3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Acceptable or not?

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

yes

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

good enough to hunt with. whether itis acceptable or not depends on how well you WANT to shoot.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Yes.

And is probably better than most of the "internet" archers you find here.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I'll be new to bowhunting this fall and have been practicing since April with the bow so my opinion does not come from a lot of experience.
My thought is if that is what you are shooting consistantly from 25 yards from the position you will be shooting, with the clothes you will be wearing then it is acceptable from 25 yards. I can only relate it to hunting with a rifle. I get 2 inch groups consistantly at 100 yards and 3 inches at 150 using the positions and rests I will have in the field. Since a kill zone on a deer is at least 3 inches I consider myself good to 150 yards but not beyond. Mainly because I've never practiced more than 150 yard shots. Again, not alot of experience but it seems to make some sense.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Is that with fixed blade broadheads, or fieldpoints?

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I would say that is average to above average at that range. If you can do that consistantly at 25 or 30 yards I think that is good enough. The vitals on a deer are larger than that. Just make sure your range is right and you pick good shot placement. Learning deer anatomy is huge help. Depending on the angle of the deer you need to pick a different entry spot. I always aim for the exit and try and envision what the arrow will strike on the way thru the animal.

I agree with the above. Shoot some arrows the way you will hunt and see how well you do.
Wear a hat and face net if you are going to when you hunt. And the camos you intend on wearing. If you where gloves, you should practice with them to see if it changes your grip. And if you are shooting from an elevated stand by all means practice from one before you hunt. Even if it is just for a short period of time. This way you will now how the arrow impacts from a stand. Remember to bend at the waste.

Paul

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

field pts.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I think it's good enough. I use the "1 inch per 10 yard rule". 1 inch groups at 10 yards and so forth. I agree with the othe posts about shooting with your hunting set up and picking your entry and exits points according to the angle of the shot.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Try it with the heads you are going to hunt with and see what happens. It might open up a bit more.

Paul

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I know I will catch some slack with this one. I don't think 3" groups at 25yds. are acceptable according to my standards. You should be busting nocks at that distance. In my opinion 3" would be acceptable at 40-50 yards, even then with practice you should be robin hooding arrows. I can't shoot more than 2 arrows at the same target dot with out busting them out to 35 yards. Out past that I can shoot more arrows at the same target dot and not break as many. If I were you I would go buy some of the orange 1" target dots and practice with those. Just stick them to your target and shoot away, you will be surprised how many knocks/fletchings you ruin.

Hyde

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Ya I am sure u bust a nock everytime you shoot out to 35 yards. How many arrows you shooting 10? I break a lot of nocks but come on you dont need to break a nock everytime out to 35 to hunt. To me he sounds like he can kill deer just fine. PLus his shots will be 20 or less!

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Just a note. When you do try with broadheads don't shoot groups! You can check if your shooting accurately w/o grouping them. 3" at 25 yds is acceptable for hunting.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

3" groups is sort of okay for now... Work on shooting more and more with field tips, and the groups will get tighter and tighter.

I'm no world class archer or anything special, but I have busted nocks and ripped fletchings at 20 yards using only 3 arrows with field tips (darn near Robin Hooded one of them!). 30 yards, I can get about 2" groups, maybe smaller if I really concentrate. 40 yards(max)?? I don't know... probably 3" groups.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I didn't think that I'd ever admit this , but this time I agree with Double Creek . [:o]

I'm a newbie ,admittedly , and I shoot instinctive , but a 3" group sounds pretty good to me . That would place the arrow well within the vitals area from a wide number of anglesand heights .Isn't that the ultimate goal here ?I've been taught that accuracy is the best test of a bow hunter , and that all else is secondary . Is that wrong ? I don't think so , I feel we owe it to the quarry .

