Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
03-22-2007, 12:49 PM
#11
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 568
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
Don't go nocking other hunters for doing things that you personally would not do! I have been on one high fence hunt before. It was high fence because of the exotics which are not native in oklahoma.I don't remember the size of the fenced area, but it was a few hundered acres. The party I was with was boar hunting, with one member going after an exotic.Out of 7 or 8 of us (this was a few years ago and my memory sucks) there was only one boar killed. By the way this was a bow hunting only operation, firearms were not allowed on the ranch.So instead of flying off the handle about high fence operation, maybe you should consider the facts about each ranch before makeing judgement. Like I said earlier don't go nocking other hunters for doing things, going on hunts, that you personally would not do. To each his own... We need to stand up for hunting instead of haveing posts like this.
Chief
Chief
03-22-2007, 12:52 PM
#12
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Phoenixville, PA USA
Posts: 5,541
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
I haven't read the original post yet that seems to have sparked this debate, but here is a little something to chew on.
Some of the high end guided hunts in high fence areas comprise thousands and in some cases tens of thousands of acres of land where the game is free to roam anywhere on that property.
The majority of the land I hunt is locked in by developments, or industrial parks, or roads or some other man made structure. To me anything over 100 acres is huge. As a result the deer I hunt have very few corridors or options in terms of travel lanes and living habitat. There are no fences keeping them in anywhere, but perhaps a few intended to keep them out of some properties.
Which of these would you consider more ethical? Is the fence making the thousands of acres not fair chase? Do my properties not constitute fair chase because there is not a lot of habitat? IMO both are examples of fair chase, but that is just me.
Some of the high end guided hunts in high fence areas comprise thousands and in some cases tens of thousands of acres of land where the game is free to roam anywhere on that property.
The majority of the land I hunt is locked in by developments, or industrial parks, or roads or some other man made structure. To me anything over 100 acres is huge. As a result the deer I hunt have very few corridors or options in terms of travel lanes and living habitat. There are no fences keeping them in anywhere, but perhaps a few intended to keep them out of some properties.
Which of these would you consider more ethical? Is the fence making the thousands of acres not fair chase? Do my properties not constitute fair chase because there is not a lot of habitat? IMO both are examples of fair chase, but that is just me.
03-22-2007, 01:01 PM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: West Tennessee
Posts: 2,333
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
Good point. Also, I grew up hunting public land and have never hunted inside a fence. In my mind it would always have been smaller. Guess it never occurred to me that it was possible to high fence thousands of acres, let alone tens of thousands. Some people have all the money. Guess that's why I don't have it.
03-22-2007, 01:10 PM
#14
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Spring Grove, Pa. USA
Posts: 2,120
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
I own 10.5 acres of "free range" land in the mountains of Pa.Now this acreage sits in the middle of 840 acres.Now that's a nice chunk of land-about 1 square mile.Bordering this 840 acres is all farms-everyone is fenced to keep the horses,cattle and other livestock in.It doesn't keep the deer in though.So basically,my little plot of land is fenced in-by definition.But I've seen deer while spotting on the other side of the fences then seen those same deer walk under my treestand later.On 840 acres,I guarantee thatI could sit in a differant stand everyday for our 6 week long archery season and not see a deer let alone shoot at one if I'm not set up right.It's not a guaranteed deal.JMHO
btw,good luck on your hunt,Campo.Looks like you did you homework and I hope it pays off for you.Sounds like a tough hunt but one that should be very gratifying
btw,good luck on your hunt,Campo.Looks like you did you homework and I hope it pays off for you.Sounds like a tough hunt but one that should be very gratifying
03-22-2007, 01:11 PM
#15
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,251
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
ORIGINAL: chiefks
Don't go nocking other hunters for doing things that you personally would not do! I have been on one high fence hunt before. It was high fence because of the exotics which are not native in oklahoma.I don't remember the size of the fenced area, but it was a few hundered acres. The party I was with was boar hunting, with one member going after an exotic.Out of 7 or 8 of us (this was a few years ago and my memory sucks) there was only one boar killed. By the way this was a bow hunting only operation, firearms were not allowed on the ranch.So instead of flying off the handle about high fence operation, maybe you should consider the facts about each ranch before makeing judgement. Like I said earlier don't go nocking other hunters for doing things, going on hunts, that you personally would not do. To each his own... We need to stand up for hunting instead of haveing posts like this.
Chief
Don't go nocking other hunters for doing things that you personally would not do! I have been on one high fence hunt before. It was high fence because of the exotics which are not native in oklahoma.I don't remember the size of the fenced area, but it was a few hundered acres. The party I was with was boar hunting, with one member going after an exotic.Out of 7 or 8 of us (this was a few years ago and my memory sucks) there was only one boar killed. By the way this was a bow hunting only operation, firearms were not allowed on the ranch.So instead of flying off the handle about high fence operation, maybe you should consider the facts about each ranch before makeing judgement. Like I said earlier don't go nocking other hunters for doing things, going on hunts, that you personally would not do. To each his own... We need to stand up for hunting instead of haveing posts like this.
