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Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Here's my delimma.....
According to my wildlife Bio.......I need to take 8 does out of the herd, this season....as a start to managing the herd, here. To be able to do this.....I need to be in the woods. To be in the woods.....I am going to pressure the herd, some. This being only my second serious bowhunting season.....I'm in the "more" prime areas of my available hunting land, more. "I" think the deer are going to adapt to the pressure. I think they're going to utilize these good areas less and less.....the more I intrude. Thus my delimma. If I don't go in there.....I can't take out what I need to. If I do go in there.....I risk pushing them elsewhere. I'm realizing what a task my pre-set goal is, now. It's a chess game. Every move could decide the final outcome. Every play is important. Carelessness in a hunt could set up my "opponent" for a winning play........many moves down the line. I think I'm on "defense", now.....and that's not the way to play the "game". Playing it "right" is fun. Playing it the way I have, so far, is taking a chance that my opponent will slip up and give me easy moves......which I'm finding is not the "norm". My point? Sometimes NOT hunting is the right "move". Sometimes leaving the Bishop where he is ......and sacrificing a pawn is the right move. Sometimes walking away from the board and re-assessing your overall strategy is the right NON-move. Hunting smart takes more discipline than hunting "hard". You can't kill 'em from the couch, but you can't kill 'em if you pushed them out of your area, either. Fine line...... |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Hunting smart takes more discipline than hunting "hard". |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
CHECK MATE!
ORIGINAL: GMMAT Here's my delimma..... According to my wildlife Bio.......I need to take 8 does out of the herd, this season....as a start to managing the herd, here. To be able to do this.....I need to be in the woods. To be in the woods.....I am going to pressure the herd, some. This being only my second serious bowhunting season.....I'm in the "more" prime areas of my available hunting land, more. "I" think the deer are going to adapt to the pressure. I think they're going to utilize these good areas less and less.....the more I intrude. Thus my delimma. If I don't go in there.....I can't take out what I need to. If I do go in there.....I risk pushing them elsewhere. I'm realizing what a task my pre-set goal is, now. It's a chess game. Every move could decide the final outcome. Every play is important. Carelessness in a hunt could set up my "opponent" for a winning play........many moves down the line. I think I'm on "defense", now.....and that's not the way to play the "game". Playing it "right" is fun. Playing it the way I have, so far, is taking a chance that my opponent will slip up and give me easy moves......which I'm finding is not the "norm". My point? Sometimes NOT hunting is the right "move". Sometimes leaving the Bishop where he is ......and sacrificing a pawn is the right move. Sometimes walking away from the board and re-assessing your overall strategy is the right NON-move. Hunting smart takes more discipline than hunting "hard". You can't kill 'em from the couch, but you can't kill 'em if you pushed them out of your area, either. Fine line...... |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Sometimes you need more than 1 playing board!
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
The season is very long, it doesnt need to all be done in a month. Take your time, hunt when the conditions are in your favor and if you dont end up taking out 8 does, its not the end of the world. I know that you guys are allowed to bait there, and i know you and i agree that its easier to shoot a doe that isnt over bait, but in your situation, maybe you might want to bait in a nonprime area to try to get one that way. Just a thought.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
ORIGINAL: GR8atta2d Sometimes you need more than 1 playing board! |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Jeff, how much land do you have access to hunt (acres)? Also, how many stands do you have on that land?
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
ORIGINAL: njbuck22 The season is very long, it doesnt need to all be done in a month. Take your time, hunt when the conditions are in your favor and if you dont end up taking out 8 does, its not the end of the world. I know that you guys are allowed to bait there, and i know you and i agree that its easier to shoot a doe that isnt over bait, but in your situation, maybe you might want to bait in a nonprime area to try to get one that way. Just a thought. If thats isnt an option i would concentrate on the big concentration of does and take them there. Hopefully the bucks are using a different area and it wont affect them much. Durring the rut the will be where the does are regardless. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
How late into the year is your seaon open? Sometimes late season is the easiest to take out does as their feeding options are rather limited.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Isn't it cool!
