Second XP Arrives
 

Yesterday afternoon the FedEx truck stoped and delivered me a second package of bullets from Lehigh that I had requested. The second new XP ML bullets that Lehigh is going to produce. Actually FedEx got there early enough I could make a run to the farm and get a little bit of shooting in.

I have no idea why, maybe it is just because of bulk, but the .452x250 gr. XP looks to me like it would be more deadly than the 40x200 XP. Trying to imagine how the nose of the XP works, I am thinking because of the size of the flutes/cavities in the 452 - they will collect more fluid a direct a larger intensity swirling stream of liquid up and out of the nose cutting and rupturing adjacent organs. Anyway it seems that would be case. I have not shot this bullet through a chrono yet but from past experiences with a 250 grain bullet I think I was shooting it right at 1950 fps at the muzzle. That velocity should create a really decent energy force to force the fluid into and out of the flutes on the nose of the bullet. I am hoping to shoot some form of medium later in the week if the weather permits.

This is what the bullet looks like - From the Lehigh Defense web site.



This is the bullet statistics as listed on the site
Caliber: 0.452
Bullet Weight (gr): 250
Length (in): 0.910
BC (G1):
Minimum Twist Rate: 1:30
Velocity (fps): 750-4000
Box Qty: 25

I guess I felt confident enough in the rifle and the bullet + plus I was short on time, I set the target at 150 yards+/- a few. I wanted to find out right away how the bullet flew. The WIND - it always blows down through or across the draw I shoot in at the farm - today at the gravel where I shoot it did not seem that bad, but when I got higher on the slope it seemed at one moment to be blowing directly back at the bench - but then would switch to quartering right to left. There is no changing the wind... so the shoot went on.

I know I am not probably shooting the MOST accurate load from the rifle, but I am shooting the load and achieving the velocity that I want for hunting. If in doing this the bullet is hunting accurate I am good with the accuracy. In most cases I am sure if I were to reduce the load the bullet would be more accurate.

As it turned out and for the first time shooting it - it passed my test just fine. Like it's counter part the 40x200 it really is accurate for me and my shooting abilities and equipment. In fact I wonder if the shape of the nose actually might help the bullet cut through the air - both have turned out to be very accurate for me.

Here is what my quick setup looked like... Shooting birds is so fun I just gotta set some birds up... so I guess basically I shoot for fun!



This is the target for my rush shooting trip to the farm...



I shot the three birds straight away - did not have a problem at all with them - then I started the paper target. I really wanted and hoped that I would get a decent group + I have some confidence after shooting the birds. You can see I was feeling really good after the first two shots... then I start thinking now do not screw this target up on the 3rd shot... Shot #3 - I would really like to blame on the bullet - the sabot or something other than me. After that I decided 'what the heck' you already screwed the target up might as well take another shot. #4 was at least back in the right area but I was still steaming from shot #3.

Hopefully, late in the week I will get back to the farm and shoot some form of medium to verify the action of the bullet through something like the chest cavity. I really want to know if the flutes/cavities do what they are suppose to do.

Sabot by the way those cut outs look on the bullet they may not expand very much if at all but the design should cause havoc by a hydraulic push of the body fluids. Probably much like the way a hollow point does after expansion of the petals. So with adequate velocity you would get deep penetration and a good wound channel. Seems to be a good elk, bear bullet but IMO a bit too much for deer except at longer ranges.

50cal Knight Ultralite

250grn XP, 120grns of BH209, Harvester short black sabot.

Muzzle Velocity

1-2038
2-2017
3-2012

AVG- 2022fps

That is exactly what I would have guessed with BH...

Have you shot it through 2 chromos yet?

Ya, I shot right thru one. lol

I ordered another one should be here Friday.

I have 3 more gongs set up for 3,4,and 500 yards . Now if only the 230 gr bullets would come out . I even put a monarch 4x16 mildot scope with burris ring inserts of +10 in the front and -10 in the back on the 1:20 Disc . :s4: i took a lot of flack for a mildot on a muzzleloader :s4:so it better be worth it .

Are you sighted in for that 150+/- or do you use a BDC or hold over method. I would think being able to hit a orange trap bird at that distance, and animal would never stand a chance.

Looking at that bullet I wish someone would do ballistic gel out of a muzzleloader at say 100 yards and see what it does. I just have a feeling that that twisting Phillips head design is going to do a lot of damage.

Nice job SL. That is one wicked looking bullet for sure!

The design is definitely interesting, and I am also curious to see how they perform in the real world. But I also wonder, which design will prove to be more effective on a marginal shot.... bloodline or xp? I guess time and field reports will tell.

What kind of medium you gonna try and use Mike?

