Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I know some of you guys employ a thumb trigger release for target shooting. Some probably do for hunting, as well.

Mine will be here, today. I used a thumb release for a short time a little over a year ago....and honestly never got the hang of it. That's not saying much;). User error, quite likely.

1. Will this change my anchor points....to the point that I have to re-ingrain them?

2. What are the things I need to look out for....so as not to ingrain BAD habits with this style release?

Any other hints are greatly appreciated. Thank you.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Jeff I switched to a thumd trigger release 2 years ago and it really improved my shooting. I had a bad habit of trigger punching which has stopped since I switched. My anchor point did not change. Instead of anchoring withthe knuckle of my index finger tucked into the divet under my ear lobe Inow anchor with the knuckle of my middle finger in the same place. The one word of warning that I will give you is that when I lose concentration I have a tendency to let go of the release which can be disasterous. I bought a wrist strap so thatif that happens at least my release doesn't go flying down range.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I just got my Chocolate addiction yesterday and have not had a chance to shoot it much. Hopefully I will be able to practice with it some today.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Jeff,


It won't change your anchor point but it will make your anchor "feel" a little off until you get used to it. Like anything else, it'll take some getting used to. It may also make your draw length shorter, or atleast feel shorter. If that makes any sense. I also think I remember you saying that you ordered a Carter, I know with my Carter, it changed my POI. The way I use a thumb release is that, I draw it with my thumb behind the trigger, I then get settled in at full draw, wrap my thumb AROUND the trigger, applying a little pressure, I then start floating the pin and pulling with my back. You want the release to be set a little on the heavy side, allowing you to use backtension. The most important thing that I had to remember was that I needed to wrap my thumb around the trigger and just start "pulling", while I "float" the pin.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

It sounds, MAtt.....like you're creating a BT release with a trigger style.

Is that correct?

THAT is what I want to do.

I hope it gives me (at least) the impression that my draw is a "tad" shorter. Nothing wrong with that.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

There will be slight differences but nothing to drastic and should be very easy for you to adapt to.Draw length is affected a little also but that is really determined by the release.

Here is how I shoot each,bt,thumb and wrist.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxOwEPsvHVQ

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

You can get a thumb release with a short neck that will actually give you a little more draw length.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I use to switch back and forth, thumb for everything but hunting. I had to shorten the bow when I went to a wrist strap, and change the peep height. It all depends on how you anchor, the length of the release and the length of the loop (if any).

Try not to use your thumb to set off the release. ideally it will be back tension and the trigger will be pretty much at the joint where your thumb touches your hand. Do not use the thumb itself. Either shoot it with BT or alternatly shoot it by pulling with your pinky finger (or other fingers) and pulling the trigger into your hand, I've also seen them successfully show by slowly making a fist.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Not mine, I can switch from my Carter to my trigger release with no change of POI.

I'm not understanding if your anchor doesn't change, why is your POI changing? Was it left/right or high/low?

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I don't think they are for everyone...when I shot competitive 3D I tried one on and off for a summer with one of my bows and never got used to it or liked the feel of it at all...

I hope you like yours!

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I'm not sure why, but I couldn't change from my Sabertooth dual caliper, to my Carter and be dead on. Not sure why.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I agree with Rob, My point of impact does not change from Thumb trigger to index but that is me. Matt / pa is the best I have seen at shooting one of these. PM him. I actually switch back and forth between BT and thumb trigger. The thumb trigger, done properly, will do you well GMMAT. STICK WITH IT.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I know that I actually do anchor in a slightly different spot on my face with an index vs a thumb trigger / handheld because my peep height is not interchangable between the 2 releases. There is a slight variation and I can't swap back and forth. I would have to go and get the 2 styles and really feel where I have my hand in relation to my jawline but there has to be certain "landmarks" that fit the contours of my hand more naturally and also allow me to keep the string in a direct line with my hand and eye rather than out to the side on the most lateral portion of my jaw.
You'll know you are not anchored in a good spot if you feel like you have to tilt your head to the direction of your release hand to get your eye centered in your peep.
Some guys go forward of this point with a short anchor, some guys go behind but they both accomplish the same thing of getting your peep properly aligned with your eye laterally.

