GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Okay, I just ordered two dozen Gold Tip, XT, 5575 arrows (.003 Straightness). I spun checked each arrow individually and to my disgust found TWO arrows out of TWENTY FOUR that were straight enough to screw a broadhead on (and those were both borderline)! I told and showed the bow shop what junk these arrows were and they recommended we send them back to the manufacturer (which I agreed). I then tested several carbon arrows that they carried at their shop and eventually purchased a dozen Blackhawk Vapors. I was pretty impressed with these arrows. After grabbing twelve shafts (at random), I spun them and found 6 that were perfectly straight. As a matter of fact, I have since, tuned and fletched those six arrows and shot them with Broadheads. They flew perferctly and were in the EXACT spot as my field points. My problem is - I am shooting with a Trap Door and the arrows are very loud while drawing my bow, i guess due to the coating that they put on these arrows, because my Gold Tips were silent. My question - what carbon arrows are the tuning fanatics like myself using and what are you finding to be the straightest shaft on the market that is durable, quiet and relatively inexpensive in comparison to other shafts?

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

They haven' t made them yet...

Until then, ACCs fit the bill. You get what you pay for.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Not cheap but none much straighter or lighter, All comes down to how fanatical you are, hard to be fanatical on a budget. Check out Carbon Techs Cheeta

http://www.carbon-tech.com/Hunting/h...aster_list.php

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Did you test the arrows with inserts installed?.If so were they installed properly. I see alot of shops install inserts without spin testing arrows.I ALLWAYS install my own inserts with either hot melt or slow setting epoxy.

CB

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

IME it seems that Goldtip Factory fletched arrows end up being really poor for straightness run-out. Were these factory fletched?

Buying shafts is a much better way to go about things.

For comparison purposes I recieved a dozen XT 55/75 shafts last week. Of the twelve:

9 were very straight as bare shafts: two of them required an inch or so from the nock end to be cut off to yield a extremely straight shaft (.005 to 006- TIR).

2 were of the same excellent straightness when cutting a bit from both ends to make a completed (28" ) shaft

1 was truly poor in quality, and only someone with a very short arrow (25" or less) would be able to chop off enough from both ends to get a straight useable shaft.

I' ll use that one as a tester for setting up my fletching jig.

All in all better straightness than the last 2 dozen Beman ICSH, dozen Blackhawk A/C' s & a dozen Standard CX I' ve bought.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

When I found out That my Carbon Impact arrows were made in France, I changed to Gold Tips.......I have not had a problem with them...In fact I believe I like them better...........They all group very well......I bet your problem is the way the inserts are installed...

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I shoot the best groups ever with Gold Tips. I spin checked each one
and all look perfect. I have much confidence in the shop I buy them from.
I have had one arrow in two dozen not shoot well and I past that as wrinkled
fletching.
I think you should find another source for your arrows.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I just bought and fletched up some more GT XT Camo arrows.

Cut from both ends - and six were what I would consider " good" .

This was my worst batch yet with 3 of them really bad and 3 of them so-so.

Not that happy - but I am not about to change now. I have a couple dozen that are good.

And spine - hell I couldn' t tell you until I shoot them all. They have our gonads in a vise when it comes to spine.:(

I sure hope GT does not have a downslide in quality.

I just may concede all these advances to Arthur - and go back to Alum[:o]:D;)

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I found the Gold tips 3d pros a good choice for straightness. like someone said you have to take about 1 to 1 1/2 inches off the nock end i think this would go for any carbon arrow. What about Beman ICS hunters anyone think these shafts are straight?

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I don' t get all hung up on the straightness tester for my arrows because I can' t measure the spine and how they are going to react when shot.

My newly aquired Beeman ICS Hunters, after I properly installed broadheads and inserts and spun tested them all grouped within 4" (shot at individual spots) at 40 yards. Considering this was nearly as good as I could do with field points on my old bow I was pretty happy. New bow and these same arrows group less than 3" and I shot off two nocks and ruined 5 fletches before switching to 5 spot targets. Not one of the arrows of the dozen failed my group test.

I ran them through the straightness tester and discovered the best arrow was .002 and the worst .007 after each of them had been fired over 50 times.