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Well, as you can plainly see, opinions vary. It depends on the goals you have set for yourself. If you are going to be a competitive archer, no, that is probably not acceptable. If you are trying to kill a deer, I would say yes, and this is why.
You don't have to hit a deer in the heart to kill him cleanly. A double lung shot will do it efficiently. The heart of a deer iswhat, approximately 3"? The kill zone on a deer, the lungs, aka, boiler room, are roughly 7".
As I said, unless you are a target shooter, I don't think groups matter as much. There is only one shot that counts.....the first one. That's all you are going to get at a deer anyway. Groups indicate consistency, or lack thereof. If you can put your first shot in a 3" circle, every time you go out and shoot, you will kill your deer.
There are just too many variables IMO that affect groups. Arrow quality, bow quality, release quality, just to name a few. If you shoot 3" groups, that sounds pretty consistent to me.
Some people are just harder on themselves than others, and demand more of themselves. Nothing wrong with that. Set your personal goals and achieve them. ;)

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I would tend to agree especially if we are talking broadhead tipped arrows here.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

These are the kind of questions that make me want to call out BS to some of the responses. I read a post on a different thread where that person said they were shooting 1" groups at 30 yards. How many arrows are we talking here? 3, 6, 10? If you took 7 standard carbon arrows and held them tightly together in your hand, that would be an inch. Not to mention that if you shot them at a target that close together you must be a rich man because you are certainly going to break a lot of arrows. I shoot at the 1" orange target dots and I can hit them at 30 yards but my groups are around 3" for 6 arrows. Sure, I hit a few arrows while practicing but I haven't seen many people that can consistantly robin hood an arrow at 35 yards.

Now back to the original question:

If you are shooting 3" groups at 25 yards, that is more than acceptable for a hunting setup. Just make sure that you know where your broadheads are hitting.

Try putting several of the 1" dots on your target and shoot 1 arrow at each. I feel this will give you a better indication of your accuracy.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

yes.....but remember your first shot each time you practice is the one that counts! It amazes me each fall when all kinds of people show up at the range and have a 14" group....by the end of the session its about 6" and they say there set. Whats really scary is they show up at the range a week or two later AND THEIR FIRST SHOT IS PART OF A 14" GROUP AGAIN!

Its great your practicing!

Good Luck!

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

All those saying 3 inch groups consistantly at 25 yards with a huntign setupisn't good enough really haven't got a clue.

2 inch groups at 20 yards would give you a 300 60X on a 5 spot round. That my friends is aperfect score. If you could do that consistantlyyou would be a world class spot shooter.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

If you can do it constantly 3 inch groups are more than fine.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

3" groups at 25 yards is plenty fine to go and get a deer. If you can keep your groups that tight consistently then you are all set for that range and under. Some good things have been mentioned already.........like make sure you can do it with broadheads and not just fieldtips. Also your first shot is all you really get so IMO group shooting is nice BUT I prefer real world practice. I will nock an arrow and just imagine I am shooting at a deer for real........one shot, sometimes I shoot quick, sometimes I hold for a LONG time and sometimes I end up somewhere in between. No matter how I shoot I go pull the arrow and see how I would have done if it was a real deer. I'm also not very fond of practicing with fieldtips for hunting. Since I don't plan on shooting a deer with a fieldtip I don't see the point in shooting them for practice for long periods of time. I shoot them for about a month and then I shoot broadheads the rest of the summer and fall. I have a bunch of friends that shoot fieldtips right up to a couple days before the season and then strap on a broadhead and see how they fly.........that is crazy IMO. Practicing with broadheads not only prepares you for the real thing but also gives you the peace of mind in knowing your rig is in fine hunting condition. I also practice a lot from a ladder stand in my backyard instead of shooting from the ground because I hunt from a stand and not the ground.........I try to keep my practice as real as I can.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

A lot of good comments and advice here.
I tend to think it was said nicley by mobowhuntr-
"If you shoot 3" groups, that sounds pretty consistent to me.
Some people are just harder on themselves than others, and demand more of themselves. Nothing wrong with that. Set your personal goals and achieve them. ;) "

I for one try to get the tightest "groups" possible and will tweak until I am happy with the results. There are too many things that can increase the margin of error in a hunting situation not to have my arrows landing whereI want them to while practicing, in the backyard standing in the proper stance with as perfect form asI can achieve.
A lot of things don't mimick the backyard while hunting, the angle of the shot, footing on the tree stand, location of the target (never just right- pesky deer[8D]), limbs or branches to navigate around, SITTING shots. All of the comfort of backyard shooting seems to disappear while hunting (for me anyway). Therefore I will try my best to ensure my equipment is performing as good as it can so the rest is up to me.
3" groups with broadheads consistently sounds very resonable to me. The amount of arrows in the group obviously will increase the size of the group.

