First Muzzleloader
 

I bought my first muzzleloader today :) and I cannot wait to get out and shoot it. I bought the CVA Wolf and will be using it for whitetail hunting. I am not sure yet what I am going to use for powder/bullets/overall load so any tips are welcome. Any suggestions you guys have for a newbie would be greatly appreciated.

The most widely available powder is Pyrodex and you will most likely use RS for rifles this powder is very corrosive so be sure to clean after shooting. The most commonly available bullets that are easy to get reasonable accuracy with are Shock Waves the 250 or 300 grain are good to start with. Dish soap and very hot water to clean with. I use Win 209 because they are the longest and so seal better against blowback.
I would recommend starting with 100 grains and if it does not group well the start going 10 grain increments in both directions.
Be sure you have a jag and patches to clean with and it is best to have a bushing that seats on the muzzle to protect your barrel.
Check your laws for hunting with a muzzleloader before you buy some states have weird laws like not using a scope or not using a sabot if you run in to this try the FPB 350 or 300 grain as they do not need a sabot.
Good shooting and if you have problem some one here will probably be able to help.

i would use 777 and barnes sabots you can't go wrong you will have to work on your loads before you hunt so shoot as much as you can afford. good luck !

A lot of the powder and projectile will depend on what's in your area. If your a big city person with lots of stores, the sky is the limit. If you live where I do, you're kind of limited to whats on the shelf.

If you find some XTP's or shockwaves that's a good start with about 90 grains of 2f powder, like a Pyrodex RS.

Good luck and have fun. Remember, safety first!

I also new to inline shooting and have a new Wolf. I also have a Optima which I started learning with, it is very similar to the Wolf. I found that it was much easier to buy some pellets instead of measuring powder. I have used Pyrodex RS in other guns, I do not like to mess with the measuring, etc with an inline. I use Triple Seven pellets, one to target shoot with, two to hunt. Have a way of swabing the bore after each shot with a very slightly damp patch. If you do not, the next sabot may not get past a crud ring that builds up. Swab with the slightly damp patch, then with a dry one to make sure the bore is not damp. Mark your ramrod on the first loading while the end is on the fully seated bullet so you will know when a sabot is not fully seated. You do not have to pound the sabot and crush the pellets, just make sure that there is no space between them--that can lead to a very bad outcome. Primers leave a buildup in the breech plug fire channel. You will need a 3MM or very slightly smaller drill bit to clean it out every third shot or so. You do this by hand, of course. Wrap some tape around the shank end so you can grip it better.
I use the cheapest saboted bullets that I can find to target shoot with and Hornady SST's in 250 grains to hunt with. You can find T/C Sure Fires at Wally World for around $7 for 20, that is about as cheap as I can find. Besides being cheap, they shoot very well too. I would not hesitate using them on a deer.
As said above, have fun and be safe.

My new wolf likes 2 whit hots pellets and 350gr horandy FPB

Wolf
 

Here is how i set mine up. Nikon 2 x 7 x 32 scope. Loads, 100 grns of 777, 250 grn hornady sst. 3 shot, 1" group at 100 yds. Dead doe 1st day MD bp season.

for the new kid that doesn't like the mess of powder just keep in mind loose powder sometimes shoots better groups and it's easy as loading a bunch of pre measured loads in some tubes with caps just for your info.

Thank you guys for all the information. Is there some type of guide out there with suggested bullet/powder combinations to start with? I am not even sure where to begin as far as bullet weight/powder charge. I think I am going to start with the powder pellets and go from there. Hoping to get out this weekend and see what is available in my area for bullets/powder/primer. The shop I bought my rifle at was all out of powder and primers so I didn't buy anything. They did have bullets, but they only had two types: hornandy xtp's and I believe powerbelts. Thanks again!

Stick with the Hornady XTPs, it's hard to beat them...

Get a powder measure, start with 80grs, move to 85, then 90...
Swab between shots, shoot a 3-4 shot group with each charge
and you will see what that gun likes...

The .429 Hornady 240gr XTP is fine as it is packaged, if you stay in
the sport you can buy bullets and sabots in bulk but for a beginner
the packaged bullet is fine..

Good advice nchawkeye. I totally agree, and suggest Pyrodex RS for the Powder charge. It's a very forgiving powder and provides all of the energy needed for as far as you can place a shot.

What are the advantages/disadvantages to using loose powder or powder pellets? Also, are there differences in primers or are all 209 primers the same? Final question...the XTP are hollow points correct?

Yes, the XTPs are hollow points...

