My first TURBO deer
 

My first TURBO deer
FINALLY!! after two years of shoulder rehab I felt ready to try and take a deer with my TURBO NOCKS.
I got an invite from a good friend , Buster Greenway to come to Triple T Whitetails in Barry Ill. This is run by Jeff Bower.
When I first entered the old Federal period Home that is now used as a lodge for hunters , all I could do was say Holy ----
and drool at the mounts that were hung on the living room wall.
Yes There really are monster deer in Ill. I attached a poster with some of the trophies that all came from Jeff's properties.
Anyhow, the second night I was on a tree stand I had a small doe come by and I decided to fill my antlerless tag and take it.
The deer came into an opening about fifteen yds away, but was standing about 3/4 away from me and its vitals were blocked by a large tree. All I had as a target was the front sholders forward.
I had the bow drawn and the darn deer looked right up at me.
I decided that if and when it looked away I was going to drop it with a high shoulder shot. The angle looked like It would give me the shoulder, and if she lowered her neck to eat I would break her spine and exit out the neck in front of the far shoulder.
She turned her head and lowered it to eat some plants, and I took the shot. The doe dropped in her tracks. and rolled down a small embankment. She was paralized and tried to raise her head.
The Muzzy 90 grain blew right through her shoulder and broke her back and exited out the middle of the neck which was bleeding quite well. I decided to cut short any suffering for the deer and put a second shot into her spine just below the base of her scull, which killed her instantly. She was down and out in about 10 seconds. I took this deer with a TURBO Hunter and a Muzzy 90 grain.

A few minutes later , Buster Greenway took his doe about 200 yds away from me. He dropped his in her tracks with a shot to the back of the head. Buster took his with some handmade T-4 prototypes and the new T-4 with feathers worked as expected.
The last night I was there I got to see a real monster buck.
It came out of the woods 324yds from me and I could see bone without any binoculars. I was there about a week before the rut starts and was lucky to even see one of the monsters.
As I was leaving, Greg Hopf came to the lodge and was preparing to do a video on a hunt. We sponser his show on the sportsman channel. Hopefully I will get to see the monster again.
I had a great time there and would recommend Triple T Whitetails to anyone . If you want to get in on hunting during the rut, I think there are still some spots available. You can call Jeff at 217-653 7600. Just tell him you are a Red Sox fan and he will treat you right!!!!!



Head Shots
We both had close shots and if you have equipment you trust and are shooting within your skills why not take the game as quickly as possible. The less time the animal has to suffer the better I feel about the kill. This is the first time I have ever hunted from a tree stand and When I saw the angle on the target taking out the animals nervous system seem to be the logical and humane choice


I also want to congratulate Kendall Achy who is one of my Pa . TEAM TURBO Shooters. Kendall just took a 204 lb seven point in Sullivan County Pa. The old fashin way. on the ground.
Kendal is 18 yrs old and this is his second deer with a TURBO.

I have attached an image of his deer at the end of the photos.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Here are some of the Trophies that came from the Triple T Whitetails land.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

this is Buster and Me with our does

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

This is Kendall's Sullivan County Pa. buck

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Great story and congrat's on your deer, also those pic's are some pretty darn nice looking buck's .

nubo

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

some ballsy shot selection, but glad it worked out for the best.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Congrates,how much does it cost to hunt here???

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

What is a Turbo Deer ? i saw on another post that someone had another turbo kill. What is a Turbo kill?

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Congrats! :)

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

prices for triple T are $ 1800 for five days Archery
$2100 for gun season and $2500 for a combo.
There are a good many Tv videos done from here , including Greg Hopfs show. because this is a section of Ill where the food and the genetics produce BEASTS!!!!

A TURBO DEER is my way of saving time . It is a deer taken with the product I invented. TURBO NOCK.

