact that it is already pre loaded. I am sure that this thread will take on a life of its own as this is always a hot topic. I am sorry that you are so quick to pass judgement on people that you don't even know or understand. God bless!!

By the way, there is no use in quoting me or dragging me into a 30 page debate, I have said my feelings on the issue and now I am done with it.....................Have a great day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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wihunter, now youv'e gone and done it. You opened the can of worms that database has been living in. [:'(]

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RWK, you fall into the trap of "any argument is bad for hunting", wrong. Folks can have opinions and can state them and NOT be following the crowd. There are things in hunting that should be debated: fences, baiting, equipment all come to mind. Both sides in this debate tend to be close minded. For the crossbow supporters to say the other sides OPINION about a crossbow not being a bow is "wrong" well that is wrong. Its an opinion, it can be no more wrong than the flip side.

--Bob

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i would agree with crossbows if you can pull them back when you see a deer, but how does the game wardens know you did this? I think only two people should be able to use crossbows, the handicap that cannot pull back a bow and the senior citizens that enjoy hunting. What fun is it to be in the woods having a already cocked crossbow and a nice buck walks in front of you. Its not all you do is aim and fire with the crossbow, at least with the other kinds you have to pull back when they are in sight and become a little bit of buck fever, now that is always fun

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I am only stating my opinion that I believe should be the right way to hunt

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I agree with xbow only for youth under 14 that cannot draw 45-50lbs, disabled or seniors. My grandfather hunts with a xbow. Part of the thrill of bow hunting is the challenge of getting drawn and making the shot undetected. I was busted 2 times this year trying to draw. And missed one time after having to hold for about 5 mins because a deer stopped behind a tree and I could not let down undetected. With a xbow I would have been able to get a good shot on all 3 deer. I did kill 2 with a bow this year. I believe that legalizing xbow is just going to get lazy hunters in the woods that would only rifle hunt because the lack the discipline to set up and learn to shoot a long/compound bow.

Just my 2 cents.

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Well datamax has pretty well summed it up. Thanks Data:D

In NH they are legal durring firearm season. My feeling have changed quite a bit about crossbows. When I was younger I was against them. Now I realize they are hunters as well as management tools and I support them. I'm not going to lobby for them to be added to bow season where I hunt but I wouldn't dream of fighting it should the legislation come up.

Bottom line is what ever the fish and game biologist feel is best to maintain a healthy herd is just fine with me. I don't feel that guys with crossbows will effect my hunting anymore then a guy on the next property who out there with his compound. With primative weapons you have to get close. 100 yards is a good dream for an effective range but I don't give more then 50 yards as an ethical shot(IMO). Sure some will push the limits but people do with every other weapon so what's the diffrence? If you're worried about more hunters in the woods killing more deer, join peta:eek:. Fish and game knows what population levels need to be obtained to have a healthy herd and if they choose to allow crossbows durring bow season to achieve it, then more power to crossbow hunters.

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100 yard range from a crossbow? hell i'm lucky to shoot my 12ga that far . i get around 40 to 45 acuratley at a target !!!! at a deer the same as a bow around 30 yrds from a stand is plenty for me. if you have a crossbow with 100 yrd range let me knwo what brand it is. i want one today

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That right there sums it up PERFECTLY. F&G biologists should be the deciding factor. If the herd needs more reduction, as in some places, then F&G should evaluate the options availalbe from increased seasons, increased bag limits and ways to increase hunter participation via any and all methods including add/removing weapons available.

If the herd needs more protection, again, same decision process: reduced bag/seasons, and do NOT add more weapons to raise hunter participation cause this would be counter to the goal of reducing deer kill.

Part of the problem is the politics of hunting seasons.

--Bob

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Elkcrazy8 - I don't agree with much of what you said on elk hunting and I've been pretty successful at it. Carrying a 10 pound crossbow in elk county would be EASIER for you ? Drawing is the hardest part ? Dude, finding an elk is the hardest part, getting him to respond to your calling is the hardest part. Drawing on one with a compound ? Easy, easier than any animal I've hunted. Try a recurve if you want HARD.