As for how your POI is affected with respect to release changes that's going to vary based upon 2 things, location of anchor on your face obviously and release style. The string or string loop doesn't behave the same out of every caliper release. I could take my Scott "Rhino" and my Scott "Wildcat" set for the same barrel length and trigger psoition coupled with the same anchor and the wildcat will shoot an 1" or so left of where the Rhino will just because of how the string loop clears the jaws.

There is no given with respect to swapping back and forth among any releases and POI.........some might find the POI is the same and others completely different. Shooting styles, anchor points, face shapes, jaw styles make that impossible to say that it should or shouldn't.

What was the original question? LOL:D I guess I should go back and read huh? I got caught up on this page first.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

POI can change from index finger to thumb trigger, or thumb trigger to thumb trigger. The jaws can cause different amounts of torque on the loop and string, it can cause different amounts of contact on your face which affects POI, etc. My TRU Ball ST-3 and my Carter Just Cuz impact in different places.

I haven't shot an index finger release in years, but when I did still and swapped back and forth between releases my anchor changed, as well as my loop length to accomodate this. My loop length can also change from different types of thumb triggers depending on the distance from my fingers, and the jaw/caliper/hook.

I'd really recommend taking as many shots as you can on the blank bale to get to know how to shoot this release without aiming at anything, but I guess it really boils down to how much commitment you are willing to make to get a super clean shot execution. 100% of coaches would tell you that you should not be aiming at anything for the first severalthousand shots at least when changing to a thumb trigger for the first time, but for most people it isn't worth that type of work to them. It really boils down to what you want to get out of it I guess.

That book will be at your place tomorrow, I'd suggest reading through it first before really doing much with that release. It's probably the best resource published today to teach you how to properly setup and execute that release in a repeatable manner.

Edit** Looks like Matt beat me to this while I was typing this novel......[8D]

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I took some shots with my new thumb release last night. I'm positive I'm not committed enough to take thousands of balnk bale shots;), but I'm looking forward to the literature.

My POI DID change, slightly. I was shooting slightly low with the new release. Simple sight housing adjustment and I was right back on track.

Another thing I HAVE to do is remember to fully rotate my release hand to a vertical position every time. I was getting mixed results rotating to differing degrees.

I can also tell that this IS the release for me for targets and blind hunting. I feel MUCH more in control of the release being "stable" with this style release. I'll be anxiously awaiting how my results improve over the next several months.

My last 12 arrows (20 yds) were all 10 rings (Vegas face), last night. I hope to get a LOT more practice.....AFTER I read how I'm "really" supposed to be doing this.

Thanks a LOT guys.;)

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Just do this......:D

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I'm not sure if Larry's book that Matt's sending you will say anything about it, but as you can see Dave up above in Matt's post, most recommend NOT turning your hand all the way to vertical, as it places stress on your forearm at the shot.. just something to consider before you begin ingraining a motion in your memory. :)

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I was getting ready to make the exact same post.:D

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I agree but if it works,it works,this guy got pretty good doing it the "wrong" way.;) But do try to get the angle working first,because vertical is definately NOT the norm.


You can see the tension difference in the 2 forearms pictured and both these guys are among the worlds best archers.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

GREAT "catch", greg. I think I must have misspoke. What I WASN'T doing ....is rotating my hand ENOUGH. When duplicating the motion sitting here....I KNOW I don't go to full vertical. I think I would notice the strain in the forearm.

Thanks, though. That was a good catch. I think I meant (heck I dunno) I wasn't rotating until the back of my hand was against my face. I think I was not getting a solid anchor most times.

Rob/PA sent me a photo....and the other thing I had to watch for was getting the trigger mechanism too far out on my thumb. The photo Matt/PA posted shows the correct orientation of where the trigger mech. needs to be in your thumb "crevice".

Gonna be fun learning this new technique.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

2 indicators to tell if you are doing it correctly for a beginner.....

1. The shot startles you. Maybe REALLY startles you at first. :D
2. Your hand will flow freely toward your shoulder like you see Dave Cousins doing, this implies you are using back tension and following through.