Head shots and spine shots. I have been polishing my shooting skills and recently went wabbit huntin and was taking wabbits in the head at 20yds . so I felt quite confident taking the doe in the spine at 15yds.
There is probably something wrong with me , but I do not get the jitters or excited when taking shots on animals. It is probably because I have spent most of my adult life fighting in martial arts tournaments, where the"prey" fights back. I do become extremely focused on a living target such as a deer because I like the animal to expire as quickly as possible.
My first deer with the bow , when I was 13yrs old was a gut shot and I spent 4hours tracking the poor thing down. It was crying and so was I.
That left a lasting impression on me.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

This is a photo of the Kill shot. It aint pretty, but quite effective.
I was using my Matthews LX with an eradicator sight. Once you get used to not using a peep this sight is quite effective, and I can use it with my glasses on. I waited to take the shot until the deer laid her head on the ground. The Muzzy went right through her neck and stuck in the ground.
( I have made a corredtion to this post! It was brought to my attention that I was using an illegal sight. I had originally posted that I was using a red dot scope. My red dot scope is called an E-dot and I also have an Eradicator sight that is non electric. I had both bows with me and I did use the E radicator for the hunt. Both of my sights eliminate the peep. And I get them confused when typing,but not when hunting.)
If you look in the photo I have the bow with the E-dot, This was a shot we took the morning after the hunt and we just picked up bows for the photo.)

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Congrats on the deer. That's quite a shot. I think it's ironic that the inventor of a product is just now getting a chance to take his first deer with that product. Now you know first hand they work.;) Good story and nice pics too.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

I can't believe no-one else is questioning this shot and possible ethics issue.

Why would anyone want to shoot at anything but vitals????? Nick, you must have really wanted that doe.

One neck shot, the other head shot - you guys are quite the duo.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

congrats on the deer. What are Turbo nocks? Do you have some pictures? I would like to know more about them. Is there a website?

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

OK Here I go. I don't care if you can hit a gnat in the pecker from 30 yards neck shots and head shots aren't the way to go,IMO. You can brag all you want about your shooting skills but the margin for error is to great for that kind of shot. If you're that good and it doesn't excite you why not just wait for a high percentage broadside shot instead.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Nice deer! Looks like your hard work paid off with the Turbo's.

Neck / Head shots -- I won't take them. It's that simple. I'll take different ranges of shots at vitals which some may call gutsy, but I'd never take a neck / head shot. Even with a gun. I just don't see the point of aiming at a 2 inch target vs a 8 inch kill zone. Last I checked, that's a lot smaller!!!!!

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Iaam not bragging about my shooting skills. I would not take a shot that I was not confident of making. The first shot was a shoulder shot that went through the spine and out the neck.
This is just as deadly as a heart lung shot, and a lot quicker. We talk about ethics and a lot of hunters take the heart shot because they know if they miss the heart the lung shot will also kill,but the animal can take quite some time to die with a lung shot.
I took the high shoulder shot at 15yds which gave me about a 4inch area to do the damage I wanted. The shoulder shot dropped the deer in its tracks and it could not move except for raising its head a little. It would have bled out right there in a few minutes. I took the NECK shot to the spine to stop the animal from any suffering. I think a 10 second calculated kill is far more ethical than a lung shot where the animal is going to run and possibly get lost and also suffer for a considerable length of time. I would never shoot for the skull area of an animal. The doe that Buster took was a shot straight down from his tree stand and It was also not to the skull , but to the spine area just behind the head. Buster is a very accomplished hunter and shooter and gives his friend Byron Ferguson a run for his money when they get into shooting.

As to getting excited I was making reference to those who let the excitement get in the way of their shot. ( buck fever) I of course was excited with the hunt, but That type of excitement comes out as a heightened calmness with me.
Archery is a Martial art and I have studied other martial arts most of my life. I have had over 1000 tournament fights and probably 10,000 non tournament fights. I have over the years learned to be quite calm in the heat of fighting other humans who fight back. This calmness and focus is kind of second nature and gave me quite an edge in tournament fighting. I have only lost about 200 of those fights. That same calm focus was there for me when I took the doe.
I saw the shot and I calmly made it. I was using excellent equipment and was aware of its and my limitations.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Sorry, but I'm still not impressed by your shot selection. You seem like a person that needs an aweful lot of patting on the back since you seem to like to justify a lot of the things that you have done, but it isn't going to be from me on this one (and your buddies) shot selections.