Using the same argument compounders use ......... I use a recurve and I think compounds are ridiculously easy, they can be drawn when the game is NOT in their presence, the >80% letoff, triggers, horizontal limb technolog, the incredible speed and accuracy ......... damn things shouldn't be allowed in archery season.

Same argument compounders use against crossbows I'll use againt compounds and it'll be every bit as valid, won't it ?

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

datamax.....

Here's how I see it. You have far too much time on your hands and nothing better to do other than to run this silly little xbow thing right into the frickin ground. And believe me, it's getting very old. I'm sure your going to give me the old...."If you don't want to read it, don't click on the thread". Well I haven't looked at your other BS 30 some page thread because it's the same old regional board crap. Keep spewing information until your blue in the face and then keep on it some more. But you've found another thread to jump on to give your "view" on, so I had to comment. Don't worry, your not the only person on this board of whom I have that same opinion of...but no reason to bring their names into this. My login name is new, but I've been around the site for a long time.

You don't shoot an xbow during any season nor will you anytime soon from what I've read initially in the other thread. Your a trad "woodsman" ;). You've found technology to be boring and apparently so very easy you gave it up. Your just debating to debate. So why are you even debating the xbow thing? What possible cause do you have with this? And like elk, I'm not going to get into a long debate over this because I actually have a job and have work to do, but I would like to know answers to those 2 questions.

Thanks,
Xtec

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Actually Bob, I think this statement summs it up perfectly. Unfortunately[:@] Just be happy you don't live in PA:D (sorry couldn't resist, if you don't get it see the Northeast forum)

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I know a few people that hunt with them. My GF's grandfather has a torn rotater cuff and hunts with one. He is a hell of a hunter, probably better than me, and doesn't kill as many deer with his as I do. I honestly don't think they are a big enough advantage to get all worked up over. His is accurate to about 35-40 yards, and is pretty much limited to the same distance I am.

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Datamax, first of all DUDE. Finding elk and calling them is acctually easier than you think. Usually when a bull comes in he is charging for all he is worth. Alot of times the elk is in your lap before you know it. That is why I said that drawing is the hardest part(timing). I have never taken a bull over 20 yards and most are under 10. If the bull is barreling down on you and you draw just when he decides to stop and take a look around. He could leave you sitting at full draw. I too have taken many bulls and was just sharing my experience. if you say the right things to them they can't help but come in to investigate, and it is usually fast. As far as crossbows. No comment.

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

Welcome to the club. I invented multiple usernames. :D

Correct. If I find trad too tough I'll go back to a compound. I think I'm a better hunter with a compound than a crossbow

Good question. The answer ? because the belief that crossbows are bad is false. The belief that they don't belong in archery season is ridiculous. I've proven it by showing that NEVER have they proved a negative in AR, OH, GA or other states. I'm the type that loves to know WHY - and this crossbow thing is one of the ones that pops up that everyone hates the though of them being legalized in archery season, but no one can really say WHY. Its like the P&Y club and PBS has said it so much that people just believe it without even thinking WHY.

I was there, I hated crossbows at one time and bad mouthed them. I was wrong. Crossbow don't hurt my season one bit, nor anyones in OH nor anyone in GA nor anyones in any other state where they might be legal.

Crossbows in legal archery season stirs things up, it makes a person think WHY they believe in something. I've come full circle. Arthur P and I have very similar ideas on where archery is going, and where its come from. He's of a different view in that go ahead and allow all the archery steroids that people have used but allow no more. I say if we're going to allow all the steroids that been in use, might as well ALL the steroids. Same thing, different package, and all the results are about the same too.

I don't think, I know.

Rarely do bulls come charging in. Most often they'll answer you and if you're sounding good enough they'll come plodding in and start locking up at about 40-50 yards looking for visible proof of what they're hearing. I've had a couple of bulls come in fast - very few.