Groups matter for me and none of the dozen failed.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

RA. I got tired of all the variables with carbon and that' s exactly what I did. I feel much better and have less to worry about :D

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Just finished fletchin up my superslam 2314' s. Two yellow and one black vane with yellow nocks. They are real purrtie:D test all for straightness and shot each arrow through paper and rotated the nocks till they shot nice bullet holes. out of 12 shafts I have ended up with 12 straight, great flying arrows. That' s why I just gave up on carbons with the exception the the " skinny" ones.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Rack-attack.... For once, I' m speechless! :D

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I use to shoot aluminum with no concerns with tuning and broadhead flight but i let a couple of my buddies talk me into carbons which i have liked up until the last couple of years. I' ve replied about the quality of Goldtips on several other post. I' ve been shooting them for about 4/5 years now but i have had a real problem with them in the last couple of years. I bought a dozen last year and had to send 3 back that were split on both ends bout 3-4 inches up the shaft and out of the remaining 9 i had 4 that would shoot a broadhead. Giving them the benefit of doubt i bought a dozen about a month ago and about half of them are ok to shoot but two were split right through the green logo on the shaft and one actually had a dent in it like it had been heated and warped. I' m like rack, i have to many and it' s to close to opening day to switch but this will definately be my last year shooting goldtips. I' m not sure if i want to try another brand or not. I saw some the other day at a bow shop called super carbons that a company out of VA (nationwide archery) i think is the name of it and from all the ones the guy at the shop spun and checked were good. They have three types (supremes .001 straightness), (Magnums .003 straightness), and (Hunters .006 straightness). If i stick with carbons i may try a dozen of the Magnums and the cost is about the same as goldtips. I' m really considering going back to the Easton X7 Eclipse 2314 next season that i use to shoot. I never had a problem with the easton shafts being straight or shooting broadheads.

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

WOW...to have Rack and Arthur in the same ballpark is a feat in itself, much less agreeing [:o] LOL :)

Guys....just buy XX78' s and get it overwith[:o];)

I can honestly say, that I find that most all of my arrows are straight...from dozen to dozen. I do find one here or there that end up in my pratice bin, but not many.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Ain' t that something, WV? I' m wondering if he' s pulling our leg. :D

Navy, I started using aluminum arrows in 1978. In all that time, I can think of only once where I accidently bent an arrow while hunting, a bizarre accident involving the closing of a tailgate.

If you fall hard enough to bend aluminum arrows, you probably fell hard enough to nock the sights out of whack and possibly tweaked that finely tuned arrow rest as well. Maybe even bent that big aluminum cam, or dinged a string cutting burr in the track. You' re not going to be sitting in the stand with a freshly dropped bow until you' ve checked everything out and fixed it up anyway. At least, I hope not.

And, while you' re in camp fixing the bow, you can grab a refill from your spare arrow cache before heading back to the stand. My experience with aluminum is the same as 5 shot' s - generally all 12 out of a dozen arrows will shoot broadheads great. Only occasionally do I run into one that won' t. All my broadhead tuned arrows take the trip, not just the ones in the quiver.

Besides that, if you fall and bend your aluminums, that means you' re not moving very carefully in the woods and every critter in there is probably headed for the next county.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Guys......thanks for all of your post. Like most of you, I spin checked each arrow right out of the bag before any inserts or vanes were installed. I fletch and build all of my arrows from raw shafts. Like Rack and others, I am actually contemplating just going back to Aluminum' s NEXT year. The only reason I switched in the first place, was because my shooting abilities improved greatly enough that I would ruin two or three shafts PER shooting session. I guess either way you look at it........it' s a financial issue. I broke down and bought 6 GT 3-D pros yesterday. We spun checked each and cut both ends of the arrows down to my specified length. I now have 6 perfectly straight arrows. They are ONLY $100 per dozen. I could go back to aluminums and risk going through 3-4 dozen arrows per year (which would not save me any money!). I could invest in more BLOCKS, GLEN-DEL BUCKS (Which I really like, by the way) and bags, so I can shoot one arrow at each target to avoid ruining arrows. I just want the impossible I guess!!! I want a durable, straight arrow that I can shoot with broadheads or field points. If I stick one in a tree branch, I would like to be able to pull it out, replace the insert and put it back in my quiver.......you can' t do that with an Aluminum arrow! I let you know if I find that perfect arrow!!!!!!! Good luck to everyone this season and I hope each of US get that big buck we' ve been dreaming of.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I purchased what was probably the first dozen GoldTips in Oklahoma several years ago. 5 of the dozen were straight enough to shoot. I was told then that the new company was just starting out, and that to produce good quality carbon arrows, you really had to control the climate in the plant that makes them. I was told that they couldn' t control the humidity in their plant then. I bought them because they were the first all carbon arrows that took inserts and not outserts. I shot the 5 good ones until they were pretty much destroyed (3-D shoots only, never hunted with them) then switched back to XX78' s. There' s not a straighter arrow out there, and I' ve found them to be very durable, and not easily bent. I' ll never shoot anything but XX78' s again.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Ok, here I go up on the soapbox again :D

As I’ve said, I have very good luck w/ the last 2 doz. Goldtip XT’s I’ve had, but very spotty results in the past. I’ll continue to evaluate them and continue the search for the perfect arrow. If finances allow next year, I’ll be back to ACC’s, which are not perfect, but are as perfect as you can find. They share the same positive qualities of XX aluminum, while also being very resilient (approaching the level of the really tough all-carbons), and surpassing both in every other area. I’ve shot fixed blade heads at over 300 FPS on ACC’s with the only trouble being the idiot pulling on the string. If cost continues to be a factor, I’ll end up w/ one of the premium carbon shafting types on the market like Gold Tip 3D Pro’s or similar as a compromise.