Next time you go on a trip why not let the operations/ranch owners know ahead of time of the shot selections on game that you plan on taking, see how many of them will welcome you with open arms.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

I am sorry you feel that way, I was brought up with a lot of rules from the Bible. One had to do with judging others. I still live by that rule. All I can say is that your opinion of me or your judgment of me missed by a mile.

Most everyone in the country watched the presidental debates. and yet after they were over. half the country swore Bush won and half swore that Kerry won. How can millions of people with varying degrees of intelligence, watch the exact same events and come out with an even split on what really happened. Sadly many people look at the world and events with preconceived ideas that cloud their judgment. This is not a fault, but just human nature.
Look at how politics are done. Make a personal attack of your opponent , then try to drive some point home. This is done on both sides. I have found this same mentality is pervasive in our society.
Put your opponent down in some way then this is supposed to make your point the right one.

All I can say is if you think the shot I made was unethical, you are basing it on your preconceived ideas. I was there I saw the shot develop and I took the shot based on my ethics which is to make a kill as quickly as possible within the limits of my skill and equipment. The result is my shot worked as I expected. At 15yds this was a very low risk shot for
me and the results are what they are.

I really believe the ethics of hunting should be discussed, but personal attacks are of little value.
In Canada it is perfectly acceptable to Bait bear , In most of the US this is illegal.
In some states you can track deer with dogs, some states allow scopes and electric illuminated sights , some do not, some allow mechanicals some do not. These ethics are legislated.
Perhaps we should have state laws legislating where we can shoot deer with the bow and arrow and at what distance. Perhaps if you wound a deer you should pay a fine????
Perhaps we should have a hunters shooting test just like a drivers license test.
Lets say if you can not shoot a 4in group at 40 yds and a 2inch group at 20 you fail the test and can not get a hunting license. Would that be ethical?????

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

besides using any electronic devices on your bow in ILLINOIS is prohibited. IE. ILLEGAL! im sure this pertains to your red dot scope.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Mr. Snook: I first want to say that if you thought that I was judging you I'm sorry it wasn't meant that way,I have not been given the authority to judge anyone. That's why in my post I put IMO (IN MY OPINION) My opinion is just that. Sorry if offended.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

No problem GUT SHOT.

I do want to make a correction that was brought to my attention.
I have two bows that do not use a peep sight.one is a red dot and the other is the eradicator. which uses phosphors and no electricity.
My red dot is called an e-dot and my eradicator . I got them confused and apoligize. We were doing a lot of target shooting while there and I was using both bows . The deer was taken with the non electric sight.
If you look at the photo you will see the bow with the red dot sight.
This was a photo taken the morning after the hunt and we just picked up bows for the photo.
Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Soooo...will we ever find out what a Turbo Nock is?

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

I do not really want to post ads here, go to www.turbonock.com
I am a manufacturer, probably the smallest nock maker in the country, but I am an archer first and I really want to talk about hunting. It is a fine line to walk in my postiton.
I cross my eyes the wrong way and may get flamed for pimping my product.
and Yet if I do not communicate about archery I can not learn new ideas and get opinions from the community.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

I call BULL**** on snook. Let's see 10,000 fights huh. And let's just say you have one fight a day (though I'm sure your beating the hell out of 5 different people a day). So that's 25 years with a fight every day and a winning percentage of around 99%. Ya and I'm Santa Clause.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

The win loss I was talking about dealt only with the Torunament fights not the ones outside of tournaments.
I have been in the arts since 1972 and ran a shcool from 1984 until I retired. We trained three times a week and did a lot of in school fighting.
sometime 15 or 20 matches in an evening.
I also participated in a local "fight club" for black belts only which met once a month and you would usually get 10 or 15 fights at one of these meetings. No one kept track, we fought to learn and have fun.
In all honesty 10,000 is probably a little low. Whether you believe me or not is of little importance. I love competition and the martial arts was one of the few sports where one can participate well up into their later years.
If My rotater had not wiped out I would still be fighting.

Actually the moderator of this site was for a time a student at our school.
He attended after I turned it over to one of my top students, and can not verify my fighting record, but he can certainly tell you what our training was like.
I really do not know what value this has to the hunting topic Except that you wanted to find something to pick at.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

oneshotmagnum,

First I'd like to welcome you to the forums, then at this time I'd like to suggest that you go reread the posting rules. Your post to this topic is not only off topic, it's inflammatory towards another member and simply put in bad taste. Thank you for cooperating and I hope your stay with us will be memorable in the hunting sense.

