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mnbirddog 03-04-2008 04:25 PM

Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Can someone please explain why it is that a lot of guys that will only shoot what they consider mature bucks feel that their demands outweigh those of people who don't care about the size of the antlers. I just want to shoot a couple deer a year (with hopefully one a buck). How big it is is not generally a factor (if I have two in front of me and can shoot either, I would try to shoot the bigger one). I would rather shoot a buck every year than a bigger one every couple years. Sure it would be nice to shoot a big one every year, but that doesn't happen to very many people. After reading the "what did you learn" post, it seems that there are several people who didn't get a chance at a "shooter" or big enough buck, and so didn't take one. And some people don't get a chance at any buck (though likely much of that is time spent in the stand). Wouldn't you have prefered to shoot one of the "lesser" bucks, than nothing?? Help me understand... It really doesn't make any sense to me, especially with a bow.

magicman54494 03-04-2008 04:43 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: mnbirddog

Can someone please explain why it is that a lot of guys that will only shoot what they consider mature bucks feel that their demands outweigh those of people who don't care about the size of the antlers.
I trophy hunt. I don't make anyone else trophy hunt. I want you to hunt for any size deer you want. Just remember, everyone that hunts dreams of shooting a big one, including you. How many deer that get shot when they are young grow up to be trophies? BTW I don't recall anyone here looking down on anyone for shooting a smaller racked buck. If someone has, they are in the wrong.

early in 03-04-2008 04:46 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: mnbirddog

Wouldn't you have prefered to shoot one of the "lesser" bucks, than nothing?? Help me understand... It really doesn't make any sense to me, especially with a bow.
I would much rather shoot a doe than a "lesser" buck. That takes care of my venison needs. Then I try for a "good" buck, or it's no buck at all.Give "lesser" bucks a chance tomature. I hope this helps you understand.;)

nodog 03-04-2008 04:54 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Look inward.

Why do you care enough to ask in a post about it?

SwampCollie 03-04-2008 04:54 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 


ORIGINAL: early in


ORIGINAL: mnbirddog

Wouldn't you have prefered to shoot one of the "lesser" bucks, than nothing?? Help me understand... It really doesn't make any sense to me, especially with a bow.
I would much rather shoot a doe than a "lesser" buck. That takes care of my venison needs. Then I try for a "good" buck, or it's no buck at all. Give "lesser" bucks a chance to mature. I hope this helps you understand.;)

I feel the same way. I could give a crap about shooting a buck at all. I deer hunt because I like to eat vension. Compare a doe steak to a buck steak... and a doe will take the fight in 3 by KO. No contest at all! Thats why I shoot slick heads. If a BIG buck comes by... sure I'll take him... but I let a heck of a lot of small bucks walk this year and never lost any sleep over it. Just a doe that doesn't taste as good with some potential. Nothing more.

KodiakArcher 03-04-2008 04:57 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: mnbirddog
Wouldn't you have prefered to shoot one of the "lesser" bucks, than nothing??
And therin lies the crux of your question... for a lot of us, the answer is no. I'm a trophy hunter. I'm willing to go home empty handed at the end of the season in exchange for the added challenge of pursuing that one deer that I'm after. It's a chess game and if you went into it knowing you were going to win, where would be the challenge?

FLbowhntr 03-04-2008 04:58 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Well if its just about killing a deer why not shoot a doe they eat better anyhow and what are you going to do with a small bucks rack other than throw them in the shed to collect dust. I say shoot what makes you happy but have never understood the mindset of shooting small bucks rather than does I mean the doe will always be a doe however old she gets that 1.5 yr old buck who knows in 3 yrs.

Rory/MO 03-04-2008 05:05 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
i dont mind eating my buck tag, as long as i get a deer down. and when i eat my buck tag that deers a doe

mnbirddog 03-04-2008 05:05 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: magicman54494

BTW I don't recall anyone here looking down on anyone for shooting a smaller racked buck. If someone has, they are in the wrong.
Im mostly thinking of all the guys in this state (not on this forum) whining about not seeing enough big bucks. Also, the resulting push that is going on in many states to have antler restrictions. I didn't mean to say that I care what people think of what I want to shoot, just want to understand why some guys think the states should mandate hunters to only target bigger bucks I guess.

mnbirddog 03-04-2008 05:14 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
I also don't agree that a doe eats any better. I, and most others I suspect, cannot tell the difference side by side (except maybe a yearling gives smaller steaks;)). Plus most 1.5 and virtually all 2.5 y/o bucks yield more meat than any doe. Also, the way I see it; shooting a doe subtracts from the population much more than a buck, and the area I'm in doesn't have an excess of deer anymore thanks to the liberal doe permits given out by the DNR for a few years. Just some of my thoughts thoughts.