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
ORIGINAL: buckeyebuckhntr How late into the year is your seaon open? Sometimes late season is the easiest to take out does as their feeding options are rather limited. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Jeff
That is why 1 person can not do it IMO. I have had this discussion with many of my MI hunters. You will over hunt 1 farm and they will move to the other where they are not being hunted. IMO the only way a thinning can take place is with support of hunting by all in a area. Being you are it, it makes it real tough. Good luck |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Jeff - I face the same dilema. This weekend is going to be hot for MD (upper 80's) and humid. Yet at the same time the deer are feasting on acorns... I've got an oak patch that is3/4 mile walk... and no permanent stand there, so I need to take a climber.I just dont know if its worth ruining an area w/ tons of scent.. I might take the risk if the wind is perfect... also I've hunted the farm 3 nights now and am worried about pressuring the deer!! What to do, what to do!
But to Gr8attude's point, Ive got other farms to hunt... Which is probably my plan... but we shall see, either way I hate hunting in the heat... |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Well let's look at this from a management stand-point. The stated goal is herd reduction..it's not aboutthe hunt. It's whats right for the herd! So if I may borrow your line it's not about us it's about them, the benefit of the entire herd by the reduction of the few.
However you wish this to happen in a timely manner so they can begin to see the benefits..How many deer can ya legally take in a day in NC??? When is Gun season...Following along here? It's whats right for the herd! Minimal intrusion maximum kill... simple! |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
First.....
Sometimes you need more than 1 playing board! Secondly.... I can't gun hunt the land I hunt.....even if I was so inclined. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
You know if thinning the doe herd was truly my only goal for a season I honestly wouldn't focus on getting it done only with a bow. Especially if this meant chances of educating the herd...........
I have a similar goal as you this year (I need to get 4 out of there) and I'm still bowhunting asI normally would because I know I can finish the doe thinning much more effectively during firearms season. If doe thinning is your true goal for the year I'd at least think about it as a "tool" to get the job done in a very effective manner.............. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Woops, looks like someone else posted the same thoughts I had on firearms.......guess this isn't an option.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Well I understand you can't accomplish your goal hunting another piece of property..BUt that would afford you hunting time while your core area ...airs out.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
ORIGINAL: GMMAT First..... Sometimes you need more than 1 playing board! Secondly.... I can't gun hunt the land I hunt.....even if I was so inclined. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Sounds like managing your deer heard is preparing for the future. So you can either hunt this year and try to take the buck that is there, or risk pushing him out for this year and take the does to make your herd healthier and stronger for years to come. It just depends on how long you plan on hunting this property.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
While I never tried to take 8 does off of one property I do know people who hunt the park system program around here. They are assigned an area maybe 10 acres? in size that they are limited to. Some of those guys will kill 5-10 over the course of a season in their little spot. When it comes to does, I think you can get away with a lot more intrusions than a mature buck. It’s just all about picking your spots.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Jeff like someone mentioned before, you could always bring people you trust in there and allow them to take a few does as well.
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
My experience is that hunting pressure won't make much effect on the deer long term. They may get spooked for a while, but if the food source is good they'll be back.
And if you do scare some of the deer away...isn't that in fact reducing YOUR herd? |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
How many acres are you hunting? If I remember correctly it was less that 100? I'm not sure I would even be worried about management..
I agree with Germ 100%. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Hey....Some good questions....and I don't have any answers. I'm not sure what Bob meant, Scott....but my No.1 goal is the doe reduction. Getting a buck is secondary. I am going to PA in late Oct.....so I'll have a chance, there, too.