If the shot doesn't at least "surprise" you andyour hand stays exactly where it was when you shot you did it wrong and without back tension........

I remember years ago when I was first learning to shoot one properly I was like a grenade with the pin pulled just wondering when the stinkin thing was going to go off. [:-]Until you get a real feel for it you will have some shots that go off way too quick and otehr times you are left at full draw wondering what is going on and why isn't this stupid thing going off? LOL
Until you learn how much to preload the trigger and how to get through the shot progression properly you will have some good ones and some bad ones but you will find a lot of times even the bad ones will be in the middle. If you just let that pin float and don't try to command the trigger the arrows find their mark like they have a mind of their own.

We are not machines and are incapable of holding the pin benchrest solid in the center of the target. If we strain and try to force it to stay there or punch the trigger when the pin is in the center, then the pin has nowhere to go but AWAY from the X ring. If we allow our mind and relaxed aiming to just let the pin float then themajority of the time it is moving back TOWARDS the X ring and the majority of the time a surprise release will make the arrow find the center.
It's like magic, there are many times when I thought I completely blew a shot only to find it somewhere in the X because I just concentrated on making a solid properly executed shot rather than worry about the pin sitting dead center as steady as I could make it.
That's not saying that you should be drawing circles all over the target with your pin, you should hold as steady and as small as your body will allow, but once you settle in the middle just relax and concentrate on where you are trying to hit and don't worry if the pin is bobbing a bit........at that point just pull the shot off properly.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Without reading the rest of the posts......... this is how you want to shoot that thumb trigger. I switced to one a few years ago for hunting, and I'll NEVER use s wrist strap/index trigger again. I target shoot with a back tension, and using a thumb trigger for hunting makes the transition a breeze.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

To expand on this, and this is something you won't see in the book I sent you Jeff, my coach had me build into my shot sequence a destination contact point for my release hand to go to after the shot explodes. This way I'm pulling through the shot to a touch point/destination with that release hand to bring a more consistent finish/closure to the shot.When he was explaining this to me he actually used agolf analagy which may make a lot of sense to you. When you swing for the ball with a golf club, you will become more consistent if you are intending to end that swing with a destination (end of your follow through) rather than just ending it when you have hit the ball.

This is something that was VERY helpful to me that you won't see in that book, and you don't see in Dave's video clip that Matt shared. It brings closure to the execution of the shot in a MUCH more repeatable fashion (at least for me).

Hope this helps.....

Below is a quick clip showing my release handcoming to a destination point on my deltiod after the shot breaks.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I'm glad I'm not paying for all this.

(Thanks, Matt(s) ;))

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Matt,very good description of shot sequence and rick/matt,I have never really thought about the end point but I watched the clip of me with all 3 styles of releases and my hand ends at the same point with all 3.Go figure.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Great advice here. The additional advice that I have is get used to shooting the release before tackling uphill and downhill shots. When you start shooting at hard angles up or down, its not going to take long to figure out if your draw length is correct or not.

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

I just got back from the indoor range. I'm about as frustrated with archery as I've ever been (targets). I'm so inconsistent with this thing right now. I hope it gets better:)

I went ahead and turned the #-age down on my bow as I left.....thinking I'm going to be shooting a LOT in the near future. I really hope I can be disciplined enough to put in the time it's gonna take to realize the benefits of this......but we'll see. I don't wanna do ANYTHING (again) in archery that seems like "work".

Again...to all....thanks for all the tips. And Matt (RJ)...I got the DVD and book last night. That might be why I'm so frustrated!:D That "push/pull" thing has probably taught me that my draw is too long. It's uncomfortable as hell. The 82nd I have on order is 1/2" shorter on the draw. I hope that makes it more comfortable.

We'll see how this unfolds!

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

If you are still at the same draw as the pic you posted a while back then that will definately make things more difficult.

Hard to use the back muscles if they are already extended out too far.;)

RE: Thumb release guys.....question(s)
 

Thanks, TFOX. YES.....I'm at the same draw. I ordered my 82nd 1/2" shorter. if that's not enough....I'll order more mods.

I'm committed to this.....I'm just anxious.

Thanks for your help