mineral blocks and salt
 

does anyone thats not a deer cocaine salesmen know if the red trace mineral blocks for livestock are beneficial to deer in any way and if it is safe for them. i know its not gonna make for monster antlers but i do think salt licks are beneficial especially this time of the year for fawn health and bug control.i read one book that says to use just regular salt but if they can use the minerals without harm i would like to give it a try. the label on the red trace bricks say something about the copper in it isint good for sheep so thats the reason i would like to know if its safe for deer for sure.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

we' ve used it before... look at it this way.. if you have a farm and there are deer in the surrounding area.. dont you think that the deer are going to lick the blocks for the cows also??? use em! it wont hurt anything in my opinion.. I do not know how much nutritional value there is so if u use it I dont know if it will help any but shouldnt hurt

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

:)I have used the blocks and the bag loose type also with great success, The does really hit it hard this time of year since they are milking and need the extra for the fawns.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

The trace mineral block containing copper that is used for cattle is also recommended for deer, but not for sheep.

I spread several throughout my hunting areas along with ground pits containing rock salt used for making ice cream. Just make sure the mineral blocks and the salt are not too close to your stand if your state has laws governing hunting over or near food plots.

The deer will start consuming the mineral block(s) and salt in early spring through mid summer.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

i love this board. its nice to get answers so quickly to questions i have pondered for years. i have been putting out bags of pellet salt from home depot as well as the cattle red trace mineral blocks and they are really ripping them up right now. i had to replenish my sites 3 times already. i put a cheap 79$ bass pro trail camera on one of the sites and i cant wait for the results i would like to comment though that during the hunting season here in new jersey i hunt close to these mineral sites and have only seen once last year that a yearling came in late in the season and actually took a mouthfull of the salt and dirt and ate it. i have never seen a full grown buck or doe come in and use the site during late september till end of january. thats why i think its important to get these minerals and salt out now if your gonna help the herd. thanks!

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

My local feed store has deer blocks. Kind of a mineral-salt block with some molasses thrown in. The deer like them and I believe they are good for the Doe' s who are nursing. I think Tractor' s Supply has them too.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

i tried a couple different times to use the deer block with the corn and molassas and oats in it but they wouldnt touch it at all. i use to buy horse sweet mix which is a mixture of corn molassas and i think alphalpha oats. its lighter and cheaper than bagged corn butthey didnt seem to like that too much either. then a guy told me that the oats in it go bad quickly and get mold when thrown on the ground and the deer know that it is gonna get them sick.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

I got a mineral recipe off of this board last year from a guy who got it from a wildlife biologist. I don' t have it with me but it had trace mineral salt in it, ice cream salt (not rock salt), and some other type of mineral cn' t quite remember what exactly it was. But I bought all of this at my local Agway cost me about 35 bucks total for all of it combined. I had enough to do 5 or 6 licks and freshen them up a couple of times each. The deer seem to love it I haven' t put any on since last august and the deer are really tearing the licks up. Maybe if you ask on this board somebody else has the recipe and they could post it for you. It has to be safe since a wildlife biologist sugessted it. One thing I do remember is that you have to get the trace mineral salt and the other stuff with no medications in it.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

We use some of the red trace mineral in our mix. The deer really love it. We have some pics out of what they are doing and you can look at them at www.sccoutdoors.com . This is the time of year that minerals are most benificial to the deer. You should look for something that helps mainly in these 3 things, Antler development, Weight gain and milk production. If you help these 3 things then the whole herd will benifit. Don' t forget in QDM that there is no overnight fix. If you want results it will take alot of planning and a whole lot of action.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Here is a recipe that is very close to a formula I have used in " mineral pits" for sometime with very good results. I have witnessed that deer have eventually established feeding routes (patterns) that take them through the " pit" areas from spring through the first (approx) two weeks in October.

I formulated my recipe after having a discussion with a deer biologist I met in the field several years ago. The small difference in the recipe in the following link and my recipe is that I use a cattle block to obtain the Dicalcium Phosphate and Trace Mineral Salt, and granulate the block and ice cream salt together with a 60-year old Hobart commercial coffee grinder.

HOWEVER, if you are not familiar with cattle blocks, or do not want to take the time to research all the scientific names of all the minerals in a certain type of block, I strongly suggest that you use the posted recipe (link). Some cattle blocks contain Urea, particular protein sources, and fluorides that could be very bad for deer...or cattle, if too much is consumed per day.