That being said, I am the moderator Nick is speaking of and I indeed did take Kung Fu for many years from Nicks top student who became a instructor as well as instructions from Nick himself when visiting our class. I'll tell ya straight out, he's not blowing smoke when it comes to his occomplishments within the sport of Kung Fu.....

And I'd like to take the opportunity to thank Nick for being professional in his response to your attack which was unwarranted. His level head is obvious a sign of his training......

NOW, let's keep the posts on topic. IMO

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Been working my tail off in Florida after four hurricanes and just got back home this past weekend..............it's been awhile since I've visited this site and must say I am extremely dissappointed by this thread.

Head shooting deer with a bow and arrow, are you freakin kidding me!! Is this what this site has come to in the past four months?? I don't care who you are, what your shooting ability is or how anyone was suppossedly raised (bible or not), that is wrong and completely unethical. Try attending a hunter education course.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

The site has not changed. Do not be angry with them . I did the posting.
I apologize to you and those on the site that have such strong feelings.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Let me give you my opinion of the topic as clear as possible, since I have been told that my opinion or judgment is off by a mile. I am not making an opinion or judgment of you personally; I am stating an opinion of your shot selection.

I don’t care about your ability to shoot a bow, your personal accuracy level, ability to predict a deer’s reaction, your personal ethics, your logic, the “polishing” of your shooting skills by shooting rabbits in the head at 20 yards, your martial arts fighting record, your ability to focus, shooting with Byron, your knowledge of the bible, the presidential debates, baiting bears, tracking deer with dogs, types of broadheads, legislation of laws based on shot selection, whining about being personally attacked, shooting tests, angry board members, etc, etc,

The only opinion (or judgment, as you put it) that I have on this topic is on the shot selection made, promoted and justified which as I have said and believe are very poor to say the least. More specifically intentionally shooting, promoting and justifying neck, head, and spine shots with archery.

I think of someone asking me permission to archery hunt my land which has been quality deer managed for years and saying, “Well, if a deer comes in and I don’t have shot at vitals, I plan on shooting at the neck, head, and spine.”

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

This thread is approaching lunacy.

Mr. Snook here has had the oportunity to invent something, market it, use it and ultimately, he was posting that his invention was successful. To that I say Congratulations NickSnook. You have created a successful product.

As to the head / neck / spine shot argument -- as archers, we have the responsibility to make ethical kills and promote the sport in an ethical manner. As previously stated, I would not take a head / neck / spine shot, nor would I allow someone hunting on my property to do so. However, Mr Snook successfully used a product to shoot a deer. He killed the deer. Perhaps it was lucky, perhaps it was skill, but the point of this whole post was that he used a Turbo Nock to successfully arrow a living animal.

BobCo: I agree completly with you. I think hunters need to be educated as to how to ethically kill an animal. Note I did not use correctly. You can correctly kill a deer by dropping a bowling ball on its head. Not ethical, but the deer is dead... I, for one, would like to see more rampant hunters education in order to educate hunters. But you can't force your views on them when you aren't there monitoring what they are doing on private land. Perhaps a different thread should be started along these lines to open up a discussion as to how to better teach ethical hunting.

Rob: I appreciate you stepping in when this thread was taking a negative turn. Having been a member here for around a month, I tend to notice that sometimes people's opinions tend to overshadow the purpose of the thread. This really doesn't accomplish anything.

And now, as this post is becoming off topic, happy hunting to all!

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Thanks mjqgoodo

It is refreshing to see some input where constructive criticism is given without the name calling and such.

I talked today with a friend of mine, Tom Rowe, who is on the ATA board of directors. Tom Related to me that he once took a similiar shot as I did from a tree stand and hit the spine behind the shoulders and had to take several other shots to kill the deer as it dragged itself away bawling.
I could tell by the tone in his voice that this had affected him greatly.
I took his words to heart.
I have been shooting since age three and I do not consider myself an expert. There is always more to learn in this or any sport.
A great way to learn is by communicating with others on these forums.
I have learned a lot about hunting ethics. and hopefully others who read this will have a greater insight in making hunting decisions.