BTW, I'm not sure about anyone else, butI sometimes use the word "Group" when describing my shooting when in reality I'm measuring how far the arrow is from the point of aim (center of spot), especially when reffering to broadheads. IfI shoot 3 different heads at 3 different spots and measurefrom the center of the spot to the outside edge of the arrow furthest away from the center, that is what I am calling a group. I guessI might have misspoke? the results are the same IMHO, just cheaper this way..:D

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Hey Atlasman, I have a neighbor who thinks I'm waisting my time tweaking and shooting so much. He pulls his bow out a week before season, shoots it into the target maybe 5 times, screws on his mechanicals and then goes hunting. Last year he wounded abuck and never mentioned it to me, his wife wasn't so tight lipped[&:]. Maybe this year he'll give it 2 weeks???

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I agree with the comment on "internet archers" I always hear about the tight groups but most of them equate to the 300/60x already mentioned. I practice out to 30-35 yards and that's what I limit my hunting shots to. I feel very confident to hit a 3-4 inch group to that MOST of the time but am 99% sure I can hit the kill zone on a deer, which is larger than that, every time.

I would say a 3 inch group is above average for hunting purposes.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Paul Mohr is right. 3 inch groups(legitimate 3 inch groups) are more than adequate if it's with broadheads. If you can tune your set up to get the same accuracy and consistancy from broadheads you're good for just about anything. The problem I find with most people is they say they shoot 3 inch groups but they're basing it on their BETTER groups and not really their average. We should probably base our group size on our largest group in any given day. It would probably more closely be a good representation of what we'll do in a tree from unknown distances under the pressures of a hurried shot at Macho Buck. I guess if we were really going to be honest with our selves we should base it on a group of say 5 arrows shot over a period of 5 days under different lighting conditions(different times of day). We should only record the first arrow we shoot. No warm up, no practice, just walk out of the house, climb the practice platform and let ONE arrow and One arrow only go and record it's impact. What could be more realistic?

DoI do it??? I do a modified practice routine when I really get near my hunting season. I do a lot of walk out of the house and shoot one arrow at the target from some place I haven't shot from before. I have some old round throw targets I just heaveout and shoot em where they land.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

A better gauge in my opinion would be to practice on a small 3-D target from different angles and distances. And see if the shots you make are lethal and in the kill zone. Remember to take into acount for shot angles and what the arrow will actually hit on the way thru. Shooting 3-D for score is not the same thing as hunting live game. A good scoring shot is not always the correct shot for live game. You have to shoot for the exit wound and picture the path of the arrow thru the game.

I don't shoot broad heads very often either. My bow is tuned well enough that my hunting arrows group as well as my target arrows do. I verify that all my hunting arrows shoot well and set them aside. I do not practice with the shafts and tips I hunt with. I don't want to take any chances of messing them up. I test all my arrows and set the best three aside for hunting. The rest I use for practice.

Kevin, I would tend to not agree with this statement:

"I've been taught that accuracy is the best test of a bow hunter , and that all else is secondary . Is that wrong ? I don't think so , I feel we owe it to the quarry ."

I will agree that accuracy is important and should be strived for, but not the most important and the singular thing you should be concerned with. I think knowing the animal is much more important. Studying the anatomy and how the animal moves is just as important as being able to make the shot. If you don't know where to properly place the arrow or when to take the shot, or more importantly when not to take the shot being accurate really isn't much good. Putting the arrow in the spot you aimed for doesn't do you much good if it was the wrong spot or the deer moved during the shot.

Hunting is so much more than flinging arrows in a tight group on a target. I can outshoot most of my hunting buddies, but they are much better hunters than I am because they have more experience at it. And I have a few friends that are excellent shots, both spots and 3-D but have yet to take a deer cleanly. They are great archers but just don't get the big picture and take time to be effective hunters as well. First you have to do your homework and be where the deer are. Then you have to be paitient and wiley enough to let them get close. And after that you have to have know when to draw the bow and take the proper shot. As well as know when to just sit still and let it go if things are not right.

