RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

I'm sorry but you are wrong big time!

DNR from all of the states are constantly observing herd numbers and are constantly monitoring hunter compaints and disputes. If there was a problem with crossbow hunters in the woods the same time as the "bow hunters" then you would know it!

That is the worst excuse I have heard! I know that here in Illinois when you check your deer in you are asked several questions from what type of weapon you used to what other types of animals you saw to if you had any problems or disputes with any other hunters. What do you think they do with that information? wipe there asses with it? No it is used to help manage the herds and keep everything running smooth for hunters.

So for you to just dismiss and discount the states that do allow crossbows as a VALID source of determining if they (crossbows) could be allowed into the archery season of other states, shows your lack of understanding of how the DNR works and your complete contemptment towards crossbows for no other reason than ignorance and or selfishness.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

I never questioned that its fact that states dont allow crossbows, much like they use to didn't allow compounds, mechanical release, mechanical broadheads etc etc. Most are glad those rules were argued and changed though, huh ?

My opinion is based on facts that crossbows, where allowed, has made no negative impact.

True, P&Y Club HATE crossbows. Its like the anti-crossbow thing is their only objective in life anymore. But P&Y and B&C ........ they are the standard on which to gauge deer of different sizes. Remember when P&Y didn't allow compound kills ? Remember when P&Y didn't allow >65% letoff kills ??

Theres a lot more than 3

Well, I can say this with 100% facts backing me up. Not one time has the anti-crossbow zealots conducted any kind of "observational experiments" to prove crossbows evil, have they ? What we know is the G&F of the states allowing crossbows KNOW that they are a non-impact on the overall scheme of things as far as impacts on the deer herds. The G&F KNOW this, or they'd take actions.

Over harvest, too many bowhunters, shorters season ............ all factless fears that IF they were true we'd clearly see in states like AR, OH, GA and yes, even Canada.

Wouldn't we ?

Excellent. Arkansas has had them legal for 30 years. Never have we lost a single day of archery season because of crossbows. Never have our bowhunting numbers been so high as to ge the G&F to consider measuers to reduce archer numbers. Never have we lost bag limits because of bowhunter success rates. Never have crossbows been any more likely to be dangerous in the woods nor more likely to be used for poaching.

You can make phone calls, look up the stats ........... ask the people who actually live and hunt where crossbows are legal ............ everything point to having them in legal archery season as a non factor. It does not negatively affect archery in any way, it really doesn't.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

MAJay well put but, they will find a way to missunderstand it.

All of you want facts on negetives of a crossbow in the woods. I don't care if there in the woods or used for hunting. In there correct season would be nice! You ask questions like I do to my kids, with out no factual answer. Do you thing a states DNR office would publish somthing negetive towards there own beliefs, in this case Crossguns. That is why all you can do is ask for facts, and dismiss or reword what everyone is saying as a opinion. I kinda think it's funny, how you want somthing negetive for crossbows then you preach how we all need to stick together for the better of hunting. You think we are doing harm for hunting. Find a mirror, and you will find the harm.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Yes I do want facts, that is what was asked of me and is now what I'm asking for. I provided facts to show crossbows are not negative, why can't the other side show facts that they are? No instead they just dismiss my findings as non reliable. And why, because nothing has been published saying everything is fine? Do you think the states that have allowed crossbows in the archery season for years and years should publish a letter every year saying "Once again everybody got along, we are all happy and the herds are ok" Come on!

This is not all directed to you flat feet I am just venting.

I dont care either if crossbows are in the woods, but where I differ is that I don't care if they are allowed in the archery season either.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Bowhunting is an accomplishment, maintaining alot of selfpride is always a factor for me when I go to the woods. It is harder than 95% of other means of hunting. So when I take to the woods with my bow in hand, and can produce under pressure. I know that I am a Bowhunter, and an accomplished one at that. Know you want me to accept a shoulder fired weapon in the woods with me, during as season that was ment for Bows. For me it does not matter if it is a rifle, ML, shotgun, or even yes a crossbow. You still don't have to perform under pressure like a bow. I don't care if it's a longbow, recurve or a Compound. It is still a damn bow, and I use all three of mine through through year. With a crossbow you just don't have a since of accomplishment that you would with a bow as far as performing under pressure.

