Powerbelt Performance
 

I've read alot of discussions on Aerotip vs. Hollowpoints and just had an experience to share with y'all. Shot a nice spike buck yesterday with my .45 Omega, 195 gr. Aerotip and 2 Pyrodex pellets. Broadside at about 75 yds. Went through both lungs, didn't hit any bone to speak of. I was really pleased with the performance of this bullet. The exit hole was about the size of a quarter, but what a job it did on his lungs. He ran about 60-70 yds bleedin like a stuck pig, just like a good broadhead shot. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with HP's but I sure like those Aerotips.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Powerbelts seem to be one of those projectiles that people like or hate. I have a CVA Staghorn Magnum 209 and it will shoot powerbelts with outstanding accuracy. Unfortunately the deer would not cooperate with me this year to test the powerbelt theory....:D

Most of the post I read, the aero tips get excellent penetration, while the hollow points tend to hit, open and are usually found on the far side of the animal from the wound. Many report extensive damage from the hollow point but many report little or no blood trails.

Congratulations on the deer.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

I don't recall reading a single complaint about Powerbelt hollow-point coppers on two dozen ML message boards in the last 2-1/2 years.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Congrats on the buck and I am jealous- ML season here ended over a month ago in NY. What state are you in? I have used 245 gr. PB s and taken 3 deer at 45 yds, 60 yds and 85 yds and they performed well. I did find out the hard way that on a clean barrel and in very cold temps they shoot low on the first shot with my CVA Magbolt. When I called CVA about the initial low shots, they recommended sighting in and hunting through a fouled barrel to ensure the gas check seals consistently. I plan on upgrading to an Omega before next season to eliminate any looseness.

Sounds like your Aerotip did a fine job. What gets me is I have seen a couple posts where guys are using sabots on the first shot and then reloading a PB to finish off the animal. That seems too confusing to me. When I get my new Omega I will test sabots and both types of PBs at all ranges to find the best all around loader and shooter for me.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

I've been shooting the hollow point powerbelts out of my Knight D.I.S.C. for 3 years and have had nothing but outstanding results with them. I can pound nails with them at 100 yards. This past season I shot a doe in her bed from 25 yards(Good snow conditions). She was bedded down looking directly away from me. The bullet entered just to the right of the spine about 4 inches in front of the base of the tail and when I dressed her out I recovered the bullet near the base of her neck. Here's a picture of the recovered bullet next to a nickle.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

17 Pointer, I hate to admit it, but I live in NJ(the part that still has trees). I normally don't hunt this late in the season, but I had a slow December and wanted one more deer for the freezer so I took my gun for a walk after a snow. I agree with you about changing bullets,too confusing. I got great accuracy with SST's, but the PB's shoot and they load so darned easy. Good luck with your Omega, I think you'll like it. My only problem with it is when I remove a primer from the breechplug, I'm too stupid to turn the gun sideways and I sometimes drop the primer down in the trigger assembly. Gotta work on that.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Triple 7, do a search on my name on powerbelts. You will find complains.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

I have an Omega and I am one of the guys that switch from sabots to Powerbelts. I shot Hornady SST bullets in Harvester sabots (my barrel is so tight the Hornady sabots won't load without extreme pressure on the ram rod). I checked both fouled barrel and clean barrel with both bullets and the 300gr. hornady hits within less than an inch of the 295gr. powerbelt aero tip at 100 yards so I can interchange them. I just shot an elk this year with the first shot the sst and the second running shot with the 295gr. Powerbelt. Both hit about where I planned and the elk went down. The first missed one lung so I had to do the second. Four holes in an Elk is usually enough.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

yeah...what big country said

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

MLKeith
I have only used the 50 gr. 245 HPs and never tested over a 100yds. Have you or anyone compared or tested the group sizes/drop of HPs and aerotips beyond 100 yds? Why do you only use the PB on the second shot?

The 245 HPs have made giant entrance holes for me but don't always exit. I was thinking of switching to aerotips to ensure an exit hole and better blood trails.

The doe I shot this year was quartering away at 60 yds. Even though I took out both lungs the blood trail was pretty sparce for the first 50 yds and finally got heavy near where I found her at 80yds. On entry the PB took out 3 ribs and made large 2-3 inch trianglular entrance hole but never exited. Even the processer mentioned how big the hole was.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Triple 7, do a search on my name on powerbelts. You will find complains.
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What was your complaint? Were they copper-hollows or leaded? How much/what powder did you use?

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

I use my ML only for the times I can draw an elk tag in CO. I shot an elk in 02 and another in 04 using my 50cal and 348gr hollow-point power belts. First elk was broadside at 40-50 yards and the next was head on at 6-7 steps. Both were one shot kills and both exited. Obviously, I am well satisfied with power belts! PBs are just like any other bullet; some like them and some don't. Much like Ford and Chevy. Nothing wrong with either one. Ain't America Great? good hunting.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

[quote]ORIGINAL: 17 Pointer

MLKeith
Why do you only use the PB on the second shot?

