Does the loop on your string effect draw length?
08-21-2009, 08:21 AM
#61
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HENDERSON KY USA
Posts: 6,634
So I can shoot a 24" bow with 4.5" d loop and reach my 28.5 inch shooter draw length and all is ok? So in other words the bows draw length doesn't matter because all can be adjusted by the loop?
I don't think you all are recognizing what a shorter or longer draw length bow will do to your sight picture and form. If I have a 28" bow that barely touches my nose at full draw with my head in perfect alignment what will happen when I change the bows draw length to 28.5"? The string will now be .5" past where it was meeting my nose at 28". I'm forced to turn my head or lean back. I have to adjust and begin to compromise sight and form. My sight picture turns away from the target. Move it to 29" and I turn further away or lean further back. Move it to 30" and my head is pointed further away. Move it back to 28" inches and my head is turned toward the target and my head is brought back into alignment without leaning back. Do you see the effect a bow's draw length has on your head and body?
So maybe you say, "But your elbow is pointed way up?" well then I need a longer d loop to bring my elbow back down, but I don't need to make the draw length on my bow longer. Maybe you say "my elbow is too low", well then I have to shorten my loop or my release. But by doing those I don't compromise sight picture or body position, I'm only adjusting my hand position and the efficiency at which I hold the bow at full draw.
I don't think you all are recognizing what a shorter or longer draw length bow will do to your sight picture and form. If I have a 28" bow that barely touches my nose at full draw with my head in perfect alignment what will happen when I change the bows draw length to 28.5"? The string will now be .5" past where it was meeting my nose at 28". I'm forced to turn my head or lean back. I have to adjust and begin to compromise sight and form. My sight picture turns away from the target. Move it to 29" and I turn further away or lean further back. Move it to 30" and my head is pointed further away. Move it back to 28" inches and my head is turned toward the target and my head is brought back into alignment without leaning back. Do you see the effect a bow's draw length has on your head and body?
So maybe you say, "But your elbow is pointed way up?" well then I need a longer d loop to bring my elbow back down, but I don't need to make the draw length on my bow longer. Maybe you say "my elbow is too low", well then I have to shorten my loop or my release. But by doing those I don't compromise sight picture or body position, I'm only adjusting my hand position and the efficiency at which I hold the bow at full draw.
I am saying you use BOTH,the loop and the bows draw length to achieve optimum draw length and anchors to achieve optimum draw length for the venue you are going to shoot.The fact that the loop is even on the bow requires a shorter setting on the bow,that clearly means the loop affected draw length.Come on,it really is that simple.
Some shooters may not see the need to change draw lengths but MANY do.
When I shot a short loop,it(the bow) was too short unless I increased the bows draw length.I was able to achieve all my anchors and proper body positions at that point.
08-21-2009, 08:30 AM
#62
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HENDERSON KY USA
Posts: 6,634
SO TFOX.....If I inderstand you....there are MANY potential "Correct" DL's an archer could have....even though he's using the same bow; same release aid; same anchor point references (string position is correct)?
Really?
You don't remember RJ on here talking about how he sets his indoor bows up longer than his 3-d bows and his hunting bows even shorter.It is common practice.The changes are not usually more than a 1/4" and many do it in varying ways.Twist on strings,cable twist ,loop length adjustments and/or draw length module adjustments.
There is no "optimal"?
Did you answer this question???
Really?
You don't remember RJ on here talking about how he sets his indoor bows up longer than his 3-d bows and his hunting bows even shorter.It is common practice.The changes are not usually more than a 1/4" and many do it in varying ways.Twist on strings,cable twist ,loop length adjustments and/or draw length module adjustments.
There is no "optimal"?
Did you answer this question???
YES,there are many optimal settings,just like there are different optimum setting for the peep height.When I was shooting 3-d from the open stake I set my peep at the optimum for 33 yards(average shot),when hunting I set it closer to optimum for 25 or so.
If I were shooting I would set it for 50 or 60 most likely.
You don't remember RJ on here talking about how he sets his indoor bows up longer than his 3-d bows and his hunting bows even shorter.It is common practice.The changes are not usually more than a 1/4" and many do it in varying ways.Twist on strings,cable twist ,loop length adjustments and/or draw length module adjustments.
It's a dumb question that requires no answer.
08-21-2009, 08:30 AM
#63
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
unless I increased the bows draw length.
TFox...this is like a broken record. Forget about initial setup. Say you've gone through it your way....and subsequently decide to change your loop length. Did you change the DL?....or....move your anchor?
And why in hell do you keep referencing adjusting different bows. That's ridiculous.
08-21-2009, 08:39 AM
#64
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HENDERSON KY USA
Posts: 6,634
How did you increase the bow's DL?
TFox...this is like a broken record. Forget about initial setup. Say you've gone through it your way....and subsequently decide to change your loop length. Did you change the DL?....or....move your anchor?
And why in hell do you keep referencing adjusting different bows. That's ridiculous.
TFox...this is like a broken record. Forget about initial setup. Say you've gone through it your way....and subsequently decide to change your loop length. Did you change the DL?....or....move your anchor?
And why in hell do you keep referencing adjusting different bows. That's ridiculous.
They aren't just different bows,they are adjusted longer,to get behind the shot,anchors can be adjusted accordingly.
The damn question is does the loop affect draw length and there is no way around it,it does Plain and simple.If you shoot without a loop the bow HAS GOT TO BE SET LONGER.If you shoot with one,it has to be set shorter.The anchors change as well.
What you have from there is semantics and really does't matter.
Last edited by TFOX; 08-21-2009 at 09:03 AM.
08-21-2009, 08:52 AM
#65
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
T...If you think it's Ok for the guy to shoot a 4.5" loop.....then I give up.
Semantics...different philosophies.....refusal by me to science boink this....whatever. Every time I set criteria....you change it.
This is pointless. Have a great weekend (sincerely).
Semantics...different philosophies.....refusal by me to science boink this....whatever. Every time I set criteria....you change it.
This is pointless. Have a great weekend (sincerely).
08-21-2009, 09:01 AM
#66
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HENDERSON KY USA
Posts: 6,634
It isn't about your criteria,that's what you seem to miss. The loop affects the draw length,plain and symple.No way around it.
Shoot with a loop and what has to be done? Now shoot without one,now what has to be done.That is the whole point.
We can argue the semantics about the loop length and where does draw length start but I really don't care one way or another about that.
08-21-2009, 10:19 AM
#67
Spike
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Perry, New York
Posts: 77
I've shot both with and without a loop, and the only difference was my anchor point was moved further back with a loop. I've shot rope releases, caliper heads, t-handle and wrist strap releases...the one consistant factor was my draw length, it always remains 26.5".
Last edited by treestandsnyper; 08-21-2009 at 10:22 AM.
08-21-2009, 10:30 AM
#68
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HENDERSON KY USA
Posts: 6,634
I've shot both with and without a loop, and the only difference was my anchor point was moved further back with a loop. I've shot rope releases, caliper heads, t-handle and wrist strap releases...the one consistant factor was my draw length, it always remains 26.5".
08-21-2009, 10:52 AM
#69
Spike
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Perry, New York
Posts: 77