I prefer loose powder because you are handloading each shot with a muzzleloader so you can tailor the powder charge to each rifle...I sight in muzzleloader for friends and family and years ago I bought some 240 and 300 XTPs in .429 caliber...I also bought a few packs of Harvester plain green sabots...Using just these I have sighted in several muzzleloaders using Goex FFF, Pyrodex RS and 777 powders, whichever the owner preferred...I'm have been able to get sub inch and a half groups with any of their inlines by simply varying the powder charge...It really is a simple process that some over think...

I hear about shooters using pellets and PowerBelts simply because it is easier and they think they can get a second shot off faster...I think those types need to rethink muzzleloading, make that first shot count, it's all you need...

When hunting, I carry a zip lock bag with a supply of cleaning patches, a small container of rubbing alcohol, a small bottle or Rem oil and my cleaning jag...When I kill a deer, I get out 6 patches...With the first three I dampen them with the alcohol and run down the barrel, both sides...I then run one patch down, both sides to dry then run one oiled patch down, followed by a dry patch, then reload...It takes about 2 minutes to do all this and reload...The dirty patches get stuffed back in the ziplock and I'm ready to continue hunting...Here in NC we can kill multiple deer in a day and I've done so plenty of times...

For a quick reload, I can get by with one alcohol patch and a dry patch but I've learned through the years I typically have plenty of time between sightings...

One the primers, I believe there are primers made for 777 as it can tend to have a crud ring...I don't like the stuff so I don't use it...I use FFF Goex as I keep that around for my flinters...Most of my buddy's use Pyrodex...I prefer CCI primers just because I can find them locally...

I also am a loose powder guy and do not see the advantage in pellets. I carry some old 35mm film cans with a charge for my rifle . A small copper tube with 4 bullets in sabots and caped on one end with the plastic caps that come on copper. I also carry pre packed rubbing alcohol pads you can by in the hundreds at Wal Mart to swab with.


:D Al

Winchester makes the primer that is supposed to cut down on the crud ring, it is called "Winchester Triple Seven" primers. I use them with Triple Seven and swab between each shot and have not had any trouble. I do know that a crud ring is still a danger even with these primers. Always swab between shots and mark the ramrod so you will know when the load is not fully seated.

Muzzleloaders have many options as to powder and bullet. Some perfer to tweak their loads to find the combination that is most accurate in their particular gun. Loose powder allows them to do this, pellets do not. Some powders are more corrosive then other powders, some claim easier cleanup. I like to shoot loose powder(Pyrodex RS) in a gun only used for targets. It is very corrosive and will be cleaned soon after shooting. I prefer 777 pellets in a hunting gun, it is not as corrosive and cleans easily. Two pellets(120 grains of 777) and the Hornady SST bullet shoot very well in my gun so that is what I use. It has enough energy to kill a deer out to 200 yards, maybe farther. I will not be shooting any farther then that and I will not load any more powder then that.

Going out today to see what I can find! Wish me luck. Thank you guys for all the help and information...I greatly appreciate it.

The new Federal bullets are suppose to scrape out the crud ring when loading them. Good deal for T7 users if it does that.

I have not been greatly bothered so far by the crud ring. I have not shot very much but when I do I swipe the bore with a damp patch several times then a dry patch several times. I only once detected the crud ring but was able to power thru it and seat the bullet. This was after swiping the bore--don't know why it was there that time and not at other times. After that shot I swiped the bore as usual and loaded the next shot without detecting a crud ring at all. Strange.

Good luck to drp. Be safe.

Most people on here will tell you that loose powder is more accurate then the pellets, and it probably is. That said I shoot the pellets because the slight loss in accuracy is not that noticeable. I probably can't hold the gun still enough to negate the difference. I had some problems with my ML this season and it turned out to be the scope. Now I have a new scope and shot a very good group at 100 and 150 yards this weekend. There was a wind of 15 mph and I was still about an inch group at 100. I shot 2 shots at 150 and both shots drifted left quite a bit due to the wind, they were less then 1 inch apart. I shot these with a dirty barrel just to see.
Last year when I was having troubles I switched to 777 pellets and the crud ring was awful. I tried 100 and 150 grains and could not load a second shot without running a wet patch through first. For that reason I switched back to Pyrodex pellets.

If I were competition shooting I would go with loose powder, but again I can get very good groups with the pellets so any minimal difference in accuracy is not worth the extra time in the field to load.
My vote would be 100 grains Pyrodex pellets to start and here is the bulllets I use.
http://www.cabelas.com/product/Barne....mc_id=crrdtfd

If you use speedloaders when hunting. Loose powder will load just as fast as pellets.

X2 on what Muley said.

Found a shop that sold bullets and powder this afternoon. They had 777 pellets and white hot pellets so i went with the white hots. Couldnt find anyplace close that sold loose powder so i will start with the pellets and see how she shoots. I also picked up some 240 gr xtp sabot bullets. The shop only had TC XTPs but the guy at the shop said they are hornandy bullets sold by TC.