Chief
Or, you could give PETA some more ammo to sling our way. To each his own you say, well, now when your "own" could screw me out of my hunting rights in the future. Teddy Roosevelt saw this, I dont see why so many hunters today are blind to it.[>:]
03-22-2007, 01:13 PM
#16
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,251
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
ORIGINAL: Germ
Camp don't you have papers to grade? My wife was busy all night last night with papers.
This horse is dead, I hoped after my vacation to come back and talk hunting and help others with hunting.
Talking about fences, camo, carbon clothes, etc etc...does nothing to better our sports, or us as hunters.
Said my peace
Camp don't you have papers to grade? My wife was busy all night last night with papers.
This horse is dead, I hoped after my vacation to come back and talk hunting and help others with hunting.
Talking about fences, camo, carbon clothes, etc etc...does nothing to better our sports, or us as hunters.
Said my peace
Nice to have you back Germ...really missed you!
03-22-2007, 01:13 PM
#17
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Wisconsin and Canada
Posts: 2,415
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
ORIGINAL: Campo
But, did you see the term 'high fence' and if so, where is it?
I didnt think so.
Ok, here is an apology. I am sorry I am a passionate person and stood up for what I believe in. I am also sorry that other people read my posts to say something that they didnt.
ORIGINAL: _Dan
I usually don't get involved in threads like this for obvious reasons. But, it is you who owes her an apology. Here is a direct quote by you from the other thread where you accused her of lying to everyone on here.
"Now, kudos to you for taking down that massive bull. He really is a dandy, but please dont make claims to free range and such, because it is pretty obvious to the general public here that this animal was not free range and the hunt obviously had to be fenced."
ORIGINAL: Campo
No problem, I would still like an apology though concerning your claim that I "stated" your hunt was high fenced...I never made such a claim.
No problem, I would still like an apology though concerning your claim that I "stated" your hunt was high fenced...I never made such a claim.
I usually don't get involved in threads like this for obvious reasons. But, it is you who owes her an apology. Here is a direct quote by you from the other thread where you accused her of lying to everyone on here.
"Now, kudos to you for taking down that massive bull. He really is a dandy, but please dont make claims to free range and such, because it is pretty obvious to the general public here that this animal was not free range and the hunt obviously had to be fenced."
I didnt think so.
Ok, here is an apology. I am sorry I am a passionate person and stood up for what I believe in. I am also sorry that other people read my posts to say something that they didnt.
Wrong again. Different words, exact same meaning.
ORIGINAL: Campo
Now...flame away if you want, but I am busy trying to find elk outside my 1400 acrepen.
Now...flame away if you want, but I am busy trying to find elk outside my 1400 acrepen.
Iappreicate your passion, but I also believe it is severely misdirected.
03-22-2007, 01:19 PM
#18
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 568
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
I am not the one NOT SUPPORTING hunting here. You are Campo. So you are the one giving PETA the ammo, why don't you just go join thier side. When I said to each his own, I meant that just because its not your cup of tea does not mean that it won't or can't be some one else's. I'm done here.
03-22-2007, 01:28 PM
#19
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Mont County, Pa
Posts: 7,368
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
I think posts like this simply instigate trouble. I don't know why, but it's intentional.People know when certain (controversial) subjects are going toget things started.[:@]Aren't there more pleasant subjects to discuss?
03-22-2007, 01:32 PM
#20
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,251
RE: Differences between high fence, low fence, and fair chase.
I do not think that killing an animal inside of a high fence is hunting...it is merely shooting a farm raised animal, so we could call it farming and then slaughtering. Now, if AnnaMaries animal was not under high fence, that is fine and well. I will publicly apoligize to her for my flame, but I still stand by my opinion.
Fair Chase Ethics should be taken a lot more seriously in my opinion. Let us think back to last year and the incidents on a high fence farm and a certain fishing celebrity...now, what is the difference between pushing animals by force around a 5 acre pen and pushing animals across a 5,000 acre pen? Well, the difference is 4,995 acres, but it is the slippery slope that worries me. If we can shoot a elk in a 5000 acre pen, then some people will argue that they can be shot in a 500 acre pen, and so on and so forth. Now, every man and woman in this country has a right to so whatever they want, but, we also have the right to critique each other. Now, some people are saying I should keep my nose out of this, and others have said (ahem Germ
) that it is a dead horse. To me, there is no dead horse when I think it reflects badly on the hunting community in general. Now, is it legal,yes it is, that does not make it right in my mind. Like so many things in this world, legal does not make it right, nor does it signal ethicallity.
Fair Chase Ethics should be taken a lot more seriously in my opinion. Let us think back to last year and the incidents on a high fence farm and a certain fishing celebrity...now, what is the difference between pushing animals by force around a 5 acre pen and pushing animals across a 5,000 acre pen? Well, the difference is 4,995 acres, but it is the slippery slope that worries me. If we can shoot a elk in a 5000 acre pen, then some people will argue that they can be shot in a 500 acre pen, and so on and so forth. Now, every man and woman in this country has a right to so whatever they want, but, we also have the right to critique each other. Now, some people are saying I should keep my nose out of this, and others have said (ahem Germ
) that it is a dead horse. To me, there is no dead horse when I think it reflects badly on the hunting community in general. Now, is it legal,yes it is, that does not make it right in my mind. Like so many things in this world, legal does not make it right, nor does it signal ethicallity.