I love aluminum for the convenience, consistency, accuracy and ease of tuning. But, like Dale, I just destroy way too many (not bend slightly, but destroy them: crease them, obliterate the unibushing and back ends, etc). In 2000 I decided to switch back to alums (2315’s) and destroyed that dozen within a week while group tuning. I ended up buying two more dozens that year and ended up with only 4 decent ones by the time the season rolled around. I spent over $165 on three-dozen XX78 shafts when I could have purchased 1 dozen ACC’s for $110 and only destroyed 2 or 3. For those who like heavier arrows, The A/C Kinetic will fit the bill for all save those who really like the super thick wall alums like 2219’s, 2317’s etc. A 29” A/C KII 340 w/ a 125 -grain tip and three 5-inch AAE/ Dura vanes will give you an arrow weight of appx. 515 grains ( nothing to shake a stick at). For a guy who may only shoot 60 pounds a 400 KII w/ 125 grain tip and 4” vanes will come in around 480 grains at the same arrow length. Not much difference in the 2315’s and 2413’s you are shooting now.

As far as straightness, yep alum is as good as it gets but AC technology is virtually as good. I did some straightness testing this weekend with a bunch of different all carbons, alums, and AC shafts, and the A/C’s came in under spec (this time, as well as times past I have tested them) rivaling higher tolerance XX75 and close enough to XX78 that it really doesn’t matter. In fact the A/C full length shafts obliterated even cut to length premium carbons from other manufacturers. That is all fine and dandy if straightness is your be-all end-all to arrow shaft quality, but A/C will also match XX for spine consistency and surpasses it in weight consistency. Check out the weight variance tolerance for alum: it’s plus or minus 1%. For a 400 grain bare shaft that’s +/- 4 grains. A/C are weight matched to within ½ a grain, and even between the different letter codes the variance is as good as XX.

I keep seeing people complain that they have no option other than XX alum because cause all-carbons do not measure up, but the option IS there for you, plain as day. You may not like the cost, I understand that, but the shafts are there for your use.


P.S. And I sure wish someone from Easton would see how damn much I test and promote their shafts, cause I could really use an endorsement deal or a staff shooter position or something ;):D

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

You noticed that didn' t you:D

Nope - not really - I am easily lead to the edge of the cliff Art:), but its a little harder to get me to jump:D. Going to let this season pass and see what NEW STUFF comes out next year..........LOL....Those .00015 carbons are right around the corner:D I feel it

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

OK I,m going to stir the pot. I shoot Carbon Express and can not recall haveing a problem with the straightness or grouping with or without broadheads.........:D

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Jeff... All that' s missing from that sob story is the violin music in the background.:D

Let me get this straight... You' re making it sound like you don' t like Easton XX' s because they shoot TOO good, destroying them by group tuning and such, while you don' t have that problem with AC' s. Now, AC' s also use a uni-bushing, so why aren' t you destroying just as many of them? Surely you aren' t saying AC' s don' t group as tight, are you?


R-a, them good carbons are right around the corner, for sure. But who knows which corner??;)

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Arthur,

LOL, yeah after reading that it sounds pretty pitiful eh? True tale though.

I am saying Aluminum shoots very, very good (nothing is TOO good) I’m also saying that even with a Uni-bushing alum cannot take nearly the same amount of abuse that an A/C can. I’ve got several 3-49’s in my collection right now that have multiple dings from nock end hits that are still straight as they can be. An alum that took those hits would much more likely to be damaged significantly or destroyed as there is more surface area for a point to “catch” (less deflection): i.e an A/C (or any smaller diameter shaft) will tend to hit and deflect off without hitting the shaft elsewhere. On a big alum where you have a longer taper & wider uni, it you hit a nock, the point will tend to deflect and then catch the bigger surface area of the uni itself or crease on the back end of the shaft closest to the uni. An A/C with a smaller surface area will just tend to deflect the incoming arrow into the target proper, not other parts of the shaft. The wraps of carbon also take much more abuse if you do whack that area than alum will (obviously).

