being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I know that I havent really paid much attention to this but it seems that deer and their yellow-grey sight see us as a glowing blue light...and twice as much with blaze orange.

Im definately buying some UV-killer for my camo, stands, backpack, etc.

This is an interesting video clip that scared the crap out of me. http://link17.streamhoster.com/?u=atskoinc&p=%2FMEDIUM.wmv&odaid=6421. It seems that 99% of all cotton cloth witha camo print, no matter the manufacturer, glows bright blue to a deer. The blaze orange is up to twice the (blue) brightness because the manufacturer brightens up the material with UV dye to brighten the orange.

Does anyone have any pro's or con's to this new study of whitetail vision?

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I watched the video. However,I'm skeptical about some ofthe information presented in it.He mentions that we are most visible during low light conditions. I want to know why I'm never spotted in my stand, while I know deer are looking in my direction. If we stick out as he says we do, why aren't these deer spooked? Even if I'm not moving, giving off scent that they could detect, or making noise, they should still spook if what he say's is true. Doesn't this make sense?:eek:

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Camo clothes worked just fine for years and years before anyone ever heard of deer being able to see UV. So, my opinion? It's an overblown scare tactic to sell a product. I mean really. The 'study' was done by the people that manufacturer UV killer? Says so right there in the clip, and they are sponsors of the 'Whitetail University' show. You're not going to get anything from them except sponsor propaganda. C'mon, dude!

Look for independent sources of info, not advertising claptrap. And make sure those independent sources have done their own research and are not parroting manufacturer claims. And make sure you wash your hunting clothes in a detergent that has no perfumes or UV brighteners. That's all you need to worry about. In my opinion, naturally.

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Thestudy of whitetail vision is hardly new. The tests that this company performed did not cover nearly enough variables. Two of the most thorough tests where completed by the University of Texas in 77", and again by Michigan State University in 85".The tests used both wild and pen raised whitetails in a controlled and a "semi-controlled" location. Both tests proved that the whitetail could make correct responses to UV treated material. Correct reponses to the many different colors occured as frequently as 95 percent of the time.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

deleted. Clicked the wrong freakin' button. [&:]

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Sorry DT, I'm going with Arther P on this one. I've had too many deer very close, too many times, and not had them spook when IKNOW they were looking in my direction. From what this freak says, I should have stuck out like a sore fricking thumb!! Didn't happen.He's another hand job trying to sell a product the way I see it.
I simplyput my camo through a regular wash cycle with baking soda only, and air dry. I think a dryer beats things up too much. My clothes hang outside until I go hunting. When I do go hunting, everything gets a good spray down with Scent Killer non scented formula only. That's howI roll!!

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

LOL. Nothing like a good ol' fashion Theory vs. Tested Science thread to start the weekend.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Hook...

Line...

Sinker...

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Which oneistheory, and which one isTested Science?:eek:

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Technically both. I just find it laughable that you believe in a product that attempts to beat a whitetail's nose, but you call a product that attempts to beat a whitetail's eye's a "gimmick". I personally don't use either, but as you stated earlier, use scent free (not scent eliminating) laundry detergent and air dry my hunting clothes.I'd venture to guess that an outstanding numberof hunting clothes manufactured today do noteven need UV treatment, simply because it was taken into very serious consideration a decade ago. Imjust trying to make a point that I would be more skeptical of a product that feeds me the "scent free" story vs. a UV killer. We both know that the deers olfactory sense are stronger than its visual or even auditory senses. Im just making the point that the rods and cones in a deer's eye gives them the ability to distinguish ultraviolet colors. I don't believe in making assumptions and calling it a tested hypothesis...

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

One other point... Your clothes can only reflect the amount of UV that's in the ambient light available. It's not going to be making you look like you've got a million candlepower worth of illumination from within. What's shown on that video is just plain absurd.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I agree with that 100%. This video is obviously using scare tactics by blowing UV out of proportion. In real hunting conditions UV is much more minimal than this company claims.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Over the years, I have run the gamut on all the scent control sprays, clothing, soaps and the detergents that are scent free without the uv brighteners.

This, in my humble opinion, falls into the category of repeated threads (one is started right now) about all the gimmicks and commercialism we fall for by always trying to get an edge.

My opinion is based on countless deer sightings from numerous tree stand locations, but fixed stands that I hunt on a repeated basis over many years. What also plays into the equation, is that many times I am in a rush to get a few hours of hunting in and I go out in my regular clothes(no camo).

Bottomline for me is this. I have certain set ups that provide good backdrop cover as well as a little something in front or to the sides of me (a tree with multiple trunks or a cluster) that I NEVER get busted in regardless of what i am wearing.

I have had other set ups that kinda leave me "hangin out there", and I invariably get busted on a regular basis regardless of what precautions I take, especially by mature deer.I have never seen a quick fix such as a different camo pattern, uv blocker etc,etc. Just find a better set up that improves my concealment and I can hunt in blue jeans and a red shirt, literally, and I will be just fine.

