field vs broadhead
 

As some of you know, I started shooting my new Black Ice a few weeks ago. I am grouping pretty consistantly 2-3 inches at 30 yrds. I am pretty happy with that. Still plenty of time to conquere the 40 yrd mark before deer season. Yesterday I shot my Thunderheads and am completely confused. The only thing consistent with my broadheads was that none were grouped. Any suggestions, where to start looking for the problem. I call myself having the arrows tuned, blades inline with vanes. Any suggestions would be helpful
thanks
chris

RE: field vs broadhead
 

What type of BH are shooting? Fixed blade or mech?

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Fixed blade, Thunderhead 100 grain.
chris

RE: field vs broadhead
 

From my own experience, my BH do not fly anything like my field points. You may just have to resight everything in when it gets closer to hunting season. Frankly, i don't even shoot fp anymore.

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Have you paper tuned the bow with field points?

Also I wouldn't even worry about the distances yet, get the bow tuned and then if you are still having broadhead problems you might want to try a few different broadheads,I know that can get expensive but off a tuned bow with a good arrow yourfield points and broadheads should be shooting very, very close, even out to 40-50 yards and farther.

I do know some guys like VA who don't even worry about fieldpoints and sight thier bows in with BH's. But if you are not getting any consistency and no grouping with your BH's, that to me indicates a tuning problem.

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Yeh, try paper tuning with fp .

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Exactly.

RE: field vs broadhead
 

I will try paper tuning again when I can. Hopefully that will give me some clarity. I had it papertuned before I left the shop with it, but I did make some adjustments later. Thanks, any other input is appreciated.
chris

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Are your vanes offset right? Are they straight? How long are your vanes? That could be an issue to look into. A fixed blade BH with shorter vanes may be causing your arrows to loose alot of accuracy. How heavy are your arrows?

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Some broadheads are easier to get field point flight out of than others, but with a little work it is easily accomplished. Make sure all broaheads spin true, length of arrows? poundage of bow? model of bow? spine of arrows? FOC of your arrows? Have you walk back tuned and/or bare shaft tuned? These thing might help others give you some answers to your questions.

Dan

RE: field vs broadhead
 

It's a tuning issue and if flight is erratic from one arrow to the next (not grouping) then it's an arrow tuning issue: underspined/overspined, rest/riser/cable contact, broadheads not aligned with shaft... Get the arrows tuned up and then get the bow tuned up with them. If you're grouping field points well then you're beyond papertuning at this point. You need to get the broadheads grouping and then you can fine tune them to impact with the field points with minor rest adjustments.

RE: field vs broadhead
 

What do you mean by overspined/underspined? Is that the flexibility of the arrow as related to the poundage? Thanks for all the suggestions guys, I need the help.
chris

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Yep, that's what it means. A broadhead adds overall length to the arrow so if you were on the verge of being underspined with field points the broadhead might have been the straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak. It's more likely a broadhead alignment issue though. Have you spin balanced all your broadhead shafts to make sure the points are in line with the shaft?

RE: field vs broadhead
 

What do you mean by will not group? Are you saying it will not group your fixed blades with your field points, or when you shoot fixed blades it simply won't group well and when you shoot field points it will?

There is a big difference between the two.

And it's really hard to tell you whats wrong without actually seeing the set up and seeing you shoot.

There are a number of things that could be causing your problems, but the most we could do is just list them all, anything else at this point would just be a guess.

First thing to do is check to see if you have the proper arrows for your set up. Then check to see if the arrows are straight and the tips are square and everything spins true. After that I would look at fletching and FOC. Too little fletching and too low of a FOC makes it difficult to tune broad heads.

After that check to see if your rest and nock set up is good and that you don't have any fletch clearance problems, especially with vanes. An improperly set up rest or nock point can make broad head tuning a real pain. Especially if the spring tension on a prong rest is too high, or if a drop a way doesn't fall at the correct time. And nock low settings can cause all sorts of problems that look like something else when tuning.

Aligning your fletchings with your blades does nothing though, other than it looks cool. It has nothing to do with tuning or performance however.

You might also want to number your arrows and see if the same ones miss all the time. If you get poor or erratic groups, but its the same arrows hitting in the same places every time then you have a problem with your arrows.

Good luck,
Paul

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Listen to what Paul said, he one of the best on here, by far.

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Thanks guys,
I will not get to shoot today, but hopefully can work on this tommorrow. Paul, what I meant is I can group my field points all day, but when I shoot my broadheads, they are all over the block, literally. They are not only off the bullseye, they are inconsistent. Thanks again, I will check the things you mentioned and hopefully find the flaw.
chris

RE: field vs broadhead
 

Maybe you should try some Magnus snuffer ss with a easton epic 340, they are dead on for me and i havent had my bow paper tuned or anything

RE: field vs broadhead
 

MenaV2 has some good advice here. I'll try one. See if you can get a copy of Easton Archery's Tuning Guide.. This manual has a lot o good info about things such as basic setups right up through and including broadhead tuning, which is obviously what you need help with.

It's not necessary to have your vanes aligned with the vanes, but it is paramount to have the ferrules aligned with the arrow shaft (spin check). It is also necessary to have either helical fletching or at least staright offset. Left or right is not an issue with Thunderheads.

Don't let anybody tell you that broadheads don't fly to the same POI as field points. If the bow is tuned properly they will. Tuning any bow to shoot field points is fairly easy and often any imperfection in that tune will not show up until you put those nasty little blades up front.

Some might argue this, but it as been proven many times over that a bow/arrow combination can be grossly out of tune or mismatched and still shoot good groups, even at long yardages. That's because the bow, being a machine, does pretty much the same thing shot after shot. And if arrows are consistent from one to the next, they will shoot the same, too. Throw in some variables like inconsistent shooting form or grip, blades on the arrows catching air, and arrows will scatter.

Take that same setup, tune it to perfection, and it'll shoot hald dollar size groups at 40 yards---if you can. BINGO---for now I would forget all about broadheads. Learn how to shoot your bow. Learn how to have good repeatable form. Learn some basic tuning procedures and how to tweak a bow. Have fun most of the summer. Then maybe a month before hunting season get the broadheads out and fine tune your equipment for them. If you learn enough between now and then you might find it a whole lot easier to do.

RE: field vs broadhead
 

It's one thing if your broadheads and field points are hitting different. It is another thing completely when you can't get any consistant groups with your broadheads. First you need to get your arrows tuned for broadheads, then get them to group. Then you are ready to fine tune the bow to bring the bh's together with the field pts.

Make sure each arrows spins true, and make sure you are shooting helical or at least off-set fletching. Do not worry about lining up fletches and blades.

How can you tune a bow that throws one broadhead high and right, and the next low and left? You can't, because corrective adjustments would be opposite each other.