Sticking to the doe reduction.....the catch-22 still exists. Although I hunt less than 100 acres.....the herd has a square mile that I'm keeping up with the harvests on (except for the family of slobs who live behind me). That's what I base what I should take on. The guys on 2 of the adjacent farms are keeping tabs AND trying to take does, too. The parks system is a refuge of over 200 more acres that can't be hunted, legally. I'm just trying. It may prove futile. If it does....I'll just hunt it differently in the future. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Although I hunt less than 100 acres.....the herd has a square mile that I'm keeping up with the harvests on Just out of curiousity, how are you keeping up with the harvest within this square mile? |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
We kill 40-50 deer a year on 3 different farms...I try to not take more than 10 bucks a year and this includes button bucks and smaller bucks killed by my younger nieces and nephews....
Here in NC we are in an extreme drought and the NC Wildlife has decided that we can get extra doe tags, free....I've already killed 2 does from one stand...Piont is, this is probably the best year we have had for reducing the herd because of the lack of acorns... I don't remember your feelings on baiting, but I will tell you, if you are trying to reduce the herd and do so with a bow, it is legal here in NC and this would be a good reason to use it as a management tool....Folks think that if you do this you are killing a deer every time you go, sometimes it's nice to sit back and watch...... 20 pounds a week will bring them in, use a bag seeder, distribute it where you want them...After taking 2-3 from a stand, move, sometimes 75 yards is all that's needed...After you hunt 3-4 times and pattern them, move in that direction, mix it up and you will see deer all season...We do usually have a 2 week lull the first of December, but it picks up again the last 2 weeks of the season...Good Luck... |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
ORIGINAL: GMMAT I'm not sure what Bob meant, Scott....but my No.1 goal is the doe reduction. I'm just saying additional property would allow your area to "air out" ..give it a break...it would mean you could hunt more and pressure your key area less. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Wow I never knew you were doing this on less than 100 acres. That puts a different perspective on things. Good luck with that. Don't you have/want another location to hunt as an option so you don't burn your primary land? Just out of curiousity, how are you keeping up with the harvest within this square mile? I keep up with the harvests by talking to the adjacent farmers and lease owners (there's actually only5 other "groups" hunting this area). Over 300 acres is posted and allows no hunting. One guy owns about 17 acres and only he hunts it. Another is the lease I'm trying to get on (He's taxi'ing my '07 bow turkey). The next is the farmer to my south with the depredation permit. The next is the 2 guys to my east that gun hunt, only......and then there's me. Of course.....thsi doesn't include the slobs who likely hunt it ALL. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
ORIGINAL: GMMAT My point? Sometimes NOT hunting is the right "move". Sometimes leaving the Bishop where he is ......and sacrificing a pawn is the right move. Sometimes walking away from the board and re-assessing your overall strategy is the right NON-move. Hunting smart takes more discipline than hunting "hard". You can't kill 'em from the couch, but you can't kill 'em if you pushed them out of your area, either. Fine line...... But you said in the above quote that not hunting there is the right move (or may be the right move) Since I, and others, assume you love hunting (asmost of usdo) and would want to be in "A" woods...while your bishop was staying put...that other land would afford the option to be outdoors hunting...thats all. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
8 deer 8 hunts 8 differnt locals . whats the presssure good luck if you need some help getting up to 8 give me a call i am hunting some privit land where the guys needed help geting the doe count down and i saw two yesterday and a button buck in two hours
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RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
I hear ya GR8. I'd love to have another option....and I'm working on that.
Still don't help my sitch! Gotta be there to kill 'em. |
RE: Catch-22......Deer Management-wise....
Being on another farm does nothing to help (unless I'm missing something??????). Since I, and others, assume you love hunting (asmost of usdo) and would want to be in "A" woods...while your bishop was staying put...that other land would afford the option to be outdoors hunting...thats all. Like you said, sometimesNOT hunting is the best option. While that may be true, that's not a very good alternative IMO [:-][8D]. That's why I have secondary pieces of property setup. On the days where you feel you're overhunting your primary spot it's nice to have another place to climb a tree, hunt and give your bread and butter property a break (especially early in the season). |
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