Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Guys, help me out here, my 16 year old son and hunting buddy has developed a bad habit of punching the trigger very bad, his shooting is very marginal at 3-D (i think alot is nerves on the course) he hates crowds. but his bowhunting has been excellent so far, he has several bow kills under his belt with perfect pass throughs, and only one bad hit-in the shoulder resulting in a deer lost.
I have tried and tried to get him out of that habit, what do i need to do to correct him of this??? He just dosent want to lay his finger on the trigger concentrate and shoot, instead he aims while bringing his finger around and then punches it from an inch away. I know he can be an awesome shot if i can break him of it. TFOX i think i had mentioned this to you in KY (but we were drinking :D) what do you think, maby start with a blank bale and concentrate on his release, no aiming??????????? HELP IN INDIANA>>>>>>>>>:D

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Get a thumb triggered release. Can't punch what's not there.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

good point Don, that will be considered ;)

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

That's a tough sell.......it depends on his DESIRE to become a better shot. I have a 3D shooting buddy who has the EXACT same technique and he'll never live up to his shooting potential because it goes in one ear and right out the other.:eek:

Shooting an index style release for target shooting takes more discipline than I possess. I couldn't do it.
A thumb trigger and learning the right way from the start is an excellent suggestion.

If it's not an option be prepared for long growing pains trying to break that habit of mashing with his index finger. It sounds easy enough to correct in theory but if the mindset isn't there and the dsicipline to stay with it you are peeing up a rope. ;)

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Funny thing Matt, when he was 12-14ish he did not have this problem, its developed over the last couple of years. If im right with him coaching him during target sessions, he's ok, but as soon as i start shooting and glance over at him, he is punching again. As far as Desire, in the hunting part he has tons of it, but shooting 3-d im just not seeing it. I think the thumb release might be worth a try, thanks guys!! ;)

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Sounds like target panic to me. Can he hold on the target without shooting or punching the trigger or does he flinch or pluck the string and get a bad shot? The more he shoots the more he ingrains this type of shooting into his subconscious and the harder it will be to undo. It may make archery not fun as his accuracy will suffer tremendously. He has to want to improve and understand shot control is everything.

What is his shot process and symptoms?

Check out this site and JKID, JKID is awesome at helping people with target panic and has helped me personally.

http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=001918;p=0

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

i dont see him flinching much, he looses that focus on the spot he is aiming at when he gets in a hurry. I think :eek:

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Well I went threw this myself! What I ddi was I made my trigger on my release as light as I could, and I draw and keep my finger behind the trigger, I settle my pin and as im settle I bring my finger around and as soon as I touch its off..no punching of the trigger like this. Its harder I agree to shoot cause you can not keep your finger on the trigger but on the other hand if you can hold steady there will be no problem!

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Hey blood,I don't remember any drinking,but I don't remember much of anything.:D


Gander Mountain had a bt for 60 bucks the last time I was there.


I have a chappy boss thumb trigger release I will be willing to let him try.That might help but they can be punched very easily.It is just target panick plain and simple and you have heard all the remedies before.;)

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

I have shot some excellent scores using a wrist release BUT I would practice all week with my bt and come sunday,I was shooting the trigger very well with bt but it didn't take long for the shots to become more of a command shot than a bt shot.

At that time I couldn't shoot as consistant with the bt as I would like and the wrist release was new so I was trying it out,I shot great with it but it did take a high level of discipline.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

I still think my idea is best :D;)Give er' a shot and let me know... [8D]

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

One technique I read about was to have him shoot at a blank target. Don't have him aim at anything in particular just put the pin on the target and work on his mechanics. To me it sounds like target panic, and with a blank target there is no bulls-eye or vitals to worry about and all he has to worry about is a nice clean release. After some repetition muscle memory kicks in and then have him go back to shooting bulls-eyes and then back to 3d targets. Also if you have a shooting range with a full backstop where you can have him SAFELY shoot with his eyes closed that might help too. That way he can "feel" himself punching the trigger. Again he will have nothing to aim at so all he can focus on is that nice clean break of the release. Hope that helps!