Buy what you want if it gives you confidence, but for myself, I choose to put more effort in finding the right set up to begin and the rest will take care of itself.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Here's all I'm going tosay about this subject, because it can be argued until the cows come home. And I'm not going there. Based on my in the field observations/experiences (test's if you will;)) with whitetails and their behaviors, I'venever had one react negatively towards me as a result of the camo I was wearing. Especially considering I know for sure I was in their sight window! So, this PROVES that MY camo isn't giving me away via UV "glow".
As far as thescent elimination goes, I use Scent Killer (non-scented formula)becauseit's ingredients do, for a fact, HELP eliminate human odor. This much IKNOW.So I will use it. The only time I ever get busted by a deer, it's a result of noise/ movement.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

dammit. I did it again. [:@] I need a nap. [8D] Another deleted mistake.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Fair enough. I can certainly respect your view Early in. We both made our points so I too will back out before this becomes another merry-go-roundarguement.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Hre's a link to a page on the EPA's website that gives the month-by-month average UV index for the country. Keep in mind that your clothes can't reflect more UV than hits them. Maybe it'll help you gage how much of a potential problem UV is for you during your hunting season.

http://www.epa.gov/SUNWISE/doc/uvimonth.html

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

The only thing missing is 3 easy payments of $19.99. Don't worry about it.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

How many people here remember hitting the woods with our red and black plaid wool coats and a pair of blue jeans. The deer can't tell the difference, it's our actions that give us away. We wear camo because we look good while we're wearing it. :D

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

For 7 years I always took a buck opening day ofMaryland archery opener. Always out of the same stand which was in an awesomenatural funnel between an activefarm field and a bedding thicket. The wind was always perfect as well for a morning hunt. In all the years hunting from thatstand I can honestly say I was never busted. Well never busted until I tried the so called UV Killer! I'm not sure what they call it now but back then (the early 90) that's what it was called.There was no way that deer should have ever spotted me but somehow, he did.

I called and wrote a letter explainingmy hunt and I never heard back from them. I called them severaltimes trying to get some kind of reply and still nothing. Until they find a deer that can talk and tell me different, it nothing more than a 100% gimmick. For those that believe in it......more power to ya.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I am sorry but I am going to go out on a limb here and totally disagree with most of you that thinks it does not matter or that there has not been any good scientific research done. I hunt waterfowl quite a bit and know for a fact that they respond nagatively to uv glow coming off of white cotton sheets when some people use them as snow covers on blinds or persons. Birds will flare especially on a cloudy day like you would not believe if someone forgot to clean their sheets properly or they purchased foreign made blind covers with UV brighteners. I know some of you are going to naturally say that it is calling, or some other hunting fault but I don't care, I can tell you without a doubt that birds respond negatively to UV glow, I mean to the point of being funny or wierd and magically when covers are used minus UV glow the result is boom boom. Now with that being said I have been under the impression that the old studies and some more recent ones (I think the mose recent and elaborate was done by Univ. of Georgia) show that both birds and Whitetails lack a U.V filter and if that is the case you can bet your butt I will spend the 19.95 to be able to treat my stuff. If you have a question on how much glow you have then us a light and see. To me personally this is pretty cheap stuff when you think about all of the other things that we buy especially how much money we spend on camo, and oh yeah the scent control thing (now I think that is the gimmick). The reason that the old days of wool and such worked is because it was made in the good old U.S.A and UV brighteners were not added. I would also like to mention that I have had numerous occasions where I have been down wind and had camo from head to toe including my face, been behind good natural cover and deer would look right at me pick me out and run the other way.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Doubt it!!! It's probably some movement, or you looking at them or that scent blocker ain't working as well as you think. (Try X-scent base-layers, best thing I've ever used!!!!) I knowingly wash all my clothes in a Scent-Free detergent (All: Free & Clear) UV brightener, I've been within CLOSE shot distance of MANY deer while ON THE GROUND without a blind, in the last several years, and not spooked but a rare couple of them. TRUST ME, the UV thing may hold some small amount of water, but it it held that much water, the two encouters I've had that I've had deer within 5yds. of me on the ground wouldn't have happened. And I've had probably 20 within 10yds. of me on the ground, in the last 4 yrs, that seemed to have no idea what I was.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

The reason I was so interested in the video clip was because I also read an article, featured on HNI, that involved professors at a Forest Resources University in Georgia.

Heres the link: http://www.huntingnet.com/articles/article_detail.aspx?articles_id=579

I will admit that my comfort level is higher when Im in my Realtree AP...regardless of the study. I am one of those who used to hunt in my fathers old army drab. I have been 15 ft from a half dozen does that were looking me in my eyes...and continued eating the acorns on the ground because they never saw me...and yesI do look cool as hell in total concealment.

Im all for "helping" me blend into the whitetails environment...so yes Im interested in these studies. Im not running out to buy any particular brand of UV killer because there are several companies that make the UV killer spray or wash. I am sorry for starting this debate, but I was guessing that it has come up before and I would get a "yes" or "no".

......continue as you were!

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I wash mine in baking soda and hang dry. That's all you need. No scent, no UV.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I've had too many deer within 15 yardsand not notice me to believe UV gives me away

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I Hear ya!!! .....but when I read about scientists who do the studies like the one from HNI, I kinda give it SOME credibility.