I almost always hear them long before they get to me. Elk are very noicy especially if they're bugling coming in. I've only drawn on maybe 2-3 bulls in full view - the rest all had their heads behind trees, coming in etc etc and the ones I had to draw on close range ? I drew before they come in and just couldn't get the right shot. Compounds are vastly better in hunting conditions because of the ability to draw and hold. VASTLY

Most are under 10 yards ? Are you trying to grope them before you shoot ? Most of mine are probably 20 yards shots .... 30 yards maybe the most. 6 yards was the closest.

Everyone has a differnt "way" to elk hunt



DUDE ;)

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

Adams, I do visit there for a week every October, does that count> :) Love the place even though we don't see nearly the amount of deer we did several years ago, still see more than in NH!

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Another reason why I'll steer far from posts created by you is because you say that your ideas and thoughts parallel those of Arthur P. :( Enough said. Have a good day.

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

Xtec - would you liek to compare these two bows ?





We can talk about which is more accurate, which is easier to use, which has letoff, which is used with a triggered release, which has sights, which can group at 50 yards, which brings in less dedicated hunters .......... you know, we'll talk about the same things compounders talk about concerning crossbows.

Cool ?

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

Good point.

This is my way of thinking about crossbows.....I cannot find a single reason WHY they would be detrimental if allowed to be used during the archery season.

I for one do not buy in to the "lazy hunter" syndrome some of you seem to group all those who do not use a bow in. I also use a gun for hunting and I find it just as fun and challenging as my bow at times. You mean to tell me that none of you so called "hunters" ever use a firearm of any sort? if you did then are you also a "lazy" slob wanabe hunter too? if you don't then please don't call yourself a "hunter" because MY definition of a true hunter is a person who hunts all types of game with ALL types of weapons.

I hunt anything from prairie dogs to coyote to bear to elk to pronghorns to deer to pheasant to quail to rabbit to grouse to ducks to turkey and the list goes on and I have used many many different types or weapons to do so.

I said it before and I will say it again some of you (and you know who you are) need to drop this elitist attitude about bow hunting and start really HUNTING!

There is NOTHING wrong with a crossbow, it's just another weapon to choose from and if it's legal in your state why don't you give it a try?

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

BigJ12 - exactly

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

I would also like to say this.

If all you do is just hunt deer with a bow that's also fine. My statement in my last post was aimed at those high and mighty who think that the world revolves around bow hunting and that other methods are for the "Lazy" and the unskilled and all that other crap.

I think this is the crux of the problem. Some of you actually believe your own garble that if you don't use a bow then you might as well shoot yourself in the head because you're useless and can't hunt. And it is my contention that this is the problem that some of you have toward crossbows. To me it seem like the mere thought of crossbows being legal AND allowed in the same archery season somehow belittles your ability with a compound bow. It seems like the infultration of crossbows in your sacred sport somehow muddies your pure hunting waters.

Some of you have been very hard on datamax but to me, becides making his point I can't recall him belittling others for using anything other than a longbow or recurve. Because (and I know most of you can't stand the thought) they are harder to use and take more skill than a compound. and for that I commend him. He and others who shoot trad. could easily use the same argument about compounds as you all do about crossbows.

Remember there was a time when compounds were the odd bow out and had to be allowed into the fold!

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

most of you guys are to young to remember. but the compounds were built for the guys that could not hit jack with a straight or recurve bow. i have got many deer with a recurve and no sights. so i still think the the compounds should have their own season and it should not be in the regular season. to me there is no differance between the compound with it's let-off, using sights and guys using releases than the crossbow and it's trigger. so if you are going to use a compund you may as well be using a crossbow.

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TELL US YOUR REAL SCREEN NAME THERE ALIAS

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That should be fighting words !!

BigJ12 - Heres the funny thing ........ and why people hate when I come onto these threads. I shoot traditional and I got no problems telling people that my choice of hunting weapon is by far more difficult than a their choice of a compound, or a muzzleloader or a rifle for that matter. It simply IS - and its my choice. So while I fully understand the CHOICES ...... where I differ is that I simply don't care that a compound is easy or that a crossbow is even easier.