I prefer the Hornady bullet over the Powerbelt (some of that is just because I like the Hornady company and have had good luck with centerfire bullets). I shot 348gr. Powerbelts on one elk hunt which worked just fine. I started shooting the 300gr. hornady this year and because it loads so much harder than the Powerbelt I use the 295gr. Powerbelt as a quick follow-up shot bullet as I can load it in a hurry. I needed the quick shot this time as the cow elk was hit pretty hard but I was not sure and when she broke into a full run I had to get another shot off quick before she reached the top of the hill. The Powerbelt did its job. Four holes in the elk made good blood trail. All bullets exited. Both plastic tipped. 90gr. of Black Mag'3 at about 90 to 100 yards. With the Black Mag'3 I don't have to swab between shots so the second shot is pretty fast. Elk are tough and sometimes do not fall down when they are dead.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Triple, my complaint is I could only get accuracy with 85-90gr of pyrodex and had to use 11 caps. I could get 2MOA accuracy. Anything pushed beyond that or with winchester 209's, and accuracy would go to crap. I just don't like a bullet with limitations like that and especially with that cost. I like a sabot with little to no blowby like the barnes expander. Or my trusty ole 240gr XTP and harvester sabot. I buy .430 XTP's by 100 and sabots. Pretty cheap shooting and darn hard to beat thier performance at 1550fps or 2000fps. Usually if I am going to shoot 3 777 pellets, I like to use the XTP mag made for the 454. They were the aerotips I tried. I have a range rod and rugged rod, so hard seating doesn't bother me a bit.

I am sure they work, just alot of cheaper bullets out there that I believe work better, cheaper, and don't have all the limitations on how hard you can push it.

I have some left and thinking about putting a subbase on them and trying again. I at least want 2MOA accuracy with 100gr of 777. I was told to try the real heavy powerbelts. But have a bad taste for em after first experiences.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

It seems to depend on the specific rifle. I can't get accuracy with powerbelts above 95 grains of 777 but my brother with the exact same rifle (Omega in SS) gets great accuracy with 110 grains.

However, 90-95 grains of 777 is equivalent to 105 to 110 grains pyrodex, so that is plenty of powder for what I hunt (elk out to 100 yards)

I have heard that pyordex is a little more forgiving with powerbelts.

I am going to try American Pioneer Powder with cooler 209's (cci's) and see what kind of results I get. I like the clean up of cleaner powders vs pyrodex and I like the ease of using powbelts, so it is worth figuring out the accuracy issues.

Some, like bigcountry, like to push the envelope both in power and distance, but for me anything over 110 grains equivalent kicks the fire out of me and I think my accuracy suffers. Since I am limited to conicals (Colorado) and don't shoot over 100 yards because I only use open sights, powerbelts fit what I need to a "T".

So much for accuracy performance. However, I think the jist of the original question was terminal performance. And I do remember hearing several complaints in that regard. The first one was a guy that killed a cow elk and he was dissatified with them because they did not exit and give him a blood trail. After much searching, he foud the elk 20 yards from when she stood when he shot. He called this a "failure". I asked him at what point of the elk dying within 20 yards of where she stood constitute a failure.

The second was a guy that said he had a broadside "double lung" shot on a bull elk with a powerbelt but never found him. I asked him how he knew that he had gotten a double lung shot on the bull, since he never found him. I contend that if he had actually hit the bull with a broadside shot and double lunged him, the bull could not have gone very far. He didn't have an answer for me. I suspect he hit him too far back.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

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That's not the fault of the Powerbelt copper hollow-point. That's not a performance issue with the bullet itself either. Powerbelts were designed prior to 3-pellet use in muzzleloaders. 120-150 grains was never Powerbelt-intended due to the integrity of the plastic cup/base. Many folks using 110-120 grains with Powerbelts load the cup with Bore Butter to substantially reduce blowby & maintain accuracy.

Also... depends on the rifle bore diameter too! Knight Rifles are overbore.... not a good choice for Powerbelts in those rifles unless you slow the bullet down first. Using 348 & 405 gr Powerbelts in Knights seems to work best.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Here you go RESULTS,95 gr. 777 405 gr aerotip PB 25 yard shot at elk from TC OMEGA PB retained near 100% weight and mushroomed perfectly,PB didn't blow up as some suggest http://tinypic.com/1heag7 http://tinypic.com/1heanb http://tinypic.com/1hebk3

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

txhunter58: If you can find it you might want to try Black Mag'3 powder. I have shot for comparison loads of 100gr. volume of ffg Tripple Seven and 100gr. volume of Black Mag'3 with a 300gr. bullet in Harvester sabot. The Tripple Seven three shot group kicked me so hard I would not shoot four on a bet. The same volume load with Black Mag'3 was a comfortable recoil that I could shoot ten or more comfortably from the bench. The velocity of the "killer load" of 777 was 1643fps. the velocity of the BM3 load was 1920fps. I just shot a fair sized cow elk this year with the first shot 90gr. of BM3 and a Hornady 300gr. SST bullet in a Harvester sabot and a second follow up shot with a 295gr. Aerotip Powerbelt. Both bullets passed completely through the chest cavity. First was angled and hit one lung and clipped the liver. Second shot was at running cow hit at rear of lungs and passed through. Neither hit major bone although they clipped ribs. Holes were about one inch coming out. I also limit my shots to 100 yards and this was at about 90 yards. Synthetic stock Omega .50cal. (light gun kicks fairly hard).

