Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Im VERY close to buying a DXT and have heard that if you have to change draw lengths, you have to change the cams...which is over $100 or so to do. Ive never heard of something like this, i thought bows are normally adjustable in length/weight?

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

They are adjustable in ten pound increments, so like 60-70, 50-60, etc. But if you want to change from a 60-70 bow to a bow that is 50-60 then you will need a cam change..

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

oh sorry...I meant if you change draw LENGTHS...i heard you have to change cams.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Yes- all mathews bows use a draw length specific cam. This keeps nock travel and performance at peak on a single cam design. IF you bought the bow new, dealers will just put in the appropriate cam- if you bought it used, yeah you can figure on $100 bucks or so to have it replaced.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Check the AT classifieds for the cam you're looking for.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Also if you are comfortable with using ebay, you can get some pretty good deals on cams there.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

you need diff. limbs if you want to change from a 50-60 to a 60-70 not a cam change...

u are correct that you need a cam change with the changing of a draw length

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

right mathews.. my post was intended for the draw length change.. i was in a rush to get out the door and ipostedit wrong..

What i should have said was a switch from 60-70 bow to a 50-60 bow will merit a limb change, and a switch from a 28" DL to a 27" DL will require a cam change..

Good pickup on my mistake..

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Mathews Bows have always been that way. It is a PIA for a dealer for sure.

Believe it or not productioncosts are cheaper going the cam per draw length route over going the module route.

Dan

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

They say its more efficient that way...why is that??

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Personally I hate draw specific cams for one reason.......sometimes its harder to resell. Also, if I want to give the bow to a member of my family later on I usually would have to get the cams changed.

In my experience from the dealers in my area they generally make you buy a new set of cams and won't swap cams on a bow that has been shot.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

my dealer swaps them out.. just make sure you get a DXT specific cam

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Its more efficient because the cam will roll over specifically for your draw length and will build its pull strength at the appropriate rate based on your DL...
if that makes sense..

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

lol..uh...a little bit.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

That's what they preach![8D]LOL!

I think the fact it's a cheaper way to go for manufacturing may have more to do with it.;)

Dan

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

It only makes sense that bows will work best for a draw length specific cam. That's why people find that with modules, the lower on the module you are...the slightly less performance you will get at peak. But I agree, the difference is likely so slim in todays bows it might not be much different.

Hoyt went from modules to draw specific cams, and this year went back to modules.

IMO, it has more to do with ease for dealers than anything. Dealers would have to order 5-7 bows of the same model to stock all necessary draw lengths, where as with modules only 2-3 bows would cover any DL. Helps them keep bows in stock for ANY customer, without HUMONGOUS overhead...not to mention having all the bows left over at the end of the year when the next years line ups come out and they have to offload them at discounted prices to make room. Draw specific cams leave dealers with two choices, having HUGE overhead and stocking alot of bows, or keeping only the 29" 70# cookie cutter bows stock and making most customers wait to order theirs in...possibly loosing a customer who is buying on a whim and wants a bow NOW. Really leaves them in a predicament.

Modules are for the dealers, not the shooters. (not that they are bad for the shooters)

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Anyone wanting to swap cams on a bow they bought used or the shop wont do it for you.....remember, you dont HAVE to keep yours! You can buy a set of cams on AT or somewhere, then offload yours for roughly the same price. Basically a free, or really cheap swap, for the cost of your headache of going through the process of finding some then selling yours.

ATs classifieds are a goldmine of archery gear, both new and used.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

The difference in effeciency believe me is slight. It's not only the dealers it's convenient for but also the owners.

Ever here of anyone needing to fine tune their draw a half inch?

Or ready to sell a bow but no Cams to fit the prospective buyer? It doesn't make the New buyer real eager to lay down $$$either.;)

I think thebottom line is it's cheaper tomanufacture Draw specific cams than module adjustable Cams, but then I'm sure No one would inconvenience their dealers or customers to save a few $$:eek:

Call it however you want. It is what it is;)

Dan

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Speaking of that... kdsberman, you better make sure you know what your "mathews draw length" is before you buy one. Get measured on the specific bow you plan to purchase - they tend to run a tad long. You might befine tuning from the start with a new cam if you don't.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

On 1 cam bows,draw specific cams are necessary to achieve level nock travel.


Dan,draw specific cams are more efficient than you might think.I am losing about 10 fps on my Am 35 because I am not shooting it at it's peak draw length(30")(I could tweak some more speed but chose not to)Your BT's do the same,everyone I have run numbers for are slower than what they would shoot with draw length specific cams.Specific draw cams almost always hit their speed rating at lower draw lengths where as adjustable sytems do not.

All my Hoyts have always shot faster,by quite a bit at lower draw lengths than adjustable models.

Hoyt has made adjustable draw length cams that have specific draw lengths to them which imo,is the best way to go about it.Basically draw length specific tunability and efficiency with the adjustability of module systems.AND,this is not cheaper to do.

