Wolf Info
03-15-2010, 12:57 PM
#31
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Michigan
Posts: 275
Littlechief, comparing wolves to the Native Americans is like comparing an orange to an apple... We are not talking about things that happen hundreds of years ago and we are talking about now.. I don't see a threat in the wolf, I see a problem.. With this problem I strongly believe that their needs to be control/management BEFORE it gets out of hand.. Wolves are not the same as bear, cougars, and poisonous snakes as you had mentioned because they hunt, live, and feed in packs (more then one and can do a lot more damage then just one animal).. When their are more mouths to feed then their is more deer, elk, ect.. to kill.. BUT, my biggest problem with this is why some people think the wolf is something that is so special that NO-ONE can touch them and shouldn't touch them for that matter.. Like I've said before and I'll say it again they are no better then a mangy old coyote and should be treated the same, with a bullet to the head!!
03-15-2010, 01:24 PM
#32
Guest
Posts: n/a
Big C, I like you to, but I can only talk about what I hear.
Most instructors are old hunters and all of them tell the same story. One guy does something dumb and the green parties are on it like flies on sh1t. Blowing the whole thing up and the public opinion does the rest. Now who's to blame ?
You are right that we live in a small country where huntable land is hard to come by. We hunt under the public's nose. So we tread lightly.
But I have the same respect for foxes as for wolves, when they are managed like any other wildlife.
F.
Most instructors are old hunters and all of them tell the same story. One guy does something dumb and the green parties are on it like flies on sh1t. Blowing the whole thing up and the public opinion does the rest. Now who's to blame ?
You are right that we live in a small country where huntable land is hard to come by. We hunt under the public's nose. So we tread lightly.
But I have the same respect for foxes as for wolves, when they are managed like any other wildlife.
F.
Well, its a double edged sword. Lets say over half the population was either pro- hunting of didn't care, then that leaves hunters a large level of margin for stupid acts. Bottom line is antis are always going to be anti. Nothing will change that. They will sit there like a vulture and pick apart everything hunters do, no matter if its animal management, winter feed.
03-15-2010, 01:32 PM
#33
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: ILLINOIS
Posts: 1,207
[quote=LittleChief;3595461]
If there are apex predators in the area, a responsible parent or pet owner should keep both protected and out of harms way, and that does not necessitate killing all the wolves, bears, cougars, poisonous snakes, etc. in the country.
[quote]
LC, M9a9, with all due respect, I don't think anyone is talking about "wiping them out". All these guys are saying is they have to be taken off of the protected list, and have controlled hunting.
They were re-introduced, fine, but you can't have them populating out of control.
Michigans U.P. (and even N.Wisconsin) is having a serious problem, these wolves are killing machines. If they happen upon a fawn, they WILL kill it, hungry or not!
And many could tell you what they're doing to their elk populations as well.
Canada allows hunting for them for a reason, I don't see why we can't do the same.
If there are apex predators in the area, a responsible parent or pet owner should keep both protected and out of harms way, and that does not necessitate killing all the wolves, bears, cougars, poisonous snakes, etc. in the country.
[quote]
LC, M9a9, with all due respect, I don't think anyone is talking about "wiping them out". All these guys are saying is they have to be taken off of the protected list, and have controlled hunting.
They were re-introduced, fine, but you can't have them populating out of control.
Michigans U.P. (and even N.Wisconsin) is having a serious problem, these wolves are killing machines. If they happen upon a fawn, they WILL kill it, hungry or not!
And many could tell you what they're doing to their elk populations as well.
Canada allows hunting for them for a reason, I don't see why we can't do the same.
03-15-2010, 04:39 PM
#34
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Michigan
Posts: 275
LC, M9a9, with all due respect, I don't think anyone is talking about "wiping them out". All these guys are saying is they have to be taken off of the protected list, and have controlled hunting.
They were re-introduced, fine, but you can't have them populating out of control.
Michigans U.P. (and even N.Wisconsin) is having a serious problem, these wolves are killing machines. If they happen upon a fawn, they WILL kill it, hungry or not!
And many could tell you what they're doing to their elk populations as well.
Canada allows hunting for them for a reason, I don't see why we can't do the same.[/QUOTE]
I Couldn't have said it better myself and I agree completely..
They were re-introduced, fine, but you can't have them populating out of control.
Michigans U.P. (and even N.Wisconsin) is having a serious problem, these wolves are killing machines. If they happen upon a fawn, they WILL kill it, hungry or not!
And many could tell you what they're doing to their elk populations as well.
Canada allows hunting for them for a reason, I don't see why we can't do the same.[/QUOTE]
I Couldn't have said it better myself and I agree completely..
03-15-2010, 11:06 PM
#35
Typical Buck
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 996
I if would be possible to keep them on the protected list and have a managable way of hunting them I think a lot of both parties would be happy.
I think here in belgium wildlife doesn't feel the same kind of pressure as it does in the US. We have a total of 15.000 hunters on 10 million people. Everything is very carefully regulated ( maybe a bit too much.....)
What I have heard from the UK is that the foxhunting got banned because ( ok, it was a tradition ) a lot of footage was shown on tv of dogs tearing apart young and old foxes.
I think public opinion is a double edged sword and we as a hunter need to know how to wield it as well.
Sometimes I think we made laws to pamper the treehuggers and naturelovers and not to protect the wildlife.
I can hunt foxes from 1oct to 14feb at least 50 yards from their burrows during daylight hours and without snow on the ground.