That is my opinion any way.

Paul

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I have heard it all........."You're shooting already??"........."For what??"

These comments are usually from the guys who dust off their bows the weekend before the season and run around like idiots trying to get everything straight in a matter of hours.......Then they usually talk themselves into saying their setup is "all set" when they truthfukky know it's not...........or they just grab some mechanicals. Later on when they are crying about a miss or even worse.........that is when I answer the "For what?" part of their question. Some people just have to learn the hard way........and some never learn no matter what.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I have my backyard set up to try and simulate hunting as much as possible. I let the grass grow long, tree branches hang down etc. I have my target block 10 yards from a group of 4 large trees that are all 20 yards apart from each other. I make 5 shots each round, one shot for each black dot on my target (4 corners & in the center). I make each shot from a differant location, in a differant position, sometimes hidding behind a tree or leaning up against one, etc. I don't have any yardage marks in that area but shots would range from 10 yards to 45 yards. If I can hit each one of those black dots with each of my shots, I'm happy. The dots are about 2" around.

To me that is the way a hunter should practice, try get as many varables into it as you can, then master it!

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

dk why you would try to group broadheads... itll cost you$

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Shooting at a dot or a target is not the same thing as live game or 3-D targets. You don't have any thing to aim at persay and have to use the body structure as a guideline. Practicing this really helps when you get out in the field. You can also try different shots and angles to see how they would really work on game.

Sometimes what you think is a good shot really isn't when you study it. And I found out the hard way a 3-D target is harder to hit than a spot target if you have never tried it before. Especially at longer distances. They are a great learning tool if you can get one to play with. Some have the outline of the bones instead of scoring rings, those are the ones I like.

Paul

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

The X ring on a standard indoor 5-spot target is actually 1.575" in diameter (4 cm). :eek:

Shooting 2" groups would equal a score of 300 but not 60X. To the original question yes true 3" groups at 25 yards is not bad shooting.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

IMO 3" groups consistently at 25-30yds is plenty fine, as long as your broadheads shoot the same. Many folks can shoot 3" groups all day long with fp's, then they throw on the bh's and wala...6"-9" groups. So they immediately throw on the mechanicals and away they go...:(

Make sure your bow is properly tuned, and get those bh's shooting 3" groups and you will probably be better than 50% of the folks out there. Good luck :)

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I always love the guys that say "I'm not a world class archer but I shoot 2" groups out to 40 yards". Well I've got news for you if you can shoot that tight of groups at 40 yards you ARE a WORLD CLASS ARCHER. 3 inch groups at 25 yards is plenty good enough.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

good job now look towards consistancy:D

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

I agree with Paul here. When I shoot outsideall I use is a 3D target. If I could get my local range to let me I would bring it indoors as well but this little range does not allow that.....yet (I'm still working on them) I feel it's better practice than a target. It helps with finding the kill zone quicker because well...it's a deer your shooting at and not a circle. Now I must add that all I do is hunt and therefore have no use for targets other than practice.

To answer your question with a hunting perspective only, 3" groups at 25yds isfine. The key is consistancy, if you can do that consistantly then if I were you I would go into the woods with all the confidence in the world in my ability to make a clean kill at that range and even further.

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

3" at 25 yards is good enough to kill a deer. I've heard a rule of thumb that goes "shoot to the distance that you can keep five arrows in a small pie plate". If you are consistently shooting that size groups at that range, I wouldn't worry about it too much. Some people's groups look better on the internet, than they do in real life.

Also, do you practice in low light conditions? I consistently shoot 1 1/2" to 2", 5 arrow groups at 20 yards in ideal light conditions at a deer 3-D target (field points and mechanicals). When I shoot at dusk, that opens up to 2 1/2" to 3". I'm 46 and wear bi-focals. I don't know if that has anything to do with it. Has anyone else had that experience?

RE: 3" groups @ 25 yds?
 

Sweet