If your child wants to use a Crossbow than so be it. He is in the woods and it is awesome I welcome all to my state to hunt hogs with me, even if it is with a crossbow, but please dont set back and say they belong in the woods with a bow. Let your kids harvest a animal with a bow and tell me by the reaction on there face how much more they perfer a bow. This is my last entry, the grip of reality that you guys have on crossbows is funny It is awesome to get different opinions on subjects and I have learned allot. Thanks

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

I'm sorry if I am comming across wrong here, but I am to say the least pissed. Facts were asked for and provided. I cannot see a better fact than the states that have allowed crossbows into the archery season have had NO ILL EFFECTS from having them in their season. Some of you then go as far as to ask for To me that is grasping at straws because you were just proved wrong.

So if there is NOT a study published then it's not true? What kind of mentality is that? That is what case studies are for and again what better case study is there than a state that already allows them? So you then need to look into THAT state and see if there has been any adverse effects and as datamax provided there is none.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

More garbage![:o]

Again you guys prove to me that you know nothing about finding statistically significant and factual data that is completely reliable. Good Work!

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

Flat Feet, I could not agree more with you and if given the choice I would use my compound bow for the exact same reasons as you have listed. That being said please don't take this the wrong way but that is your and my opinion's and is not a valid reason not to allow crossbows into the season.

Thanks for the debate.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

BigJ wrote-
The reason is very simple BigJ, because a person is physically unable to utilize archery equipment it would eliminate the ability to hunt during this period of time. By allowing a crossbow to be used by the handicapped, you are allowing them to be in the woods when they otherwise wouldn't be. What it says about your state and mine which only allow handicapped people to use crossbows is not that crossbows are considered archery equipment, but the states are flexible in the rules allowing handicapped people access to all. They could have just as easily allowed handicapped the use of shotguns and or ML's during archery season, but instead they allowed crossbows .. a different weapon, that happens to be similar to archery equipment in range and type, but can be operated with a single hand allowing for use by the challenged. If it was considered "archery" it would be allowed by all to hunt with.

Here I think you are confused, because you are using the definition you found in an on-line dictionary to be the basis for your "legal definition" argument. I am using your state and mine's written Fish and Game Laws to define archery, I am also referencing any and all archery organizations I can find, and no where is the firing of a crossbow considered archery.

Guys, we have provided various negatives, some actual and some perceived. The thing about Pro's and Con's is they are different to the individual making the list. The smartest thing I have heard concerning crossbow use in the 3 states that allow them is that they have no specific records concerning their use as the kills made by them are just lumped as archery kills. There is no record I can find of how often they are used or if there is even a valid following. I happen to think they have had NO affect in the 3 states that allowed them during archery season. All 3 states have gobs of deer, and have long seasons, some allow many deer taken. That is not the case here in my state, and may be a reason why after lengthy review, the crossbow is only allowed during firearm season.

BigJ .. I'm not sure why you are getting frustrated with us.. it seems that 3 guys trying to wage a battle to change the definition of "archery" and open up longer crossbow hunting opportunities would understand what frustration is all about.

RE: please tell me just one negative to crossbows
 

BIGJ12,

I've made this point and I will make it again....

Just b/c a few old men smoke 3 packs a day, eat bacon and eggs for every meal and live to be 100 doesn't mean that everyone else should follow suit. Just b/c 3 states will let you hunt with an xbow does not mean that the same results will apply to all states.

I agree that an in-depth study by game biologists would have to be performed for me to change sides. The study would have to point out that there are no ill effects in MY state from legalizing xbows AND that it would be a beneficial management tool. Otherwise, xbow shooters can kiss my grits. Just b/c someone WANTS to do something, doesn't mean they should be allowed to.