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hey you guys,

I took some pics of my bowtuning and some of a fieldtrip to the Belgian woods yesterday morning......
All I need to do is change some major laws and I can use my bow on something else than foam targets....

please feel free to make comments, here or on the flickr site

here's the link;

http://www.flickr.com/photos/69041177@N00/sets/72157600304831105/

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Can't get any pictures to upload. Where the heck is the tech. support?

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nice pics, the animals there sure do look different than the ones here!

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Nice pics Frank,

Looks like a zoo over there! The animals over there obviously don't fear humans. What's that first animal in the petting zoo? No St. Pauli Girl though :(

Although your groupings are not too bad for getting started (but I don't know the distance), looking at all the different entry angles on those arrows, I do not think your bow is well tuned. Unless it was real windy or after hitting the target it moved for your next shot, the shafts should all be fairly parallel to one another (and not have random angles). I'm thinking with all that playing with the sight, that it is not properly aligned. The arrow can make its way back to center, but it will have erratic flight and decrease your accuracy. What is your range on these shots and is the target moving?

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Everything is looking better. The left to right has me baffled though. You have a lot of great animals out there.

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You are shooting from the wrong side....:)

Part of your problem (and I have only picked up on part of them) is as Lebeau said, I think you have a slight tuning issue. Also, I think you have a slight torque issue, seems like you have that bow in a death lock. Also, try rolling that right shoulder away from you. That will put a slight, natural bend in your arm. I can't tell exactly where your hips are in relation to your feet or your shoulders, but it doesn't look like you have the disco hip issue that so many folks seem to have. Your draw length looks spot on, which is a good thing.

I read the other post about getting poor flight off the bow. Some of that might be because of your clenched grip, but most likely its either a centershot or spine issue.

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That is a pretty, tranquil place. Be nice if you could kill something huh.

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Swamp,

I PM'd Frank a picture of a better grip after looking at the pictures that I beleive will cure any torquing issues.Not me in the picture. it's from a Matthews Forum and I was shown the same grip from a guy at the range. Works great.

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thx for the tips,

I'll try that grip next time I go shooting, see what happens

and I'll post some more pics and let you guys know the progress ( hopefully )

F.

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Nice pics. All that game and you can't hunt it.[:@] That's like putting a diabetic in a candy shop.

I agree with Dave about the tourquing. Try that grip and see if it helps and relax your bow hand a little.

Good luck.

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That is my grip:Dalmost I have my fingures extended, I may try that also

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Actually taking those pics was a good thing, I can see my stance and I need to roll my shoulder back a bit and change my grip as well, like you guys said.
I might try and change my peep as well, so I can place the string on the tip of my nose...
So, the girlfriend will have to take more pics then.....

Thx once again....

F.

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Lebeau,

the first critter I shot on camera ( wish it was something else than a camera !! ) is a european moeflon or wild sheep ( Ovis gmelini musimon)
they're very rare around these here, so I'm glad I saw a healthy herd that day, three young bucks, two big adult bucks and maybe 30 goats....

to this day it's illegal to hunt with a bow here in Belgium, but you can in France, Spain and Italy ( they have Ibex you can hunt )

F.

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Germ,

Iused to do that grip with my fingers open. I was told though that by keeping the fingers open the bow moves further into the V of my hand andI can still torque the bow. The other pictures from that guy showed how the arrow reacted with his fingers in diffrent positions.I guess keeping the fingers closed is allows you to feel the middle finger slightly touching the grip for consistant grip. Not sure about that since it's a new grip for me. MDBUCKHUNTER has the link to where the guy conducted the tests if you want to shoot him a PM.

It grip took a little getting used to (about 300 shots). However, it's made a big difference in my shooting consistancy wise. I did have to adjust my sights once I got used to the grip.

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Dave,

Allright, I'm curious about the grip picture. My grip is similar but torqued more to the inside, where the center grip is about lined up with the lifeline of my palm. I usually draw with my fingers extended and then bring the fingertips of my first three fingers (not pinky) to rest with slight pressure on the front of the grip. Does this sound like an okay grip? I'm not sure about moving the grip more to the outside of my palm (on the thumb muscle) like in the picture.