Why ? Because neither of thos weapons have EVER had a negative impact on my hunting. Ever. So why WOULD I find is offensive for compounds and crossbows to be in archery season ? I wouldn't - but others do becuase of either a high and mighty attitude or for selfish reasons.

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perhaps the reason some people might take offense to your repeated argumentative posts in these more serious forums (unlike the political forum), is because you never seem to offer anything other than your opinion on why you are right and others are wrong. You never appear when there is a technical question or a how-to question from a newbie or to offer any kind of positive advice.....only to argue your own perceptions of how things SHOULD be according to you.

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it does not really make any differance to me what anyone is using to hunt with the deer will be just as dead in the end. i am just saying that if you are going to use a compound in bow season than you may as well use your model 700 remington in the black powder season. the crossbow is no worst that the compound.

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Your compounds got a stock?

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Datamax....

I'm not going to sit here and get into this little pissing match with you. Do you think I'm a fool and have never been around any bows(compound-single or dual cam, recurve, long bow, homemade stick bow or xbow) in my lifetime and have not shot any one of those weapons??? Come on now. You like debate...plain and simple. And it also doesn't take me long to realize that you honestly feel that you are more of a man/hunter(ala Arthur P) than most because you "choose" as you say, to shoot trad. Everything else is just too easy for you. You may not think it, but you certainly portray yourself as one.

I want you to answer one VERY SIMPLE question for me and you can leave out all of the fluff that you so delicately put in every single one of your posts...

Out of these three weapons....which one is the easiest to shoot...takes the least amount of time to get good with....allows someone very minimal amount of movement in stand to shoot at an animal...and can be put down with the same type of movement if an animal hangs up just out of range? A long bow/recurve....a compound or an xbow??

As you say...you've shot them all so this should be a very easy question to answer. All I want is a one word answer.

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Who did you used to be?

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Data,

I know you shoot traditional and yes it is harder than a compound....by a long shot. I grew up on long bows It's all I shot until I was 13. Then I went to a recurve and I thought it was wonderful to have such a shelf to shoot off of. Both of them took me a while to learn and I still don't consider myself to be very good at it either. I then switched to a compound because I thought they were cool looking and guess what? It took me all of 1/2 hour to get good at shooting it. I'm not that old (just turned 40) but all I had was long bows as a kid.

I cringe everytime I hear some bow hunter talk about how hard it is to hunt with a bow and how easy it is with a firearm. To me it just shows how silly and uneducated in the ways of hunting some are. I'm sorry guys but sitting in a tree stand or gound blind right next to a deer path with your lanes picked out and yardage markers set is not hard.

Try walking all day and I mean ALL day from sun up to sun down for two pheasants. I know it's different and with dogs can be easy but where I am here in Illinois the pheasant population has suffered and you have to walk miles and miles for one bird. I'd rather sit in a tree anyday.

Before anybody starts posting I know some of you stalk deer and some have to climb mountians to reach your quarry and I take my hat off to you. I too hunted the rockies and it's a workout. But most of you just sit in a tree or a ground blind and wait like me!

Crossbows are not evil, just another form of bow. Yes it has a stock and is cocked but it's still a form of a bow.

I still haven't received any responce to my statement that just like the crossbow today, at one time the compound was the odd bow out had to be allowed into the bow hunting fold. If those hunters back then took the stance most of you are today it wouldn't be legal to shoot your compounds today now would it?

RE: Legalizing Crossbows
 

If you knew all the usernames I've posted under you might have a different revelation concerning that !

Actually I DO try to answer question on the trad board. Compounders can better answer compound questions that I. Go to www.Bowsite.com and go to the elk forum. I give lots of advice there. Tradgang.com I'm not as vocal on but read more because those boys know more than I do as far as trad hunting.

I know a lot about some things, and very little about many things. The crossbow is something I know more than almost anyone here about. I've owned them, shot them and I grew up in a state that has them in legal archery season. I have shot compounds for years and now shoot trad equipment - I KNOW the differences between them therefore I have a good opinion about the whole thing.

AS for other than my opinions ......... look at the stats and facts from states that allow crossbows.