gromage1 - CrossBOW

Definition of bow per Merriam Websters web site

2 : a weapon that is made of a strip of flexible material (as wood) with a cord connecting the two ends and holding the strip bent and that is used to propel an arrow


an arrow


1 : a missile weapon shot from a bow and usually having a slender shaft, a pointed head, and feathers at the butt


Now, you can argue that the definitions are wrong if you want to, but c'mon man, it would be like arguing that an animal that is a best friend, barks, chews on bones etc is a cat and not a dog, wouldn't it ? It clear what a bow is and what one isn't and a crossbow IS a bow by every definition. They are thoudsands of years older than a compound - they've been around a very long time.

So "its not a bow" is not a valid argument anymore than " its not the right color"

Give me an argument here - give me some valid reason NOT to have crossbows in archery season other than you just don't want other guys in the woods - and isn't that really what it boils down to ? You've already said " if it gets more people into hunting thats great " and crossbows will do that to a degree. Now - why not allow them in archery season ?

How about this - we'll take the last 2 weeks of archery season and make it crossbow only - will that be okay ? They have "their" season and you have yours. Of course you can't hunt in "their" season just like you won't allow them to hunt in "yours"

Fair enough ? I bet its not, is it ?

Let me ask this - why are you afraid to have them in archery season ? its not about if they're a bow or not - anyone and everyoine knows the modern compound bow is easy to use and very accurate - heck man, they're the choice of bowhunters by far in states that have legal crossbow use - why ? Yes, because modern compound bows surpass crossbows for accuracy, reliability and they're fun to shoot to boot and give the archer a greater chance to kill game.

So back to the question - why not allow crossbows ? Because your made up definition of what a bow is and "have to draw in the presence of game" (which BTW is a catch phrase that the P&Y dveloped years ago that archers seem unable to see past) is not accurate, not factual and G&F and DNR's are starting to catch on. If there are good argumnets, ya'll better come up with them before ever state passed legalized crossbows huh ?

This will be my last reply to this, soooo while we're defining. crossbow- a weapon used for discharging quarrels and stones that consists chiefly of a short bow ( yes bow) mounted crosswise near the end of a stock. No difference from the definition of a bow right?
Quarrel- a square headed ( yes square headed) bolt or arrow especially for a crossbow. Hmmm. Now, no where did I ever imply that crossbows should be illegal or not allowed for hunting, did I? You are correct in assuming I wouldn't want to give up 2 weeks of archery for crossbows, selfish? probably but I have no problem addmitting that and I think we're all selfelsh to some extent, I'd really like to know why it is that some people feel that because my opinion doesn't agree with yours you have to change mine? It's an opinion, I'm not charging you for it and besides the wealth of information found on this sight other peoples opinions are important to me, I have often changed mine based on points brought out by others here, however on this issue I stand firm, if you are unhappy with that oh well, its my opinion and I am intitled to it as your are intitled to yours. When did I say anthing about primitive weapons being the issue, I went to school, I realize a crossbow is primitive I don't argue that.
Now I'm done with this thread and I realize mine is only one opinion of many, if the laws change here and crossbows are allowed I'll have to live with that, but nobody will ever be able to say that I didn't stand up for what I believe.

When theres a conflict of opinions, what better way to sort them out then to dicsuss the why's and how's of each sides beliefs ? I can tell you exactly why I think crossbows have every right to be considered legal archery taking gear. I can point to the states that have them legally and show you no negatives resulting from their legalization and likely quite a few positives. I can also point out that at one time, recurve/longbow shooters fought tooth and nail to keep compounds out - aren't you glad they didn't win ?

And what can you point to in support of crossbows to NOT be allowed ? A bit of selfishness in sharing the woods maybe ? A ethics thing concerning the modernization of bows without also applying the same to compounds ? Maybe something else ??

I'm waiting for just that one good reason to NOT allow crossbows - just one fellows. Is that so hard to ask ?

1 Reason --The people that hunt with crossbows are just too damn obstanant and pushy!

kidding relax.

I'm from Ohio and have hunted with a crossbow in my younger years. I am much more accurate with my compound. My only argument about crossbows is the fact that many people (not everyone) believe since they are a trigger operated mechanism that they operate like a gun and thus they need not practice being an archer. I saw this first hand this year, go to Dick's or your local sporting goods store the night before bow season opens and see how many new bows are going out the door. Most ,if not all,are crossbows, do you think these folks are going home to practice all night??

I don't have a problem with the weapon. I have a buddy who I hunt with on rare occasions and he carries a crossbow. I also have an Uncle who has a permit to hunt with a crossbow in Pa. While he does have health issues he could and has shot a compound. Getting a permit in Pa is pretty easy. But thats another topic, so i digress....

If the person shooting a crossbow practices and knows the weapons limitations than I have no problem with it. Yes i know the same can be said about any bow, but the characteristics of a crossbow make it easy, in the hands of the uneducated, to make poor decisions.