Germ 03-04-2008 05:24 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: nodog

Look inward.

Why do you care enough to ask in a post about it?
;) Great question

GregH 03-04-2008 05:30 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
I think that next year we should have the smallest buck contest (excluding nubbins of course). [:-]

mnbirddog 03-04-2008 05:48 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: Germ


ORIGINAL: nodog

Look inward.

Why do you care enough to ask in a post about it?
;) Great question
Trying to understand, I guess... Wondering what is fueling the movement to further restrict what deer I can shoot.

davidmil 03-04-2008 05:56 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
I'll whack a 140 pound6pointbuck over an 80 pound doe any day. It's a lot more meat. They don't eat that differently. You don't always get a doe tag besides that. I got one last fall for the first time in 3 years in NY, and I saved it for a 130 pound dressed doe.[8D] I don't care about eating an old beat up rutted up gnarly old deer.

bawanajim 03-04-2008 05:58 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:

davidmil 03-04-2008 06:01 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:

So I guess you're saying that if we're not a self proclaimed "Trophy hunter" we don't have the skills. Now that right there has to be one of the most arrogant arguements I've ever heard. But, if you believe that... that's fine. I don't really care. LOL

MeanV2 03-04-2008 06:04 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Bowhunting is or at least should be a personal sport. You should set your own goals whatever they are and be content with them. My goals have changed through the years. The worst thing I hate to see is someone ridicule someone for what they have killed and are proud off. It won't happen here! You'll always get a handshake from me when you take any animal with a Bow.

Dan

GMMAT 03-04-2008 06:05 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
I can't say what magicman said any better. That was great.



bawanajim 03-04-2008 06:07 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: davidmil


Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:

So I guess you're saying that if we're not a self proclaimed "Trophy hunter" we don't have the skills. Now that right there has to be one of the most arrogant arguements I've ever heard. But, if you believe that... that's fine. I don't really care. LOL
look .........he ask a very simple question, I gave him my point of veiw. And of course you care because you took the time to tap out your very own narrow minded reply.When you stsrt paying for my tags then yo can tell me what to shoot.
Reread it and see if you can find the word trophy in there any where.

HuntingBry 03-04-2008 06:13 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
As MeanV said, it's a personal choice for me. I set my personal goals and if a buck doesn't meet them I don't shoot him. I'm fortunate in that I can get a lot of doe tags so I have the luxury of being selective. For those that don't that's fine. If someone wants to shoot a small buck, or a button buck that's up to them. If they're happy with it, good for them. As long as you're happy with what you are doing and meeting your personal goals you're doing OK in my book.

Rory/MO 03-04-2008 06:14 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: bawanajim

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:
come on you cant say that. some of the meat hunters out there are much better than us "trophy hunters".

bawanajim 03-04-2008 06:17 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: bawanajim

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:
come on you cant say that. some of the meat hunters out there are much better than us "trophy hunters".
Oh but I can say that.........hell I'm rich, good looking & own my own trophy hunting property to boot.

mnbirddog 03-04-2008 06:17 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: bawanajim

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:
That is one of the more common arguments I hear, and I gotta say that its the only one that I can say: "I see your point, but likely that day will never come for me." Except from my first to my second, each buck was just as satisfying as the last. And I suppose that if I ever began to loose that satisfaction I would chase it or "raise the bar" I guess, just don't see it. I just don't like the idea of laws telling me that my desire to shoot any buck is less valid than other hunters desires to shoot a mature buck only. I disagree with the "skill level" part, though. Skill level has nothing to do with someone prefering to shoot a certain class of deer. Maybe "for some that time will simply never come..."