For what you paid for the pellets you could have bought loose powder online for the same price. You also could have bought any bullet instead of what a local shop stocks.

I buy all my supplies online.

That combination should work fine. Two pellets and then an XTP. Keep us posted.

If it doesn't work what is his option with just 50gr pellets? He doesn't have one, except to buy more supplies.

"Couldnt find anyplace close that sold loose powder so i will start with the pellets and see how she shoots."

his options are limited. So he purchased what he could. Those are his options. For goodness sake, let him at least shoot the thing!! Worse comes to worse, shoot one pellet. As long as he gets to shoot.

We all know, he will end up purchasing more supplies anyway. We all do. At that time he can get some loose powder if the White Hots don't work out for him. Heck I have a room FULL of supplies I purchased. Some I use, some I don't. Its the nature of the beast.

Have fun shooting your gun. Let us know how it does. I heard White Hots are Triple Seven basically. So you might want to be sure and swab between shots. I never shot White Hots. Never actually seen them in the stores up here.

I like to give him an option that has better odds of working. he could have bought online from Carlos, and saved money to boot.

With that said. The combo he bought will probably work ok.

We have discuss the advantages and disadvantages of powder and pellets several times do not hesitate to use the search engine to look those threads up.
As for the difference in speed by going with pellets its not there. We had a contest in our club the people who won were using TC reloading plastic and loose powder. With these you have the powder bullet and primer in one package. To load you pour the powder down the barrel turn it over push the sabot & bullet out of the tube with short starter or ramrod and run it down with the ramrod put the primer on and shoot.
In the contest we had the target was placed at 28 yds. which was the average shot here it had a 4 inch black and you had to hit the black for the shot to count. The people using TC loaders won by more than one shot out of 5 shots.
So the only way pellets can keep up is by using the loaders that were designed for loose powder, and I am not even sure that would work as I have never seen it done.
The other good reason is pellets cost more per shot than the best most expensive loose powder on the market.
My recommendation is a U-view TC powder measure and either Blackhorn or Pyrodex powder with XTP or Shock Wave bullets and 209 primers that are for reloading Later after you know the sport you may want to look into using rifle primers. But that's for later it is better to learn using the standard set up.

Thanks for all the info...seriously. I was not trying to stir the pot. I just wanted to get your opinions on where to start. I think once I get shooting I will have a better idea of my preferences. For now though I just cant wait to get out to shoot and sight this baby in. Thanks again guys. I am sure I will have alot more questions!

If you go the loose powder route please understand that when members suggest something like 90 or 100 grains of 2f, they are talking about 90 TO 100 GRAINS BY VOLUME - NOT BY WEIGHT. If you're new to muzzleloading and you don't understand the difference READ YOUR MANUAL UNTIL YOU HAVE A COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF VOLUME VS. WEIGHT.

Loading a blackpowder substitute by weight will greatly increase the charge and can cause damage to you and your rifle.

Congrats on the new rifle! I use 100gr. of Pyrodex RS and a Powerbelt Copper 245 gr. Aerotip. They shoot consistent and are dependable. Have shot multiple times in a fairly great group. Be religious about cleaning the bore and all elements of the rifle. I clean mine after every shot.
Do note this, a lot of people use the 50gr pellets, while they may work for some, a lot of other frown upon them because in my opinion, they are garbage. Once you put them in the barrel, and ram the bullet down the barrel, if you crack the pellet, your gun with shoot off, in most cases, extremely off. The powder Pyrodex RS is great because the harder you press, the more packed the bullet and powder are, better the shot. If you press too hard then that it perfect.
One more thing to say... Enjoy your new rifle and I hope you get the big boy out there to go with the gun!

Got out Saturday to shoot and had a blast. The gun shot really well. All the tips were greatly appreciated. Not sure if i needed to but I ran a wet and then a dry patch after each shot and no problems. Got it on paper quickly and then about a 2" group at 50 yards. Sighted in at 50 since where I hunt allows for only a 50-60 yard shot. One question for you guys on cleaning though. I used hoppes#9 blackpowder solvent on the barrel which seemed to work ok but then i used the T/C breach plug parts soaker on the breech plug and it didnt seem to work at all. What do you guys use to clean the breach plug?

I use rubbing alcohol and a tooth brush, then spray with WD-40 and put into a plastic bag until ready to lube, install and hunt...

What part of the breach plug do you lube? I ended up cleaning mine with the hoppes solvent and a tooth brush/qtips then put the anti seize on the threads and re-installed. Should i have left it out of the gun?

No, either way is fine...I'm talking about putting grease on the threads...I just usually keep mine in a plastic bag until the next time I'm going to shoot it...

Shoot only Blackpowder stay around 90 to a 100 grains with a 250 grain quality sabot and bullet and you will be fine