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

You might have a point here LKNCHOPPERS. It kinda sounds like a form of Target Panic to me also. Keep it in mind anyway Dan. Good luck

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Steve, I thought you'd say, "get him a recurve"[8D]

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Let me ask you experts something.....would this work?

If he's having "punching" issues....why wouldn't this work......

My wrist strap release is adjustable to where the trigger can be adjusted and activated further back in the knuckle of the trigger finger. I'd move it back and make him activate the "trigger" further back in his trigger finger.

Also....I would "think" that the heavier the trigger was set....the LESS punching he'd do. I may be wrong about this......but my thumb trigger is set pretty heavy. I can pre-load a little on it and not get a false release. Maybe if he saw he could rest his finger/knuckle on there and not trigger a release.....he'd get less punchy????

Again....just trying to help.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

And if you do balnk bale shooting with him.....I'd take the sight off the bow.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Take some string and make a big loop that fits perfectly around his thumb and the other end conects to his release, which should be the same length as his DL. Then he can practice squeezing off the shot without getting tired of pulling his bow back. Speaking of which i need to do this for myself. Can you picture what im saying? It's hard to explain by typing.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Hey Jeff...this actually makes sense I do the oppisite but im gonna try this! :D. I do really well with a light trigger, alot of my problem was if the trigger was loaded heavy I would not squeeze I would pull the trigger and it always got me in trouble. So now I shoot a very light trigger!

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

could he just be getting tired by chance or is it the whole time while shooting??

i know when i dont shoot for a while and loose my muscle and muscle memory, i get real jumpy and punchy...or if i shoot too much in a day and am tired, i loose it and my release is terrible...thats when i realized that backing off the weight was the ticket...as well as standing infront of my bag, closing my eyes and just focusing on my release..still go back to doing that every now and again...

but if he does it all the time, id agree with the others...just thought id throw that out there....

also, is it just 3d targets or spots too??

i had a buddy that could shoot spots OK...but his first couple 3d shoots i never saw someone so jumpy..scared me to be around him...and he had to buy another set of arrows :D but he came around...i tried helping but hes a hard head, been into archery longer than me and didnt wanna hear anything i had to say and got mad so i quit trying to help and watch him loose/break arrows when he shouldnt be...then he realized, for being newer to archery, i outshot him all summer at the shoots...he finally asked for advice, but wasnt dedicated and didnt wanna do what i do to shoot like i can...

funny thing is he ONLY shoots 3d deer targets in his yard...dont know if it was the couple guys watching him or what it was...but he was REAL jumpy...hed draw back and that arrow was gone and if he hit the target we were celebrating lol

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

Lmao! When are you going to get one Kyle?

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

I keep puttin' it off, and puttin it off...I love shooting my friends Montana Longbow, there may be one in the future;)

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

You are correct and these are the correct ways to shoot a wrist rlease but they still need discipline to shoot properly.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

buckeye, have you been watching the "SAW" movies??? :Dyour starting to creep me out [8D]:D
EVERYONE, thanks for all the good advise, i got some great ideas to try with him, you guys are great ;)

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

If it is target panic, manipulating releases will only work temporarily, if at all. Blank bale and shooting with my eyes closed didn't help either. For me target panic was brought on when the desired point of impact or the bullseye came into the sight picture. Target panic is tough to deal with and requires drills to get under control. I guess the best way to tell if he has Target Panic is to see if he can keep his sight pin hovering on the bullseye without pulling the trigger (finger should be on the release trigger). Don't try to force him to do it, if he can't, he can't.

What does he say about his shooting? Is he feeling OK with it, or is he frustrated? Target Panic will make him frustrated for sure.

RE: Getting my son better at 3-D????
 

There is indeed some frustration from him, like i said he used to be great on target shooting, now he is dealing with this. His efforts in the woods have been outstanding for his young age. I guess if hes killing Deer then i have nothing to worry about, but would like to see him do better on targets, Im guessing when he is in hunt mode he is in another mind state and controls what he is doing more. I got to watch him shoot his buck this season first hand, he did everything spot on, i could not ask for more. He's my best buddy in the woods and im just always trying to make him better ;)