Cull buck?
 

The question I have for everyone is, would you personally cull this buck out of the herd? It's obvious that he is at least a 2 year old, and looks like he will never get bigger than a 7 point (but I'll never know if I shoot him). I personally have put him on my hit list, IMO he has inferior antler genetics.
This buck is in a very good area, and I have my eye on some that are alot larger. Where I hunt here in Wisconsin, we can shoot as many bucks as we earn. Shoot a doe, get a buck tag, so my season would not be over if I shot him.
Would you shoot him, as a cull buck if you had more than 1 tag? Or if you had only 1 tag, would you shoot a cull buck....... When youknew there were bigger ones in the area?

RE: Cull buck?
 

Thats not a cull for me, its a trophy.

RE: Cull buck?
 

I'd shoot that deer.....but not because he has "inferior genetics". I'd shoot him for his trophy value, to ME.

I dislike the term "cull buck". As far as I know.....a whitetail's antler potential isn't known until at least his 3rd set of hard antlers. By the time they grow thos, though........he's a trophy in most people's book on age alone. He's mature.

Good luck if you decide to take him, though.;)

RE: Cull buck?
 

Here, in SC, that's not a cull...that's one for the wall.

Where you are...I still might give him another year. He could still turn in to a great buck.

RE: Cull buck?
 

I don't know dude if he's only 2.5 this fall, which I agree that is what he looks to be, he's got some really good beam length and awesome G2s for a 2.5. I'd let him walk if I were in your shoes to see what he turns out as a 3.5. If he gets another G3 you get all of your H scores and he'll have towering G2s and great brows. He'd probably gross close to 140".

FWIW, I'd have a hard time letting him walk in PA.

RE: Cull buck?
 

That is definatly a cull buck! I would have no problem putting my buck tag on him!

RE: Cull buck?
 

Would you shoot him, as a cull buck if you had more than 1 tag? Nope. If he's a 2.5 year old like you say I would see what he looks like the following year 1st.

Or if you had only 1 tag, would you shoot a cull buck....... When youknew there were bigger ones in the area? Nope.

RE: Cull buck?
 

Right on Jeff.

The term "cull buck" is the lamest term and idea I have ever heard of in the whitetail world. Does anyone actually think they'll get the genetics out of the herd by killing one buck? You better start finding his sisters too and get rid of them. ;)

IMHO Texas ranches came up the the term "cull" and "management" bucks to find a way to make some money on the less desireable bucks. Most everybody wants a "trophy" buck, but won't pay for it. So they came up with "management" buck, dropped the price and now people will pay to shoot them.

Want to determine a true trophy? Let's look at their teeth. ;)

RE: Cull buck?
 

At 2.5, I think that deer has plenty of potential. He may never be more than a 7, but he is a 7 with great length and in a year or two, should have great mass. If you have bigger boys running around, focus on them and let this guy get another year or two. I think he is a great looking buck with tons of character.

RE: Cull buck?
 

X3

Let him grow. You'll probably be pleasantly surprised with results ;)

RE: Cull buck?
 

IMO, if thats a 2.5 year old deer, he has great potential. A deer will not hit its antler potential until he is atleast 4.5 years old with good nutrition. Let him go another year if your after bigger and you might be shocked at what he grows into.

Unless you have a high fenced ranch and know the genetics of every single animal in that fence, it is IMPOSSIBLE to change the genetics of the herd.

RE: Cull buck?
 

I can’t stand the term cull buck. I’m not shooting a buck and calling it a “cull” regardless of how many tags I have. That there is a real nice buck, one more year, 7 pts or not & he’s a shooter for me. He’s almost a shooter as it stands. I don’t think you can change the genetics of a free ranging herd to any degree just by “culling” out less desirable bucks.

HOWEVER, someone did explain the “Cull” buck term that to me made more sense than the getting rid of its genetics. They said that on those high managed farms, a buck that was old, but wasn’t going to hit trophy status needed culled, just because it was another mouth to feed. Had nothing to do with inferior genetics. When it wasn’t going to be a high priced trophy, it fell into the category just like taking a doe for numbers management. No sense keeping around another mouth to feed that wasn’t going to pull in the big $$. To me, that makes more sense. Even though I still don’t buy into the ultra-highly managed philosophy on many of those ranches.