I use to think crossbow shooters were less accurate too until I started shooting 3D tournaments with recurve/longbow shooters - and to a lesser degree compounders. GEEEESH ! For every 10 arrows on some targets maybe 2-3 will hit the vitals. Lots of misses. Accuracy is a word that literally has a thousand meaning depending on who you talk to !

Well I spent the evening before opening day at the largest Pro Shop in my area this year and I have worked the week before opening day a couple of different years a well. Crossbows are legal in my state as well. I can tell you honestly that I have seen more people come in and by compounds the day before the season than I have crossbows. Those type of people exist and it's totally independent of the weapon. They will be irresponsible with a compound, crossbow, or gun. I always felt a little better about someone buying a crossbow the day before season than I did a compound becasue I felt like there was a better chance of the being proficient with the crossbow.

Does it matter how long it takes to become proficient ?

Literally, I can shoot a compound for 20 mintues - probably only 5 minutes but I'll stretch it some - and I can shoot it out to 30 yards - no problems.

Does it get any easier than that ? I mean really, does it ?

A novice can be shooting very good groups in a few dozen shots - yes, compounds are THAT easy to shoot.

I know here in Ohio its nice to be able to use a crossbow. I usually use my compound in warm weather but if its late December or January and you can't step outside in the morning without cussing because it's not summer, I'll grab my crossbow every time. I can be too cold to draw a bow smoothly but still be able to pull a trigger. My comfortable kill range is the same 35 to 40 yards. My crossbow is a lot noisier than my bow and a lot harder to walk through brush without getting hung up. They both have their advantages and they both belong in the archery season. I am glad we have that choice here. If you are worried about the woods getting too crowded you should find a new area to hunt. This year I won't be using it because I already filled my three tags in early November.What a shame.

So... I guess you goobers always hit the vitals on every target that's set beyond your effective range? Isn't hitting the vitals on every shot pretty much how we define our effective range in the first place? Talk about elitist BS! There's some to dine on!

Silentassassin, why do you insult the civil rights movement and women's suffrage by comparing those basic human rights struggles with the plight of the poor, downtrodden crossbow shooter? Is it simply because they're a minority trying - for their OWN selfish reasons!! - to get into bow seasons that were never intended for them?

If you're so concerned with the rights of the minority, why do you ignore the plight of the traditional bowhunters? They're the ones who use equipment like was available when the seasons were actually established. I haven't seen you chime in to defend fellow bowhunters from comments like those above! And those comments are supposedly FROM fellow bowhunters!??! Is that because you agree with them, SA? You want to raise up the crossbow shooter while spouting lies - or, at best, incomplete truths - that can be used for exterminating the tradtionalist?

Like it or not, fellers, traditionalists ARE STILL part of bowhunting. Their numbers are growing. Many, including newcomers with undeveloped skills, are spending their time at 3D tournaments trying to improve their skills with their weapons. And, for that, they are getting slandered by comments like those above? [:@] Many traditional shooters in my neck of the woods will not attend mixed shoots at all any longer because of the compound bigots. Participation in our club's all-traditional tournaments last season were easily triple the numbers of compound shooters who came to our mixed shoots.

The way I see it, we've got traditionalists who know they need to get out and shoot, and actually enjoy shooting. Then we've got the compound guys - the great majority of whom sit on their butts all year, dragging their dusty bows out, knocking off the cobwebs and shooting a few arrows to 'check their sights' before going hunting the next day. For every compound shooter who is active in tournament shooting, or at least shoots on a regular basis in the off season, there are easily a hundred who fit into the above category. You guys KNOW this is the truth!

That's what scares the bejeezus out of me about crossbows. They will simply make a sorry situation even worse.

My focus, as an archer and long time club officer, is promoting the sport of archery to those bowhunters who sit out the entire offseason. I want to get them involved. I want to get their wives and children involved in archery. The only segment of the sport where I see much of that happening is in traditonal. Might be different in your neck of the woods. All I can speak to is my own area around Dallas/Fort Worth.

Now, I've shot compounds for the past 20 years and, over the past 5 years, I've found the newer compounds to be decidedly BORING to shoot and a PITA to keep tuned up. No wonder people won't shoot the damn things. They're not any fun. Crossbows are even worse. Cock the thing, load an arrow, look through the scope and pull the trigger. You don't even see the bolt/arrow/quarrel/whatever flying downrange to the target! Might as well be shooting a gun.

Without a challenge, there is no sense of accomplishment. Without a sense of accomplishment, there is no saitisfaction. Without a sense of satisfaction, there is no enjoyment. We've gone a long way down the road to take the challenge out of archery and bowhunting. Any wonder why participation numbers at the local club level are dropping? As I said earlier, I see crossbows as exacerbating the problem. They're not any kind of answer to it.

Due to a car accident I am no longer able to fully draw a bow. I have used compound & recurve in the past. So I am to be looked down upon now because I cant draw a bow any longer ? If your that much of a traditionalist AP , just grab an arrow and a loin cloth and jump down on top of the deer from tree's. Your argument is like saying there shouldnt be handicap access to buildings because we " traditionally" use the stairs. I shouldnt be offered another method to hunt since I am unable to use a bow ? C'mon !