Its not even close. The Bloodline(controlled fracturing) will outperform the XP in all aspects. Even Dave at Lehigh Defense will tell you that.

Ouch! that's gotta hurt

You are totally correct the bullet does not expand. Their is a chance it might deform a little bit, but that would be it.

The bullet is designed to do as you suggest + have great penetration.

The effective range is totally dependent on velocity. To get the true hydraulic action the bullet need to be traveling at least 600 fps but even then if it were traveling slower you still will get very deep penetration.

I would not hesitate using it on deer. I am old the last thing I want is the animal to travel after being shot.

Have patience - it is in the plans. These are the bullets Lehigh plans on building...

XP
.400 185gr
.400 200gr
.452 250gr
.452 275gr


CF
.400 185gr
.400 230gr
.452 250gr
.452 275gr

Dave, I use the PBR system sighting in. Most often for the rifles and bullets that I shoot that means @ 100 yards the will be approximately 3" high. I most often run a ballistic sheet after I have collected the velocity of for that bullet and that powder load.

This is an example of the ballistic sheets that I run...



You can see with this load and this bullet it should hit at 2.9" high at a 100 yards. I sight it in that way then check the sheet by shooting the 154 yard target to verify '0' range. If the bullet is near zero at the range then the sheet is very close. Also most of my scopes have a ballistic reticule in them so at 200 yards I shoot using the reticule to verify impact at 200 yards. 200+ is my self imposed max range that I will attempt a harvest shot.

Also on the chart there are other marker ranges you can shoot to verify. The other day shooting the clay birds at 150 - I held the Xhairs on the bottom of the bird - knowing the rifle was sighted in with 120 grains of T7 with a 300 grain Bloodline. It was a educated guess on where to hold... It worked out very well for me. Even though the rifle was sighted in for a different bullet and sabot.

Carlos has shot gel but I do not know at what range... I do not have access to the jell but I am going to build a medium contained in a plastic jug - the jug serving as a organ wall and pop it with one of the bullets just to see what it does do as it passes through.

And from what I have read you are correct the 'X' nose does make a twisting cut through the medium one of the people that shot jell said he could feel the cut on the inside of the jell.

Hopefully by next week I will have some pictures to share.

OK once again I am old... I know the how the CF bullet works and I have seen the results of that bullet. I personally find it hard to believe and bullet can beat them. But I also remember saying that the Lehigh could not be as good as a Nosler Partition... but I was wrong there. So at this point ya - I am going to try one on a deer this year - I just need to check. That is IF the medium test works well enough.

I do not have access to true ballistic jell. In the past I have used water saturated Palouse clay in a card board box just to see the dynamic effect. I never really felt shooting through a water jug was really like shooting through hide-bone & organs - although it is impressive.

I think I am going to make a concouktion (sp) (trying to simulate the density of blood and organs) in the garage and contain it in a plastic gallon milk jug to simulate an organ membrane (a really tough one). I am thinking I will shoot the bullet through two 2x6" planks then a space into the jug lengthwise and out through two more 2x6's.

I would like to see this very effect... look at these tubes of coagulated blood that came from a recent deer harvest.

I was under the impression the muzzleloader bullets would be made of brass and the pistol made of copper. The link to Lehigh indicates this is a copper bullet. What material does the supplied bullet appear to be made of? Maybe I just misunderstood.

You are correct - the ML bullets are brass while the pistol bullets are copper...

http://www.lehighdefense.com/collect...s/muzzleloader

If you click on the 250gr bullet in the link you provided it says all copper bullet. Just goes to show you cannot always believe what you read.

I had never really thought about this until a member on another forum posted this thought:

I posted back:

Never thought of it that way but I think you 'nailed it'

Not being the best gun nut in the world - I wonder what the RPM of that bullet might be at 100 yards?


He answered back

At 50,000 + RPM's (at the muzzle) I can not even imagine the fluids the bullet could be spinning off and directing up and out of the flutes.

Yeah, looks like a typo there!

Kinda what I was thinking Grouse. The XP seems to me to be a potentially awesome large/dangerous game bullet, but likely no real advantage over the Bloodline on deer sized game or thin skinned animals.

How do these two bullets compare in price? (bloodline vs XP)
I'm in the dark here as I haven't bought any "up to date" bullets in along time due to just using pure lead conicals in my whites. I'm interested now for my CVA Optima V2 handgun, 1:28 twist.

The XP can be built for less money so it is less money. I thought Lehigh was saying around 90 cents for the XP and some where in the area of $1.35 for the CF.... I THINK

Shipping is a straight $5 for any order amount....

The XP bullets are a lot cheaper when you factor shipping.