Rifle Primer--Zero Degrees
 

Yesterday, into a squeaky clean barrel, the Omega X7 was loaded with 300g Deep Curl, 110g Blackhorn, and crush rib sabot. Then the rifle was carried out to the truck, along with some Federal 215 primers, bullets, sabots, and pre loaded powder vials. It went down to zero here last night. This morning the truck was started, left running to melt frost, and the rifle was wrapped in coats, and put in the back so it would stay cold. The bullets, sabots, powder, and primers were also wrapped to keep them cold. When we arrived where the shooting could commence, it was 3 degrees, and the wind was penetrating.

After walking out to place the target, i sorta lost interest in setting up the portable shooting bench, and stool, what with the cold wind the way it was. Managed to get the truck setting quite level with the drivers door 88 yard from the target. Using a window rest i was able to shoot quite steady with my left hand holding the forearm, rested, and my right elbow on the steering wheel. The window was left open because of the spotting scope, but the heater was running full. Then when shooting, the truck was turned off. Actually the only shot that really mattered was the first, however the plan was to shoot 5, but the target blew off the backer after just 3, so i quit, and came home.









It seems i no longer need to wonder if the rifle primers will ignite the powder during the cold weather of deer season. Ignition was instantaneous, just like it was last summer.

As long as you don't take a firearm back and forth into greatly differing temperatures where you'll cause condensation to possibly foul your components, that group and what you stated doesn't surprise me.

very nice shooting.

You're a tougher man than I Ron. I love to shoot, but would have passed in those conditions.

Good test though, and good shooting.

The results didn't surprise me neither, however i was ready to switch to shotgun primers if need be; there is a breech plug all fixed up and ready to use W209 primers.

But, but.. i couldn't pass up the conditions; what i learned, allows me to be completely comfortable using the rifle primers in December, and January, whilst hunting.

Yep, confidence in all of your equipment is a real plus when you are out in harsh conditions!

Ron,
I don't doubt at all what your doing wont work but your testing method isn't really going to prove if it does or doesn't. I'll give you a suggestion on how I do it, and im sure there are other and better ways.

1-Load up 25 vials of powder
2-Put 25 primers in a vial or leave them loose your choice.
3-Get 25 of your choice bullet and sabots
4-Get a Ziploc bag and put all the above in the Ziploc bag.
5-The next time you go to were you shoot put that bag with those items in it on a blown down tree or even set beside tree.
6-When you are going to test again if you want to, load the gun the night before and leave the gun outside over night. In the morning put the gun in a soft case in back of your pick up and leave mostly un zipped. Drive to your shooting location and grab that Ziploc bag and shoot a three shot group. Close that bag back up and set it by that tree or wherever you leave it in the woods.
7-Repeat that process until your Ziploc is empty. It could take a couple weeks obviously.

Well, he did shoot from the truck with the heater going. :wink:

Ron, do you have a drawing or photo of how you're using the 215's? Just wondering how much flash hole depth you have and size? Of course the OAL of the plug?

True. Yes i agree. What little i did this morning doesn't really prove much.. The rifle primers did work perfectly all/only three times.

Yes i did.. seems strange Semi didn't appreciate that fact, but then we all know him..

The breech plug i am using is the OEM Omega/Encore plug. The flash hole depth is as it was when TC made it. The flash hole was enlarged to 0.034", at which size it will remain for at least 700 shots.

The OAL of the plug hasn't changed from what TC made it.

The diameter of the primer pocket was increased to allow the pictured adapters from PR Bullet to fit.







The depth of the primer pocket was increased to allow the use of a 1.5mm thick metric o-ring to be installed before the adapter, and still allow the action of the Omega to close. The depth of the primer pocket was increased about 0.75 mm, if i recall correctly; perhaps a little more.

Is the hole in the adaptor, the same size as the flame channel in the plug?

....or November - since it was 0 today - LOL :D

(I can't believe you guys are that cold already...no thanks!)

Came on kind of sudden. It was 65 degrees and sunny last week. Today it's 5 degrees, and has been snowing straight since 9am. It's hard to adjust that fast.

I still took my dog for hike in the mountains today, but I was an icicle when I got back to the Jeep.

Heater?? Ya mean y`all actually have HEATERS in your trucks??? I wonder if that's what that funny looking button is on the control next to my AC.

I'm sure you wear out that AC button in the summer. Summer here is the best time. 70 degrees, and no humidity.

The adapter hole is about 0.082". The flame channel is OEM--0.125"

The new diameter of the primer pocket which allows the adapters is 0.282".

As mentioned before the new diameter of the flash hole is 0.034".

The depth of the primer pocket is kinda tricky, but not really. It has to be deep enough to allow the action of the Omega to close on the adapter plus the o-ring which is 1.5mm thick, but not so deep the primer doesn't fire when struck by the firing pin. What i guessed at the second time is about half the thickness of the o-ring. The first plug i drilled, i drilled too deep, and so didn't get reliable primer ignition when struck by the firing pin.

The 0-ring needs to be hard enough when compressed to hold the primer so it ignites when struck by the firing pin, but loose enough to allow the action to close with reasonable pressure. That seems to be about half the thickness of the o-ring--0.75mm.

The depth of the primer pocket on the plug purchased from PR Bullet is exactly the same as the OEM TC plug. Neither utilizes an o-ring.

Don't know if I'm going to word these next questions right, please read between the lines...........

So the plug is drilled to accept the adaptor. The adaptor has a larger flash hole itself, then the charge goes through the breech plug .034" flash hole?

Here's the question...... So is the system akin to having two (2) flash holes? One in the adaptor and another smaller in the breech plug? If so, what length of flash channel is under the adaptor before it reaches the flash hole in the plug?

The length of the flame channel in the plug is the same as the OEM plug. In the plug that utilizes the o-ring the one end of the flame channel is rubber i.e. the perimeter of the flame channel for about 0.75mm is the compressed o-ring. The flash hole at the end of the breech plug can't be much larger than 0.034" because that would allow granules of powder into the flame channel.

The hole in the end of the adapter is similar to the hole in the end of the shotgun primers. If one wants to say there is two flash holes when using rifle primers, then one could say there is two flash holes when using shotgun primers. The flash hole in W209 primers is about 0.092". The flash hole in the end of 209A primers is about 0.102" The flash hole in the PR Bullet primer adapters is about 0.082".

I just received and shot my PR Variflame II breech plug today. Super clean after shooting and instant ignition with loose fitting sabotless bullets in my .45 Match Grade Machine Encore barrel. I used Win Large Rifle Mag primers in the carriers.

This is a close up of the primer pocket. Just a slight dusting of residue at beginning of flash channel after 10 shots. Zero blowback!!

There is no way a loose fitting sabotlless bullet will ignite with BH209.

You MUST be fibbing. :p

Oops wait a minute...it did ignite for me too in my Pacnor45 after i used a arbor press to compress the powder and bullet. J/K i didnt need an arbor press:D

No fibbing :)

With the short flash channel and deep dish in the Omega plug I had no doubt it would fire.

I snapped one Win Large Rifle Mag primer for testing on the clean barrel and it makes a lot of spark come out the 28" barrel.

Myself, i will be very interested in reading how the flash hole endures when shooting powders other than Blackhorn. The flash hole in my breech plug has not grown even 0.001" in over 700 shots of Blackhorn. Yes, i am very very curious to read how the flash hole of your plug will wear, shooting other powders.

Ron,

I will let you know how many shots it takes to open to .035 as I have a bit that size that I use to check vent liners with.

Thanks for reminding me about the other powders. I need to clean the bore since I shot some BH209 loads thru it to start.