Rory/MO 03-04-2008 06:18 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: bawanajim


ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: bawanajim

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:
come on you cant say that. some of the meat hunters out there are much better than us "trophy hunters".
Oh but I can say that.........hell I'm rich, good looking & own my own trophy hunting property to boot.
jesus i hope your joking

jwork 03-04-2008 06:23 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
its all about the challenge, its just fun to me to try and match wits with a big smart mature buck. And when u do get lucky enough to take him, it is a awesome feeling. Who knows that lesser buck 15 yards from my stand on the last day could grow up to be that 170 inch trophey in a few years. I personally dont mind if I go a year without killing a buck..

mnbirddog 03-04-2008 06:24 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Good responses so far. I agree, it should be a personal choice. Out of curiosity, of those of you who feel that way, who would also support antler restriction at a legislative level? I have participated in hunts on private property with QDM goals and standards in place, and I had no problem complying, afterall I was getting the privelage to participate in a hunt. But I support the ability to choose what deer I shoot, or what deer I want shot on my property, and I support extending that right to any landowners, including the public.

bawanajim 03-04-2008 06:25 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: bawanajim


ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: bawanajim

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:
come on you cant say that. some of the meat hunters out there are much better than us "trophy hunters".
Oh but I can say that.........hell I'm rich, good looking & own my own trophy hunting property to boot.
jesus i hope your joking
I was going to tell you Iwas willedit all, but that would be an untruth, I bought it with the money I made selling drugs at school.[:o]
Did Ibring upmy pretty wife?;)

Rory/MO 03-04-2008 06:26 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: bawanajim


ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: bawanajim


ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: bawanajim

Its just a way of raising the bar a little for some of us whom have gotten past the point where just killing a buck is not quite as satisfying as it used to be. For some that skill level will never be achieved,for others its just the first step.:eek:
come on you cant say that. some of the meat hunters out there are much better than us "trophy hunters".
Oh but I can say that.........hell I'm rich, good looking & own my own trophy hunting property to boot.
jesus i hope your joking
I was going to tell you Iwas willedit all, but that would be an untruth, I bought it with the money I made selling drugs at school.[:o]
Did Ibring upmy pretty wife?;)
[8D]

rybohunter 03-04-2008 06:29 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Few comments here

1. Typically an antler restriction DOES NOT force people into "trophy" hunting. We have plenty of year & half old bucks that meet our restrictions. So those guys who want to shoot a young small buck still can (and often do)

2. Sometimes is NOT all about the hunter. Many deer herds have skewed sex ratios and restrictions help balance that out.

3. MANY guys have killed plenty of "lesser" bucks, and to kill another has no appeal to them.



MGH_PA 03-04-2008 06:39 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Already a thread on a very similar topic, but...to add in what has been said. I don't agree with someone looking down on those who aren't trophy hunters, nor do I agree with those who shoot smaller bucks criticizing those who choose to "trophy" hunt. It's all about personal preference. As for shooting a smaller buck over a nice doe to get the same amount of meat, as a rule that may be true, but all of my does have weighed at least 120lbs...most 1.5yr-2.5 yr olds in my area don't weight out much more than 175 max (granted there are those that weigh much more I'm sure, but the ones we've taken on our property and at our camp didn't). Sure you get more meat, but depending on the time of year, it won't always be the same tasting. A buck shot in full rut (from my experience) tends to be tougher meat, and not as naturally tastey (requires more marinade:D). But, again personal preference...heck some guys think bear meat tastes good[:'(]

Rory/MO 03-04-2008 06:41 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: M.Hensler/PA

Already a thread on a very similar topic, but...to add in what has been said. I don't agree with someone looking down on those who aren't trophy hunters, nor do I agree with those who shoot smaller bucks criticizing those who choose to "trophy" hunt. It's all about personal preference. As for shooting a smaller buck over a nice doe to get the same amount of meat, as a rule that may be true, but all of my does have weighed at least 120lbs...most 1.5yr-2.5 yr olds in my area don't weight out much more than 175 max (granted there are those that weigh much more I'm sure, but the ones we've taken on our property and at our camp didn't). Sure you get more meat, but depending on the time of year, it won't always be the same tasting. A buck shot in full rut (from my experience) tends to be tougher meat, and not as naturally tastey (requires more marinade:D). But, again personal preference...heck some guys think bear meat tastes good[:'(]
i heard bear meat is some of the worst!!

davidmil 03-04-2008 06:43 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

Bowhunting is or at least should be a personal sport. You should set your own goals whatever they are and be content with them. My goals have changed through the years. The worst thing I hate to see is someone ridicule someone for what they have killed and are proud off. It won't happen here! You'll always get a handshake from me when you take any animal with a Bow.