Like I said in my original post...I never really gave it a second thought until I read the article. I believe that biologists and people with phd's in the field of wildlife studies KINDA know what they are talking about!

Im not stressing out whether or not my camo, that has brought me success, is a gimmick but it makes sense when you understand the whitetails UV vision.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Okay, maybe it's too hard to click on a link or maybe it's too hard to understand what's there. I'll go through my reasoning and you can tell me if it's whacked.

Here's the UV map of the U.S. for October.



Now your clothes don't emit UV light themselves, right? So they can only reflect what UV they're exposed to. So we have to consider the amount of UV we're exposing our clothes to. That's where the map comes in.

Let's pick Kansas as a good compromise between hunting the U.P. or the Texas brush country. The mean UV index for an October day is between 3 and 4. That's pretty darn low already, compared to the 9.4 in Puerto Rico. Okay, you've got your stand in the tree and the leaves haven't fallen. You're in shade. That cuts UV exposure even more. Most guys only hunt early in the morning or late in the evening, well before or after peak hours of UV exposure. So that's even less UV.

We're hunting during the season when UV radiation is way down from summer. We're in the shade being blocked from UV light. We're hunting during the times of day when UV is low. Ain't no way we're gonna be glowing like it showed in that video.

If it makes you feel better, then by all means go ahead and spend the money to cut your UV reflection. But the way I see it, other than washing your clothes in a scent and brightener free detergent, it's not that big a deal. IMO, the only people who have to worry all that much about UV glow are those who are in a stand with a black light hanging over them, burning incense and smoking those funny smelling twisted cigarettes. [8D]

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

You mean to tell me that these dont make me a better hunter?

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

No offense, but Pres Bush KINDA knew Iraq had WMD's. Look where we are now!;)Had to vent.:D

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

That pretty much sums it up.

I agree with your point, but I wouldn't bow hunt in blue jeans. Deer vision is still not fully understood, but it is now believed the color blue stands out like a sore thumb to them. It's also believed the color red may appear as black. What's intresting is how a deers eyes track moving objects, which allows them to detect even the slightest movement, at considerable distances. I'd woory more about movement than UV.

It'a amazing that after all these years and scientific breakthroughs, nothing really works much better than baking soda.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Yeah, and weKINDA knew Sadaam Husain was a madman. Not one attack in the U.S. since. Can't wait for Obama the peace maker. Sorry, just had to vent;).

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I'm gonna keep doing what I've been doing. I'll wear what the wife puts out for me. It seems to work. Authur P gets my vote for president!

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I think you mean "successful" attack? There have been attempt's since. Look into it.;)Venting is a good thing.:D

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Yeah, baking soda is the wonder powder of all time but it does not get rid of and uv brighteners that have been added from the factory. If you kill or cover the brighteners then you only have to do it once unless you wash them in a detergent with brighteners again.

To be honest I could care less about the UV index for the country as that is no measure of how sensitive or rather how well a particular animal can recognize it once reflected. I will say it again there is no doubt in my mind that ducks and geese can see uv glow very very very well. I and my huting circlehave conducted many personal experiments most of them actual hunting to determine this is fact not theory. If the universities have determined that deer UV filters are very similar to most birds (not having them) then there is no doubt in my mind that it can be seen. I am not trying to sway any of you into belief but I see some of the arguments here having little relevance to the subject.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

I am not trying to offend anyone here, I have a lot of respect for some of the "posters" here as I have read alot of their posts and heard a lot about them but I see little relevance to baking soda and a UV index. The question is not whether UV exists in certain parts of the country as it exists in all states at all times of the year but if the animals see it and what you do about it. I know what a lot of you "do about it" is use baking soda and that is fine but that does not in any way deal with a UV problem if you have one as a simple test with a black light will show that. Baking soda is a great scent free cleaner that leaves little residue and does not contain brighteners but it is just that, a cleaner. If you say you are using baking soda in response to the UV glow then all you are saying is you don't believe in the glow, not this is how I fix it. By the way Ithought it quite important to mentionthat I currently use NO UV killers of any sort at this time as I am still undecided on how to treat it.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Travis, I totally agree with you. I only mentioned washing withbaking soda in my second post in this thread to merely say that's how I keep my camoscent free. I wasn't associating it withUV's at all, because one has nothing to do with the other.;)

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

Is there any difference betweena scent free detergent soap containing no UV brighteners, and baking soda? Not really. The whole idea is just to clean your cloths with something unscented and without UV brighteners, right?These products claiming to reduce or nullify the UV signature of clothing are not really proven science. How deer see different colors is still an ongoing study, with few hard core facts. Be carfull of somebody trying to sell you something, that eliminates something, that hasn't been proven to affect your ability to mask yourself in the woods/fields. No arguement, just discussion :D.

RE: being a glow dope in a tree all camo'ed out
 

The UV index matters because that's the measure of UV in the sunlight. The less UV in the ambient light, the less exposure. The less exposure, the less there is to be reflected by your clothes and so the less it matters how sensitive a particular animal's vision is to it. And even then that mostly applies to only when you're standing in full sunlight. Get in the shade and there's even less.