This posted recipe appears to be very specific and safe.

http://walden.mvp.net/~gam/Mineral%20Page.htm

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

we have been using trace mineral blocks for years. put half a mineral block and half aplain white salt block in an old stump hole in the spring and deer will tear it up. don' t use the deer cocaine though. we heard from a friend who owns a sporting goods store who sold it that it may be harmfull

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

they seem to love the deer cocaine or similar stuff but the chemical in it is nothing more than MSG a preservative that makes chinese food and potato chips taste so good along with a million other junk food products.the problem is that it goes by quite a few trade names to confuse the customers. DICALCIUM PHOSPHATE is one of them i believe. its the taste that gets them addicted but i dont think it has any nutritional value. any chemists or nutritionists out there?

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Monosodium Glutamate (MSG), a tasteless taste enhancer, is a sodium derivative obtained from natural occuring amino acids. MSG has no nutritional value and it is not a preservative. MSG has no taste but fools your brain to believe something tastes good... when it might not.

MSG is not the dicalcium phosphate used in livestock diet.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

mineral supplement' s do not increase a buck' s antler growth. Pike

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Pike,

I would disagree!!!

Not all minerals help antler growth, but if you give them the right ones it will help them!

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad_Hunter, This is why Liquidorange asked for this question to be answered by people who are not Deer Cocaine salesmen, And since you produce and market SCC. Mineral Gravy, of cousre you would claim that it increases Antler Growth. Here are a few links that claim otherwise 2 of them being from C.J. Winand. Click on the link below and scroll down to the last question on the page. Pike,
www.bowsite.com/bowsite/kb/ASK.cfm?section_id=3&StartRow=36

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad_Hunter here is another quoute by C.J. On the subject. Pike,

http://www.bowsite.com/bowsite/kb/ASK.cfm?section_id=3&StartRow=1

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad_Hunter, here is another link, It is for a QDMA. article and citres 3 different studies. Pike,,http://www.qdma.com/articles/detail.asp?ID=97

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

i saw an hour long program that explained that msg and di calcium phosphate and a couple other names were in deed the same thing. they are added to food all the time but use it to make food taste sweeter and saltier. some people react to it not so well that was what the show was trying to uncover. do deer really need that? i think not!

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

liquid

Not that it is that important, but you must have misunderstood what was being said. Phosphorus (phosphoric acid) and calcium are no where close to being the same, or nearly the same, as a glutamate (glutamic acid) and monosodium. The difference is as a rock is to wood.

Both elements can be found together in a particular substance (product), however, the ingredient purpose and the value of each element is totally and separately different.

Dicalcium Phosphate and Tricalcium phosphate is commonly used as a filler and binder. The substance is also used to keep certain granular and flour-like products from " clumping.

Many pills and capsules contain Dicalcium and Tricalcium Phosphate. I do not believe people taking high blood pressure medication would appreciate having a sodium element in their medication.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

This plainly states that they do have a role. This is why we produce the Mineral Gravy, it is not a magic bullet. If you put all of the resources together then I will guarantee that you will see a difference in the body weight, antler growth and overall herd development. Below in not a quote from me but from one of the sources you posted on. We do not claim that you just throw minerals out and then sit there and you will kill the next world record, but from what we have found it will help to increase the areas liste above.



By the way we tell everyone that we are in no way like Deer Cocaine. They advertise as a draw to hunt over. That was and still is not our goal. It is to give the minerals that they need when they need it. If you wait until October to put stuff out you are just wasting your time. The time that they need this is early spring and summer. So if someone is looking for something to hunt over then we try to tell them they probably want something else, if they want to try to help the deer herd then the Mineral Gravy is designed for that.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad_ hunter, It says THERE IS NO SCIENTIFIC DATA EVER WRITTEN TO SUPPORT THAT STATMENT, NOR HAS ANY STUDY BEEN CONDUCTED THAT SHOWED ANY INCREASE IN ANTLER SIZE.

If you read down farther you will see the results of actual studies down on this subject

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Think what you want, I know first hand what it can do. I am not a scientist, rocket or other wise, but since we and others we know have been putting out the best food plots we could and adding mineral suppliments along with it we have seen an increase. If you don' t want to believe it that is fine, we just think you are only hurting yourself.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

I personally do not use mineral pits for the purpose of hopefully affecting antler growth. I doubt that introduced minerals are a rapid panacea. However, just like the person who follows a nutritious diet but also takes daily vitamins; it cannot hurt, and may help, down the road.

A friend of mine whom has a degree in animal sciences owns one of the areas I hunt. He raises Sika and Red deer. He feeds the deer minerals mainly for health and body growth. I will take a 300 lb. buck with 4-points any day.

As for his deer management regarding the Whitetails in his area, the only management he applies is a rule to leave a certain amount of superior bucks in the population. That is why he enforces a " slot" rule on his property.