What saddens me is that we get all fired up on a hunting ethic issue , and yet look at the ethics we use when dealing with each other in expressing
our opinions.
I have heard some say I would not hunt with someone who would take a shot like that.
My question is would you hunt with someone who would treat his fellow man like dirt . Can we treat each other with the same reverence we profess to give toward animals we are killing?

New people to the sport who read this will certainly have a better opinion of archery in general if they see us discussing different viewpionts like
the last post . with some degree of respect for each other. and possibly agree to disagree.
During these bizarre political times we are going through , we see our leaders and potential leaders going at each other tooth and nail. and truth and lies and name calling from all sides . Think how the rest of the world must view our society if they are watching tv .
Here we are on this forum pretty much using the same ethics as our politics seem to dictate to discuss this ethics issue.
I have found that usually a voice of reason is listened to more than anger.

I have certainly learned a lot from this forum so far.

I have always been a ground hunter, and this was my first treestand hunt
When I saw this deer come under the stand, I drew on it and the shot just fell in place. Sometimes you just get a feeling . I took the shot and dropped the deer. After hearing all the points of view here I probably would not take a shot like that again. I am happy that at least this time the shot worked and the animal did not suffer.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Stories like that really make a person think. What we carry into the woods had the potential to injure and or kill. As much as we all enjoy hunting and the fun of it all, it is serious business.

Fair enough. Hunting has a bad name around here. I hate that. They view us as bumbling idiots with guns who go out in the woods and fire away at deer. And I can't actually blame them. During gun season around here, it sounds like people are shooting at running deer. All you hear is a string of 6 shots and then swearing. This really hurts the sport.

God I hope so. I hate getting angry as my wife will tell you. In fact, I usually get more pissed off that I lost my temper and totally forget about the thing which upset me in the first place.

Good. I think that's why we're all here. Otherwise, we'd be playing solitare or something on these computers...

Your shot placement is your own call. I think hearing other people tell stories of wounded crying animals makes me afraid to take questionable shots. But until your convince your heart of it, all the angry posts in the world won't change someone's mind. Relating first hand experiences is the only way to help another understand WHY the shot should / shouldn't be taken. In the end, it's up to the individual hunter.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Personally, I think these types of shots should be avoided for a few reasons. First the margin error is just so slim. Second, no hunter can completely eliminate all factors or variables of the shot on a live animal. There are many things that are beyond the hunters control or vision. There is always a short period of time between the actual decision of release (point of no return) and the time the arrow gets to the animal. Did you know that a deer can move over 7 inches traveling at just 2mph by the time a 300fps no decelerating arrow gets to it at 20 yards, if you'd like to see the math PM me. All a deer needs to do is pick its head up while someone is shooting at its brain. Could be the difference between an actual brain hit and blowing off a deer’s jaw even at 5 yards. Now you would have an unrecoverable deer that will starve to death over a long period of time. Talk about feeling bad on a gut shot that takes 12 hours, how about days or weeks to slowly die. It just isn't worth it to me. Yea, maybe I could make that head/neck/or spine shot 9 out of 10 times on living game or 100 out of 100 times on a target, but it just isn't worth it for that one that could possibly get wounded.

I think you made the right decision Nick, and I applaud you for keeping an open mind.

Great post mjqood0.

I would also say that we are in a forum where most of the archers are very or extremely passionate about their sport. I feel that is a good thing. When opinions vary, things may seem rough around the edges. But I never feel that we are at war against each other. JMHO.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

I will give the benefit of the doubt and agree with that.

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

mjqooDo
You are a wise man! I feel like a weight has been lifted off my shoulders.
I am going to hunt with my brother and other family members in Potter county tomorrow after I vote . This little saga has been weighing heavily on me. If I get a chance to take a nice buck there will be a lot of extra thought going into the setup.

My grand nephew James Hunter Snook is going to also be my guide on a small game hunt , James Won his age group at the Pa Bowhunters Festival this year and is the youngest member of our Team TURBO NOCK
I wonder what I will learn from him?

RE: My first TURBO deer
 

Good luck hunting! Maybe you can score another Turbo'd Deer?!