THWACK_007

1. Yes I have been following this discussion...about people not liking the fact that they have lost free places tohunt. Public land is free to hunt.
2. Outfitters put a squeeze on the average hunter???? No one is making them hunt with an outfitter! They can hunt public land for free!
3. When did we say we were the saviors of the outdoor world??
4. When did an outfitter ever say that "we" gave you the deer??

THWACK_007

Uuuhhhh.....OK!!!

philip_grubaugh

People can do what they want to. I have hunted with them and some are good and some are not. It's an experience either way

Splitear_Leland

So Thwack, just an honest question. Do you think everyone who doesn't pay for permission to hunt should hunt public property. If it were up to you, should everyone who hunts private property either own it or pay leasing fees. Do you understand what my side of the argument is. If not, I don't know how I can be much clearer. I understand perfectly where you are coming from and I'm not going to try to stop you from doing what you are doing. I couldn't if I wanted to anyways. I just think it is a shame what hunting is coming to, and I refuse to take part in the oldidea of hunting as a pastime becoming a just that, an old idea. I think hunting is changing, and for the worse. You guys that take advantage ofor are changing with it, you are probably smarter than I am, but I still stand strong for what I believe in. And if that means that one day I will have to quithunting, well I'll do it sadly, but with pride. IMO outfitting and leasing are changing the sport for what most of us will agree is for the worse, but if that is the way it must be, well....so be it.

Mizzouhunter

Ok, so if we assume leasing and outfitting is the problem...what is the solution? More government regulation? Outfitting/Lease bans, i.e. criminalize outfitting?

In a free market system, there are winners and losers. I don't likehaving to lease property to hunt, but that isgoing to be my first purchase after I graduate fromlaw school. (As long asthe ol' lady ok's it.)

Splitear_Leland

That's just it Mizzou, I don't think there is a solution. Trust me, being a business major, I know all about the free market system, but I think it is a shame that hunting is just that, a free market business system, don't you agree?

TEmbry

LOL why do you guys get to decide what someone else does with HIS land? You claim you cant afford to lease land. So what if the farmer is in the same money situation as you? Should he let the guy he barely knows continue to hunt for FREE or lease it out to a group of hunters or outfitter? No brainer and dont claim for a second that you all wouldnt do the same.

You keep claiming everyone is greedy, but you are the one who wants to continue hunting land for free when the land owner is offered money on a lease.

His land= His decision. If it really is IMPOSSIBLE to find private land to hunt, head to the public land. Many people on here CHOOSE public land over private land.

Your whole greed areguement, just paints you as a hypocrit.

Splitear_Leland

TEmbry,
I don't for a minute blame a landowner for taking advantage of an opportunity to make any money off his property, and yes I would do the same. And it is not impossible to find private ground, but that is soon becoming the case. As I said, I see your side of the argument, but do you agree that money is soon going to become, as it does with everything, the thing that drives the sport. I am no hypocrite, but I simply believe that hunting is not what it once was, and I think it is sad. If it comes to the point where I and the other thousands of hunters can only hunt public ground, and I have to set my treestand 20 feet from another hunter, I am going to quit, because I will no longer enjoy or believe in the sport. Again, though my earlier posts may have suggested it, I have no quarrel with you, but I still believe that OURsport is slowly going downhill. And if you can't agree with me on that, you are not a true hunter.

TEmbry

I don't know about downhillbut i see your point in this last post. No one wants to be stacked in public land like cordwood. I just saw people earlier ripping on landowners for leasing their land and this is greed. No other way of looking at it.They want what they no longer can have for free.

Money is starting to drive hunting, but it does with everything in life though. I cant think of anything in life where money isnt a big factor.

Mizzouhunter

I see where you are coming from, but...although hunting is a money-driven industry...it is also an industry driven by hunter demand. If no one was willing to pay outfitters, there wouldn't be outfitters.

With respect to leases, it is a good option for someone like me. I can't afford large chunks of land that I want to hunt. But I probably will be able to afford to lease land. And I realize that when I lease land, someone who washunting for freehas now 'lost' a spot. But clearly I value thathunting spot more than someone unwilling to match my price.

Same goes for outfitters. It is economically efficient to allow hunters and outfitters to operate the way they do now.Think of it like this...outfitters do the worka lotsome hunters don't like to do...Scout, place stands, clear shooting lanes, etc. Maybebecause some hunters time is better spent elsewhere.We all know the guys who huntare hardcore hunters opening weekend and then could care less the other 363 days of the year. And if somehunter wants to hunt out-of-state andpays an outfitter, you can't really blame theguys providinga service.

It just makes economic sense. Do I likethe fact thatsome hunters are being displaced? No. Buteverybody has to play the hand they were dealt.