While I can just shoot different spots all the time w/ alum, since I rely mainly on group tuning, that only helps after I’ve destroyed several arrows in the process.

IME I get greater penetration from carbon’s smaller diameter, quicker recovery from a poor release, less drag past 30 yards, a quieter drawing arrow shaft (and it’s much quieter when I’m knock one around in the woods: a boon for me since I hunt on the ground) and I certainly can’t get the arrow speeds I find most forgiving for yardage errors with my draw length and poundage using alum. Not even w/ XX12 wall Ultra-Lite shafts. Even If I could, the absolute piss poor durability of XX12 & XX13 shafts is enough to make me yack just thinking about it :D

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

I sincerely believe the those thin wall shafts are directly responsible for carbons overly inflated reputation for durability. In comparison to those flying beer cans, carbon is indestructable.

But some carbon is just as bad, if not worse, than XX78' s for group tuning. I' m not much of a robin hooder. From the time I got first one till I got my 8th one took nearly 4 years. (YEAH, only two a year. I was shooting stickbows, alright?!?! Let me see you robin hood a 2219 with a cedar arrow at 45 yards using a longbow.:)) A few years back I started playing with GoldTips and found out that little set screw in the nocks makes a perfect guide right down the shaft. 5 robin hoods in one month. Only 2 arrows left out of a dozen. Thought they were wonderful arrows till I started trying to shoot broadheads on the blasted things.

And AC type shafts are not an option for me. Even if the price wasn' t a wallet strangler, the raw shafts are too short to make arrows out of.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

If you don' t mind, I' ll just sit back and watch this thread.;);)[&:][>:]:eek:

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

LOL, Flying Beer Cans!:D Can I use that?

I don' t shoot any of the all-carbon shafts without uni-bushings, especially Goldtips, because I have found their nocks to be about the worst on the market. They are way too tight on the string, crack the back ends of the shaft w/ that set screw, and as you found are extremely brittle.

Do you use a rest that ends up around the berger button hole when you shoot a release Arthur? I can see you problem with not getting enough length even out of raw shafts with your draw length. If you were using a Golden Key Premier series, or a NAP3000 style that allows for a bit shorter arrow, sizes 3-49 and up are 32" plus. Assuming a 34" draw, even at the berger you can probably get away w/ a 33" arrow, and with the rests I mentioned you can set them back an inch or so w/out getting the hassle of a full blow overdraw.Of course that is, if you were even willing to fork out the dough.

You might also look into the Beman Matrix, which is a less expensive A/C option. They are not an A/C/C IMO but still a step up from most all carbons.

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Jeff, back in the 80' s I shot an overdraw to get my arrows down to 31" . Had a bad experience with the overdraw when I was practicing with broadheads on a very windy day (gotta practice in all weather conditions, ya know). The arrow blew off the rest at full draw, bounced over the safety ledge, and the point lodged against my wrist. I had a devil of a time trying to keep from shooting that arrow through my wrist while going through all kinds of gyrations to get loose. The overdraw went away and I wouldn' t shoot one again for anything.

Now, I' ll set the rest about an inch behind the buttonhole, but that' s as far as I' ll take it back. I can get away with 32" shafts on my compound by doing that. And I can do 32" arrows on my longbow, but must have 33" for the recurve.

By the way, my current rest is the Cavalier FreeFlyte Micro flipper. My Golden Premier is socked away in the junk drawer along with all my releases. Maybe I just need to go back to release, buy a 28" draw bow and shoot with a 5" long string loop. :D

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Now that would be a sight, LOL

RE: GOLD TIP XT CARBON ARROWS-WHAT HAPPENED?
 

Arthur,

I hear ya about overdraws. I’ve had a few hairy experiences too with an ol Golden Eagle Pro Predator, and those cheap fiberglass overdraws they used to make for them.

Now, I wanna know what kind of friggin wind you were shooting in that would cause an 1980’s era 31” aluminum to fly off your rest? It must have been a hurricane strength to get one of those logs up in the air! ;).

And had you been shooting carbon with it’s much smaller diameter, less drag, and greater wind resistance that would have never happened! ;):D

Well, I don’t have any 3-71’s layin’ around these days (I sent ‘em to Frank), otherwise I’d send ya a few to try. I’ve got some raw shaft Blackhawk CAA 3-60’s that might be long enough for ya. They are not A/C/C’s but they aren’t too bad. I’ll go measure ‘em and see if they will work for ya. If so, I’ll send ‘em to ya just to try. I might also have an A/C/C 3-60 or two bare shafts laying around, though I’m not positive. I have all the components, you’ll just need to fletch em up, and install the inserts & G-nocks

I’ll PM ya this evening when I find out what I have.