But that keeps the "greens" as we call them happy.
F.
I think here in belgium wildlife doesn't feel the same kind of pressure as it does in the US. We have a total of 15.000 hunters on 10 million people. Everything is very carefully regulated ( maybe a bit too much.....)
What I have heard from the UK is that the foxhunting got banned because ( ok, it was a tradition ) a lot of footage was shown on tv of dogs tearing apart young and old foxes.
I think public opinion is a double edged sword and we as a hunter need to know how to wield it as well.
Sometimes I think we made laws to pamper the treehuggers and naturelovers and not to protect the wildlife.
I can hunt foxes from 1oct to 14feb at least 50 yards from their burrows during daylight hours and without snow on the ground.
But that keeps the "greens" as we call them happy.
F.
03-16-2010, 06:35 AM
#36
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: West Tennessee
Posts: 2,333
Littlechief, comparing wolves to the Native Americans is like comparing an orange to an apple... We are not talking about things that happen hundreds of years ago and we are talking about now..
LC, M9a9, with all due respect, I don't think anyone is talking about "wiping them out". All these guys are saying is they have to be taken off of the protected list, and have controlled hunting. They were re-introduced, fine, but you can't have them populating out of control.
03-16-2010, 08:39 AM
#37
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: ILLINOIS
Posts: 1,207
You're right, but I think DR is just showing the hatred that is growing for the wolves.
No doubt they're beautiful animals, and deserve to be here. But if they stay protected, more people are going to have the same feelings for them.
Bears kill plenty of deer, but we're allowed to hunt them to keep the numbers down (and they're still over populated in some areas).
In Illinois we can kill coyotes all year, with no limit, and they're still everywhere.
Why not the wolf?
No doubt they're beautiful animals, and deserve to be here. But if they stay protected, more people are going to have the same feelings for them.
Bears kill plenty of deer, but we're allowed to hunt them to keep the numbers down (and they're still over populated in some areas).
In Illinois we can kill coyotes all year, with no limit, and they're still everywhere.
Why not the wolf?
03-16-2010, 08:53 AM
#38
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: West Tennessee
Posts: 2,333
I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't be controlled and managed. I am in total agreement with you on that issue. They should be managed and their numbers controlled, and I know that would involve regulated wolf hunting. Even then it wouldn't be for me, though. Unless it's a direct and/or immediate threat to me or mine, I only kill what I intend to eat.
03-22-2010, 05:16 AM
#39
Spike
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 37
macman, maybe one deer a year and you put in that much work?? WOW, not to good if you ask me you must be doing something wrong.. i scout year around and have many nice animals to my credit not mention that I fill all my tag every year with quality animals and all with my bow.. I farm, scout, farm, scout, do food plots, check trail cams, plant some more food plots, hang stands, glass the fields all summer long (just about every night), manage my property, scout some more, and search for sheds.. In-between I bear hunt, turkey hunt, do some bird/rabbit hunting.. NOW, how is it that just because I hate the idea of wolves does it make you some sort of a better hunter?? I'm positive you and many more people out their don't do half what I do in order to manage the wildlife I have on my properties.. I bust may ass and spend countless hours in order to be more successful in the field and consider myself basically obsessed with bowhunting, an addict I guess.. So honestly macman you have no idea.. To clearify your foolishness, I put enough time in to do not only my homework but probably yours as well!! I have my reasoning behind not liking or wanting the wolves around and you may love them and that is fine.. And once again its not that i want them to be extinct but i would like to see a management plan in place before they do get out of control and in the areas that I am referring to there are plenty of wolfs (more then deer)... I however no longer hunt those areas, but that land is a waste now..
. I also don't consider it "work." Hunting is enjoyable, whether I get a deer or not.I'm not seeing how the fact that I'm against people who just want to kill all wolves is "foolinshness." And I DID say I support proper manageement, but every hunter who simply decides to wack a wolf is not "management" at all. Again, that kind of ignorance is how they almost got wiped out to begin with.
I stated that most of the hunters I come in contact with hate wolves for no reason, are lazy and/or so set in their ways and hunting methods that they fail to adapt to the changes in the the way the deer move around. I did not apply that to all hunters, period. And most of these hunters I come in contact with unreasonably blame the wolves for their lack of hunting success - they don't take into account weather, climate, disease, their own hunting methods, or just bad luck.
Somehow, I'm not making the connection between you, the "uber hunter" and wolf management.
When they don't live with Wolves they don't have a clue...Nuff Said
Last edited by macman99; 03-22-2010 at 05:21 AM.
03-23-2010, 02:42 PM
#40
Fork Horn
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location:
Posts: 145
Are you suggusting that the wolf introduction to certain areas is something that is positive?? This is the BIGGEST mistake that our DNR/Biologists have made in many years.. The Wolf is no better then a mangy coyote.. They are simple killers and anything and everything that gets into their way gets killed.. I know an outfitter in Canada that says that the wolves that he has on his properties kill more for the sport then for food, for every 5 deer they kill they eat one for food.. I have seen and experienced the devastration these preditors can do, they have single handedly cleaned house of the deer population in the U.P. of Michigan.. Now if these idoits want to introduce these pests then they should allow some sort of regulated control of them.. But in most places you can't touch them without serious trouble and they just keep growing and growing in population.. As far as I look at it, if your a wolf lover you're no better then a tree hugger!!