Dan

I can't say what MeanV said any better. That was great.:D

Germ 03-04-2008 06:46 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: davidmil


Bowhunting is or at least should be a personal sport. You should set your own goals whatever they are and be content with them. My goals have changed through the years. The worst thing I hate to see is someone ridicule someone for what they have killed and are proud off. It won't happen here! You'll always get a handshake from me when you take any animal with a Bow.

Dan

I can't say what MeanV said any better. That was great.:D
I agree, and i never ask "why" anyone shoots anything(legal of course). Getting caught up it what others are doing, will only take away from what you are doing.

There are knuckleheads on both sides of the "what to shoot" deal, ignore them and have fun.

Remember Hunting is suppose to be FUN:D

MeanV2 03-04-2008 07:03 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
If you take the Fun out. What's Left?

Dan

loogout1 03-04-2008 07:29 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
It's all subjective anyway. Depending on what part of the country you live in (oh no, the location debate!) a trophy where I hunt is a small non-trophy where others hunt. Where I hunt I would be all for antler restrictions BECAUSE OF the super abundance of deer, especialy does. In my eyes, if I'm going to shoot a small buck, I might as well be part of the solution and shoot a doe instead. I personally have no reason to shoot something that's not bigger than what I have on my wall already. What's the point, just to say I shot a buck? Did it prove I was a great hunter just 'cause it had some piece of antler on its head? JMO. Ya gotta do what's best for you, no one can tell you different.

Schultzy 03-04-2008 07:55 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: xXxrory7xXx


ORIGINAL: M.Hensler/PA

Already a thread on a very similar topic, but...to add in what has been said. I don't agree with someone looking down on those who aren't trophy hunters, nor do I agree with those who shoot smaller bucks criticizing those who choose to "trophy" hunt. It's all about personal preference. As for shooting a smaller buck over a nice doe to get the same amount of meat, as a rule that may be true, but all of my does have weighed at least 120lbs...most 1.5yr-2.5 yr olds in my area don't weight out much more than 175 max (granted there are those that weigh much more I'm sure, but the ones we've taken on our property and at our camp didn't). Sure you get more meat, but depending on the time of year, it won't always be the same tasting. A buck shot in full rut (from my experience) tends to be tougher meat, and not as naturally tastey (requires more marinade:D). But, again personal preference...heck some guys think bear meat tastes good[:'(]
i heard bear meat is some of the worst!!
Not at all! If you take care of it the proper way after you shoot one its one of the best tasting meats I've had.

mnbirddog 03-04-2008 07:59 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
Me too. I love black bear meat. I have heard that fish eating bears in alaska dont taste particularly well in the fall when they are gorging on salmon, but cant verify that.

Schultzy 03-04-2008 08:11 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 

ORIGINAL: Germ


ORIGINAL: davidmil


Bowhunting is or at least should be a personal sport. You should set your own goals whatever they are and be content with them. My goals have changed through the years. The worst thing I hate to see is someone ridicule someone for what they have killed and are proud off. It won't happen here! You'll always get a handshake from me when you take any animal with a Bow.

Dan

I can't say what MeanV said any better. That was great.:D
I agree, and i never ask "why" anyone shoots anything(legal of course). Getting caught up it what others are doing, will only take away from what you are doing.

There are knuckleheads on both sides of the "what to shoot" deal, ignore them and have fun.

Remember Hunting is suppose to be FUN:D
Well said Germ and MeanV! I won't shoot a small buck for meat myself, thats what the doe's are for. I can't manage my woods by shooting little bucks. My goals are to let the little guys grow. Whatever you prefer is what matters, as long as your happy with your decision thats what matters. If you have no problem with shooting small bucks and someone else is knocking you down for it, they have there own issues and they should keep there own mouth shut as long as your not the one complaining you have no mature bucks around. I see people on here too that think passing on small bucks is just dumb and they sure love to comment on it, them same people should really keep there mouth shut as well. Just because some of us try managing our own woods that we pay taxes on doesn't give some the right to complain how we go about managing our own property. All were trying to do is get better quality bucks and deer herd.

James Vee 03-04-2008 08:18 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
At some point you'll probably grow out of it.

magicman54494 03-04-2008 08:25 PM

RE: Question for "mature buck" advocates
 
My feelings on antler restrictions: It is great idea!!!! It might take a year or two but after that we will havejust as many legal bucks as before and they will be bigger. Everyone wins!When a "meat" hunter kills a bigger buck he gets more meat.


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