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Will,
I'm not an expert on grips at all. I was shown this grip at the range and then sent the link by MDBUCKHUNTER which shows the same grip I was shown after we started discussing it.

I used to keep my fingers open except for the pointer fingerand hold the bow in the V of my hand but found I torqued the bow even with that grip. With this grip you'd have to squeeze pretty hard to actually torque the bow by squeezing with your hand. It's actually hard to squeeze and if you do it will cramp the heck out of your hand. i still draw back with my hand open and then go to this grip.

Hopefully, some of the guys on here with a lot more experience than me on this grip can shed some light?

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Dave,

Thanks "V" sounds better than lifeline (felt like some kind of tarot card reader). I see how it has the potential for more torque because you are basically between two muscle/bone groups with the V, but not if you have it on your thumb pad. I haven't had torquing issues (just the ocassional frustrating flyer due to lack of concentration), so I'll wait till I do to try it.

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You know I go back and forth on my hand. I started out with the grip as shown when I was 12. I go from open hand to close, but with your comments I may just stick to close hand.

thank you:)

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I'm just passing along info that's shown and given to me. The first few times i shot like this i thought it was a mistake to change. But's it's natural now. Glad to help as long asI don't screw any of you guyss up.Sounds like you are already using this grip at times though.

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http://forums.mathewsinc.com/viewtopic.php?t=54841

Here is the link. Very good reading.

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really helped me along this link, thx

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From what I can tell in those pics this is what I see. Your draw seems a bit long. Your peep might be out of location because it looks like you are tipping your head into it a bit. Not too bad though. Your grip is set too far into your hand and may be too tight ( can never tell that from a picture). You also seem to be pushing the bow with the top of your hand, rather than heeling it, which would be better. You don't want the pressure in the web of your hand, but rather the pad of your thumb where the bone is.

Your release is also too loose and sliding down your hand. It should be tight enough to stay on your wrist, you shouldn't have to hold onto it like that or have it slide into your hand like it looks like it is doing. Everything should be relaxed when you are at full draw. The only effort you should exert is keeping the bow drawn and holding it up. Your draw hand should be relaxed as well as your bow fingers.

Don't shoot with an open grip, this makes you force your fingers open which uses more muscles than you need and is harder to do consistently. Set your grip, come to full draw and let your fingers fall where they are and keep them relaxed.

The picture shown is a good way to set your grip, but don't keep your fingers balled up like that while shooting or aiming. Unless you can do it without forcing them to stay way.

You might have better luck touching the string to your nose instead of pulling it to the side as well. It will give you a more consistent anchor in most cases. The way you shoot works well for people that shoot with glasses though.

I'm not a big of fan of shooting with a quiver on the bow either.

You might also consider a string loop, especially with a shoot through type rest. I think it might work out better for you.

That being said, I shot almost exactly like you do right now for about a year. I shot pretty well and didn't have a lot of trouble getting my bow tuned.

I can tell nothing from the pictures of the arrows in the target. I would have to actually watch you shoot them to tell anything. It is hard to go by what the arrows look like AFTER they hit the target. It is not uncommon for arrows to shift as they enter the target or while coming to a stop. Depends on the medium sometimes. If your arrows are that far off at that distance something is SERIOUSLY wrong. Even if your tune was off they should be stabilized by they time they get to the target.

Try shooting through paper at different distances, this will tell you exactly what your arrows are doing at what distances. I bet if you put up some paper a few feet in front of your target you would get pretty good tears. If not something is pretty messed up.

My opinions and nothing more. And a few pics really isn't much to go on;).

Paul

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Psmurf, I was thinking along the same way. My peep should be higher up so I avoid torque by putting the string or the arrow and it's vanes to my face. and my grip isn't that bad, I have two fingers tucked behind the riser to keep it more level.
My aiming isn't that bad either, in the pics I was looking at my arrows in flight insted of aiming, I just didn't want them to hit too close too eachother and accindently messing them up....
But I'd like to have arows that fly straight to the target.

thx anyway.

Frank