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Nice elk dvdegeorge! I'm curious, how far did the elk go after the shot?

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

This is my first post as I've just started back muzzleloader hunting after a 3 year hiatus due to work obligations. I hunted Mon-Wed of this week here in Mississippi during the week long primative weapon season. I harvested three deer - two does and a 4 point buck using a TC Black Diamond .50cal with .295gr Aerotips and 100gr of Pyrodex. The first doe was taken at 40 yards and dropped in her tracks. The second doe was shot at 100 yards and ran about 50 yards. There was one quarter-sized drop of blood on the ground at the site of bullet-impact and a very light blood trail. The area around where she was found was saturated with blood. The buck was shot at 60 yards and only ran about 20 yards into a thicket. There was no blood trail but a lot of bleeding at the site where I found the deer. Not trying to sway anyone's opinion - just sharing my experience. The Aerotips seem to shoot well from my rifle and appear to pretty effective in stopping whitetails quickly. My only complaint is the lack of blood trails, although I had this same problem with maxi-balls out of my Hawken years ago.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Well that bullet was from the second shot,I hit that elk the evening before and unfortunatly I hit him back too far[:@][:'(][:o]:([:-](shot was about 75 yards opened sights,free hand no rest,and a very HIGH heart rate!) found him still alive the next morning after a 2 1/2 hour search in some thick pines,after the second shot he just stood there and after a few seconds he went about 10 feet and fell! Shot was a double lung and hit solid rib in and out and lodged just under the skin.That elk looked mighty BIG stairing at me at 25 yards[:o]

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Sounds like some folks ain't happy with less'n 100 grains of powder. The U. S. Army got along fine with 60 to 70 grains behind a .50 caliber conical. Now if your rifle don't like the bullet that's all you gotta say.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

As I said, I don't like a bullet with limitations and cost like that. Just a opinion. I have only shot one deer with the 150gr load. But dozens with 95gr combos in the past. Its not that I like to push the envelope. Just like the option of better speeds if I want.

slamfire, please reread my post, I said it shot ok with low powder loads.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

MLKeith: There are no Black Mag 3 dealers in Texas and I don't feel like paying the Hazard materials fee. However, I have an APP dealer near my home, so I will start with that and see.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

txhunter: That would be my next choice. Personally I paid the hazmat fee and bought four pounds not knowing how I was going to like it. Now I wish I had spread the hazmat fee over about ten pounds. APP will work well for you but you might consider using the fffg rather than the ffg as the ffg is pretty large grains and most have better luck with the fffg.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

I have been shooting the PB out of my CVA Firebolt and Traditions Deerhunter for about 3 years now. Usually I shoot the 295 Aerotip PB. In my Deerhunter with a 1:48 twist, they shoot great out to 100 yards. With the CVA 1:28 twist, I have shot 2 does and they did not go far after penatration. But at the range, my groups are not as tight as I would like out of the CVA. I picked up some Buffalo Ballets 270 grain and I hope I will get some better groups from them. The PB's are also more expensive but I will continue to use them as well during this years seasons.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

Powerbelt copper HP and Aero tips shot out of two .50 T/C couldn't hit broad side of barn with any load combo! One T/C was mine and other was buddys gun. We tryed every load down to 95 gr until we gave up. I gave mine away. We finally found a Precsion poly tip that gave his gun 1/2 - 1" groups at 65yrds, free hand BTW.

Having said all that I use a .45 cal PB Aero in my Knight only for 2nd,3rd shots due to its easy slip fit. It shoots great! Go Figure.

PB's are a love hate bullet. Heard it here on occasion and in the field.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

What powder were you using? Loose or pellets? I have heard people have an easier time using straight pyrodex. However, 777 is so much easier to clean, I was determined to find a good load for powerbelts. My brother and I have identical guns: stainless Omegas. With 348 gra aerotips, I can only get accuracy with 90 grains, while my brother's gun does well with 110.

If I were shooting a 295, I would start with 85 grains and work up. For deer sized game, that is more than plenty of power and would be equivalent to about 100 gr of pyrodex.

However, because of the crud ring issue, I am going to try APP and cooler 209's.

RE: Powerbelt Performance
 

I hear this a lot, that T7 is "easier to clean than Pyrodex." I guess I am missing something, as I actually had a harder time cleaning T7 out of my Remington than I ever did cleaning Pyrodex. All I use is hot, soapy water followed by a rinse with boiling water down the bore. Ten, fifteen minutes tops and I'm done.

This is not a putdown of T7. I tried it and I didn't like it that much, but a lot of people seem to really get good results from it. Good for them. But if you still use Pyrodex and PB's, you are still shooting a great bullet, IMHO.

Brian