He firmly believes, and I totally agree, that the pursuit of big antlers craze is going to eventually have a devastating affect on the health and genetics of deer populations that they (wild deer) may never totally recover from.

He also is concerned that much of the natural forage that deer vitally need is rapidly disappearing, and that soybeans, corn, and clover just cannot provide all that wild deer need in their diet. With that in mind, it just might come to having to provide many of the minerals by forage plots and mineral pits.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad-Hunter said"
Nice try to Spin, but we are not talking about food Plots, I have Have No doubt that your seeing an increase due to your Food Plot' s, and your probably shooting as many doe as possible (which is great) But Mineral Supplements such as your Mineral Gravy do not increase Antler size!! Please provide one link or source, study, or sceintific paper that backs up your claim!! Here is a link to an Outdoor Life Article that Implies that claiming YOUR product creates Bigger Antlers is a sales Ploy. Pike,
http://www.outdoorlife.com/outdoor/popup2/aolPopupAd.html?1

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

I think that you have me figured wrong. I am not trying to sell you on Mineral Gravy. This is not my full time job, we just put it out because we had been asked how and where to purchase it so we put it out. Now that that is clear let me explain where I am comming from. Like was stated in another post up above, we have found that if you provide good food plots, minerals, don' t kill the small bucks and kill some does then all of this together will help you to see the potential of the herd. If you leave one of these out then I don' t think you will see the full potential of the herd. Some places that have tremendous crops (because of minerals that are already in the ground) that draw the minerals from the ground and then can be found in the crop itself would probably not do as much good for them because they are getting all that they can use in the crops they eat. Not everyone is blessed to live in such a place, so we feel they need to supplement the mineral part as well as put out the best food plots available. Nothing is a quick fix it takes time for all of these things to work.

So once again if you are looking for a quick fix then you are barking up the wrong tree. Take a look at where alot of the scientific stuff is done, in places where the soil is full of rich minerals. Of course they are getting everything through the food they eat and adding minerals probably does not give them any more, but not everyone is blessed to be in these areas. So once again this is not a sales pitch just our observation. If you still disagree that is fine no hard feelings we will just agree to disagree.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

If you really want to help with minerals and increase deer health you don' t have to put out suplaments or plant food plots you can just fertilize native forage. We fertilize honeysuckle or certian white oaks you kill two birds with one stone the deer get the minerals from the plants plus better forage, they can tell the differance they will come for the acorns under fertilized tree' s first

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Buckshot47,

Good point, we have also found that the deer prefer the oaks that have been fertilized. One thing for people to realize is that they cannot wait until hunting season to decide to put stuff out.

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad-hunter, No hard feeling' s on my end either, and I agree doing all the things you mentioned above will dramictly improve the health of your herd, (except Mineral supplements) the fact still remain' s that Mineral supplements do not increase antler size, The pre existing mineral content in the soil has nothing to do with it because a deer' s body cannot utilize the minerals in supplements for antler growth. Now you just stated that in Good soil mineral supplements will have no affect, but in your previous post you stated that you are seeing increased antler growth from your supplements, You Hunt In IL. Soil doesnt get much better than that. Pike

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

I hunt in IL, KY, OH, IN, but I live in TN. The soil does not get much more rocky or sandy. This is not farm land from around here. I am putting out a new trail camera and I will try to post some pics out as soon as I get them back in. Basically the soil stinks around here where I live. That is why I head out of state alot to do some hunting. Isn' t it good to disagree and still not get mad and hate each other. Wish other people could do the same!!!

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

Mad-hunter what part of OH. Do you Hunt? I hunt in SE. OH. Pike

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

B&N Coal, INC Lands in southeastern OH. Noble and Washington Co. or Turkey Run Public Hunting Area in Perry County. It' s all public but the best I can do for right now!!!

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

just checked out my cheapo trail camera and its working great. rewound some of the film on accident but out of the 9 pictures 2 were does one was a fawn and the rest were a couple different bucks with velvet horns 2 inches in length and the bigger had a split already. there really tearing up my mineral bricks.im gonna put the camera back out in august. OH! WHAT FUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

The cameras are fun!! Specially when you get buck pics.[8D]

RE: mineral blocks and salt
 

I must say I was even surprised when we walked up to this mineral site. This has been out for about 5 weeks. 3 weeks ago it was 1/2" deep and about 10" across. It is now 8" deep and 15" across (aprox). This is in the middle of the forest floor with nothing around on a slope. My hunting partner is in the picture with the mineral site. As you can see our soil is poor and rocky (see the huge rock in the bottom of the mineral site they have dug around!!!