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Lehigh Spear -- Another Look

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Lehigh Spear -- Another Look

Old 03-20-2018, 10:14 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by bronko22000
Well that's your opinion and I have mine. Just like some like BH209 (and some use much more than needed). So you can go on and continue to use your high priced bullets and powder. In the mean time, I'll continue to use what I feel is effective and accurate for myself.
Not my opinion at all. Test them yourself.
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Old 03-20-2018, 10:18 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by BarnesAddict
Well here we go again......... Agreed, the Expander works.

Grouse45, I'll just tell you though, that your opinion of how a Barnes TEZ or TMZ performs is just... well... kind of incorrect.

As with the highest majority of bullets, they have a minimum velocity to function properly, which according to Barnes, that's approximately 1,100fps with the TEZ or TMZ. So unless a hunter is shooting a squib charge, the bullets should both function extremely well at most shooter's hunting distances (100yds or less) with 100-120grs of about anything.

I've shot semi loads of whitetail with both the TMZ and TEZ bullets and for some reason, never had the same experience as you state.
That includes the use of BP, Pyrodex, T7 and BH209.
I've taken many whitetail at 200 - 250yds+ using BH209 at charges of 110grs volume with both bullets. Never had a long tracking job from a pencil through......

Shot placement is ALWAYS the key factor. If someone likes taking high shots, or gut shots, well count on some tracking. However if you put one through the top of the heart, bottom of the lungs, you're tracking job will be very short, if at all.

The Barnes TEZ would be my bullet of choice for hunting any North American game animal from my rifle. The only reason I'm not shooting them today is I can't get them to group with this rifle at long range.
This is my opinion only. Not enough testing on these
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Old 03-20-2018, 11:00 AM
  #33  
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Barnes,
I only have 7 logged kills with the 290 TMZ. No shoulder shots, all Deer ran with minimal blood until yards before they dropped. I will send some of these to Ron to test. I will bet at 50grns of Bh209 they will not mushroom. And that will be close to 1300fps. Then you will see exactly what im talking about. Ill also send him some MZ Expanders and youll see why its a much better bullet on game.
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Old 03-20-2018, 11:32 AM
  #34  
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How hunters ever hunted in the past is beyond me
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Old 03-20-2018, 11:56 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Grouse45
Barnes,
I only have 7 logged kills with the 290 TMZ. No shoulder shots, all Deer ran with minimal blood until yards before they dropped. I will send some of these to Ron to test. I will bet at 50grns of Bh209 they will not mushroom. And that will be close to 1300fps. Then you will see exactly what im talking about. Ill also send him some MZ Expanders and youll see why its a much better bullet on game.
Ron's already done the testing of those bullets.

At at 50grs volume of BH209 through two friends chronographs, it registers 1,162fps, which is right in line with what Barnes suggests as a minimum requirement velocity. Ron IIRC estimated 1,200fps.

However I know of no hunters who use only 50grs volume of BH209 for hunting. But here's the ballistics facts using the information from the BH209 site and an average hunting charge of 110grs volume with the 290gr TMZ bullet.

NOTE: All muzzle velocities are approximate, given its from the BH209 site and not from a specific barrel.

MZ velocity approximately.... 2,066fps

Velocity at 25yds................. 2004

Velocity at 100yds............... 1741fps ........... 1953fpe

Velocity at 200yds............... 1427fps ........... 1312fpe

Velocity at 300yds............... 1151fps ........... 853fpe

If the above is true, then the bullet is going to function perfectly at the most average BH209 charge for hunting, well within most shooters maximum hunting range. CLOSE TO 300YDS.

Drop it down to just 80grs volume at 1,634 fps, it doesn't drop in velocity (1,100fps according to Barnes minimum) until 200yds, where the program shows approximately 1160fps. Still WELL within most hunters 100yd or less ranges.

Well within 99% of all muzzleloader hunters maximum hunting range.
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Old 03-20-2018, 12:00 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by MountainDevil54
How hunters ever hunted in the past is beyond me
Well when I started out I used a rock. However my dad always made me throw left-handed. If I threw right-handed, I tore them up to much.
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Old 03-20-2018, 12:03 PM
  #37  
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Grouse45

Tom, no real need to send any of those Barnes bullets. An expander was looked at just recently. Barnes 250g MZ using 50 grain Blackhorn, and also the Barnes 250g MZ using 80 grain Blackhorn powder.

A couple years ago the Barnes 290g TEZ was shot using 80 grain Blackkhorn powder, as was the 250g TEZ.

The 250g TEZ -- 50 grain Blackhorn was looked at a little less than three years ago.



























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Old 03-20-2018, 12:12 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by MountainDevil54
How hunters ever hunted in the past is beyond me

Perhaps they were smarter than present day hunters? Lewis instructed the Corps of Discovery, to quit shooting Grizzlies, once they found they couldn't readily kill them.



















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Old 03-20-2018, 12:37 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by BarnesAddict
Ron's already done the testing of those bullets.

At at 50grs volume of BH209 through two friends chronographs, it registers 1,162fps, which is right in line with what Barnes suggests as a minimum requirement velocity. Ron IIRC estimated 1,200fps.

However I know of no hunters who use only 50grs volume of BH209 for hunting. But here's the ballistics facts using the information from the BH209 site and an average hunting charge of 110grs volume with the 290gr TMZ bullet.

NOTE: All muzzle velocities are approximate, given its from the BH209 site and not from a specific barrel.

MZ velocity approximately.... 2,066fps

Velocity at 25yds................. 2004

Velocity at 100yds............... 1741fps ........... 1953fpe

Velocity at 200yds............... 1427fps ........... 1312fpe

Velocity at 300yds............... 1151fps ........... 853fpe

If the above is true, then the bullet is going to function perfectly at the most average BH209 charge for hunting, well within most shooters maximum hunting range. CLOSE TO 300YDS.

Drop it down to just 80grs volume at 1,634 fps, it doesn't drop in velocity (1,100fps according to Barnes minimum) until 200yds, where the program shows approximately 1160fps. Still WELL within most hunters 100yd or less ranges.

Well within 99% of all muzzleloader hunters maximum hunting range.
Those numbers dont look right either. But according to those the bullet is limited if it works. Just like you saw in rons test, it didnt work at all at 1200fps. But it still would kill whatever it goes thru. Just not what im looking for in any bullet. No limitations at all with the MZ Expander. Just a much better ML bullet obviously!!
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Old 03-20-2018, 12:38 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by ronlaughlin
Grouse45

Tom, no real need to send any of those Barnes bullets. An expander was looked at just recently. Barnes 250g MZ using 50 grain Blackhorn, and also the Barnes 250g MZ using 80 grain Blackhorn powder.

A couple years ago the Barnes 290g TEZ was shot using 80 grain Blackkhorn powder, as was the 250g TEZ.

The 250g TEZ -- 50 grain Blackhorn was looked at a little less than three years ago.



























_
Thanks Ron, Thats exactly what i expected.
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