I basically have seen roughly a 5 fps loss per inch (from 30")when the cam is adjustable verses a draw specific cam,or one that is designed for specific draw length.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Yep I bought 2 Xtecs testing that very thing. The only difference being the size cam. It didn't make a diffrence in my draw length with that bow. I've had more than one Bow manufacturer tell me the reason it's done is cost...................................

But then they are going to Blow the more effecient horn. Any difference is Not worth the pain in the butt it creates to properly fit a customer.

You know how many times I've seen someone shooting the wrong draw length because that's what the dealer had and it was close?

Too Many Times!!;)

Face it your average off the street Bowhunter will listen to what a dealer tells him about his draw length needs! Looks Great!! Comes right back to your nose!!

Boy I've heard that one a few times!:eek:

Dan

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

That is a good post TFOX.

I have that Iron Mace of mine that has Trinary cams (basically its just a different name for Binaries like found on BowTech) and there is a massive performance difference, even on the SAME draw length depending on if you are using short draw mods or long draw mods. 10fps lost right off the top going from long to short, even in a 29" draw. That said though, the hell with the speed loss! I shoot that thing better at 28.5" with a longer valley and higher let off for my 29" draw length.

As to being cheaper to manufacture.... MeanV would be one to know. I am sure they are probably cheaper to develop, and I am certain that draw length specific cams are going to produce a more uniform draw cycle no matter what draw length you have. It might be a pain for the customer when it comes to resale... but frankly neither your dealer nor probably the manufacturer is concerned about the person buying your used bow.... they'd rather have you buy a new one. That isn't a slam... that is simple common sense. Your dealer is not in business to make things convienient for you... he is in business to make money. Now that said, if he wants to make money, convienience has a lot to do with it in the long run.... but anyone who tells you the customer is priority one is lying or else missing the forrest for the trees.... priority one is money.... and if it isn't, then you won't be in business very long.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

They may be out there, but I've yet to meet or talk to a dealer that prefers Draw specific cams.

As a matter of fact the new rotating mod BowTechis usingthis year has been very well accepted by Dealers and customers alike.

I shot Mathews for 6 years and to be honest the PIA with the Draw specific cams and the fact that no 2 models at 28" draw were the same was one reason I moved on.

That wasn't the only one but it was one of the reasons;)

I hope INever have to shoot a Draw Specific cam again. As a matter of Fact. I won't unless there are No other options.[8D]

Dan

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Because that's the way they do it.[&:] Plus, probably more efficient in manufacturing. When you get into modules and all that it's more drilling for screws and all that. Probably cost about the same to make a cam without modulesas it does to make a module. Make the came draw length specific and you've built in optimum performance without all the hassle. Bows that have different screws like a
Darton to shift the cam are not as efficient in some holes. Well maybe they're efficient, but you have a different feel during the draw.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

If the dealer is quick to push someone out the door with the wrong DL, what would keep them from doing the same with modules? If they aren't taking the time to do it right, the problem is the dealer..not the cam.

I agree that I like modules better. But I think it has LITTLE to do with the shooter and ease of switching setupsand ALOT to do with pleasing dealers and allowing them littler inventory with less leftover bows at the end of the season....plus less custom ordering bows just because a DL is off.

It is what it is, both work fine...both are VERY cheap to free to switch out. If you buy your bow new from a shop, MANY will swap cams for free...and if you didnt, you can buy a set for about the same that yours will bring, making it near a free swap anyway.

Pretty interesting that they are cheaper to manufacture, I wouldnt have thought that, but like Swamp said...you would be the one to know though Dan. I just figured with Modules, they are designing/tweeking say 2-3 different cams, while with draw specific they have to design/tweek upwards of 9-10. But from the sounds of it, it is just alot harder to get it right with the module cams, thus the higher cost. Pretty interesting stuff.

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

Did you just ask this?

If you were a dealer which would you rather inventory? A whole set of cams to change draw lengths for each model?

A set of Modules to change the Draw lengths for each Cam on each model?

Andwith the new rotating mods the only way you send someone out the door with the wrong draw length is through your own stupidity;)

At least they can change the draw lengthvery easilyif or when they or someone else realizes it's wrong.

Also if you are going to change the Draw length, would you rather take the time to change Cams out completely? Change Modules? or just move a rotating Module?

Tough Questions I know[8D]

Dan

RE: Is it true about Mathews cams?
 

The difference in price will depend upon how the cam systems are made.The Hoyt cam 1/2 system which is adjustable is probably one of the most expensive to manufacture.They have/had multiple drilling cycles,different modules and they have different cams for different draw length ranges and have a specific efficiency draw lengths within each draw length model.Plus,they have differnt limbs for each along with strings and cable length differences.


I understand the reasons behind adjustabilty and they are all valid reasons.Easier resale,easier to stock for dealers but I have found I like specific,or atleast cams designed at specific draw lengths,even if they have some adjustabilty.I like them so much that I am checking on Z3 cams for my AM35.

I feel Hoyt will offer a draw length specific cam next year similar to the Z3 for a bow that is similar to the AM bows.