RE: Cull buck?
 

Now that is worth quoting!!! Brilliant!

RE: Cull buck?
 

The term "cull buck" bothers me too, Ry. The whole goal of QDM is supposedly to grow "old" bucks - and let them reach their genetic potential... So if you're an antler-addict, your goal(simply put) is to have Land X with carrying capacity Y stocked with as many old bucks as possible. An age structure that looks like this:



But let's be real here.



Obviously, most areas are population-heavy with 1.5 year old bucks. That should come as no surprise to anyone. Check out the graph above. The moral of the story here is that half of all male deer are dead before their 2nd birthday. Store that in the back of your mind. We'll come back to it.

So, if you really want to shoot a buck, just for the sake of shooting a buck - but you still keep the long-term goal in mind of practicing QDM and letting your bucks reach their genetic potential... Wouldn't it be better to shoot a yearling buck, and let that weak 2.5 go?A 2.5 year old buck is already halfway to maximizing his genetic potential.He's got a 50% shot of seeing 3.5 years old.

I mean, your average 1.5 year old buck has a 30% chance of being harvested by a hunter, a 10% chance of dying of natural causes, and a 10% chance of being illegally harvested. So, basically - there's a 50% chance that this buck is going to die before 2.5anyway. He's only got a 25% of making it to 3.5. (50% x 50%)

So, aren't you in essence, defeating your own purposes by "culling" a buck that's already beat the odds? Realistically, a 2.5 year old buck is only a year away from turning out a really solid rack. Why shoot a buck just to shoot a buck - under the pretense of "culling" him?

If you want to shoot a buck just to shoot a buck, you're statistically better-served by going out andkilling a spike instead. Chances are, he's gonna die anyway. Right? This is a reality that is oft-overlooked by most self-proclaimed "deer managers."

Get out your hip waders: Ryan's right -each deer is 99.9999999999% genetically similar. You can't change the genetics by culling deer. If you want bigger racks, give them better food,more timeandless stress. If you think you're affecting thegenetic dynamics of your herd by shooting one deer - the joke's on you.

The "Mouth To Feed" Argument - I understand the line of thinking, that you will take a weak 2.5 out of the herd, to "free-up" a slot for another deer to move into the range... But seriously - does it REALLY work that way in practice? Is it really as simple as a one-for-one trade? Are there reallya bunch of strong1.5 year old bucks lined-up on the neighboringproperty line waiting for their admission ticket to your land? "Gee willikers - looks like Farmer Smith finally culled Buck#4056 out of the herd, that opens up a spot for me. I think I'll move in now." Sher.



Off Topic- most guys who "think" they're practicing QDM are working with a couple-hundred acres. In reality, these deer are free-ranging and foraging over a much wider range, coming and going at their leisure.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I think if you're trying to grow big deer, and you have a 2.5 year old on your land - who might not have the "best" genetics, you're making a mistake by "culling" him. He's already there. He's already proven that he has the survival skills. He just needs more time.

You're just shooting a decentbuck because you want to shoot a decent buck.

"Culling" 2.5 year old bucks on small land plots seems (to me, at least) to be both counterintuitive and counterproductive.

RE: Cull buck?
 

So do I get to kill him, or not?










;)

RE: Cull buck?
 

Dan.. you and I are like peas in a pod.:)

RE: Cull buck?
 

I hope that doesn't mean you want me to crawl in a sleeping bag with you this November. [&:][8D]

RE: Cull buck?
 

Not a cull buck IMO...

Where I hunt it is a shooter, but in many places in the midwest I would have to let him grow if it was feasible...

RE: Cull buck?
 

Seeing you said there where other deer you had your sights on... That sounds like a NO too me??!!

Maybe you could have a friend / relative / young hunter that isn't as fortunate as you, to cull that nice deer for you.
Seeing you have such a nice inventory of deer to choose from, just think of how better of a hunter YOU would be?!!?!!?

That's my vote

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RE: Cull buck?
 

I wouldnt say hes a cull buck but a great management buck at that. Take him and hang him.

RE: Cull buck?
 

If he is 2.5, how is he a cull buck? Good lucking deer to me. If he is not to you, I would let him go another year. I don't know how that is a cull buck.
Chris