Heavy Lead in the .45 GM/TC Renegade (Range Session #1)
 

Man, it's been a long hot Summer and I haven't shot in a quite a while.

Got a chance to sneak in a short range session Saturday afternoon. And even though it was eighty-one degrees with humidity high enough that sweat didn't evaporate I couldn't hold off any longer.

The objective of the session was to try some lead conicals kindly supplied by edmehlig. Ed sent me two bullet weights, 350 grain hollow points and 465 grain flat points, all pure soft lead and sized to .451.

He sure does a nice casting and sizing job. Here's what they look like.



I intend to try these beauties with sabots in several of my .50 caliber guns. But yesterday's session was devoted to the .45 caliber Green Mountain barreled Renegade.



The bullets are a perfect slip fit in the Renegades 1:30 twist barrel.

I knew the gun was sighted in for dead on at 100 yards with .40 caliber/200 grain XTPs, and had no idea where those heavy leads would hit. So I set up a target at 25 yards and loaded one of the 350's over 65 grains GOEX FFFg with a felt wad under the bullet.

To my surprise, it hit only 3/4" below the left side of the 1" bull. (See shot #1 on target below.)



After adjusting the scope a little bit up and right, I took two more shots with the same load. That sucker shows promise! Both in the bull 1/2" apart.

Out of curiosity, I tried two shots with the 465 grainers with the same 65 grain load (shots 4 & 5 on the target). Those two had a 1-3/8" spread and may have potential with a heavier powder charge.

I didn't have a lot of time to play, so decided to work with just the 350's. With a target set at the 50 yard mark, I took five shots with the same 65 grain load. The .50 caliber felt wads were a pain to get in the bore without them getting cocked on the side. I can't swear they all went down perfectly flat against the charge. (Note to self - get some .45 caliber wads.)

Anyway, here's the 50 yard target.



I can tell you, I was pretty darn excited after shot number three. But four and five were a bit deflating.

After changing the adjustment on the powder measure to 75 grains, I tried five more shots at 50 yards.

Here's that target.



Can you say "BIG GRIN"?

Being pressed for time I had to quit for the day. It really stunk to have to leave without trying 75 and 100 yards, and different charges under the 465 grain bullet. But family obligations took precedence. Maybe next weekend?

Wow that is some good shooting... if you have any Triple Seven 2f next time out, try that under that big lead. Ed sure makes a pretty bullet.

Nice looking bullets and some nice groups. Might try a little spit to hold those fiber wads to the bottom of the bullets and stuff them down the bore together.

:D Al

Van, glad you were able to sneak some time out this weekend and the 350gr bullets worked out for you! One or two clicks to the left and you'll be dead on and ready to go deer hunting. GRIN Hopefully the 465gr conicals work out just as well.

I'm hoping to get out sometime this week and shoot the same 350gr bullets with my son's 50cal. Encore using Harvester Sabots. That is as long as my priorities don't get in my way. Grin

That's just purdy! That might just kill, gut and skin our poor little southern deer all in one feel swoop.

Interesting.

I would like to try some of those in my 1/30 Knights. I can't see why they would not produce similar results.

I think the results would be similar also Josmund.

These darn bullets are going to force me to get cracking on fixing up a .45 caliber barrel I picked up when I first started the Swamp Dragon project. I did the 54 caliber barrel and the .50 caliber barrel for the Dragon, but never got around to outfitting the .45 caliber barrel for it.

I just pulled the barrel blank out of the closet for a test and the bullets fit perfectly.

Van, that twist is what White ML's use for their 45 cal and you know how well they shoot in mine.

Those look like they shoot well. Now you need to try some Paper Patched RCBS 11mm bullets in it. They shoot awesome in my 1-30. Ron

That's some very nice shooting. Those 350 grain lead pills would sure do a number on deer (or larger) creatures I'm sure.

Ron, I once tried paper patching .429 hard cast semi-wadcutters and was unable to master the technique.

Nice shooting Semi!

Looks good Semi!

Nice shooting there old boy. Looks like that sinful sister has a new combo for knocking down those swamp donkeys.

Hard cast is not the way to go. The .429 was way too small. We need to get you set up. Ron

Those .429's are only .004 smaller than 11 mm. Is that enough to make a real difference? As I recall, you have two wraps of paper around your bullets. Wouldn't paper that's a little thicker make up the difference?

But then again, you must understand that I have no idea what I'm talking about. :s2:

Actually the difference is .017" my 11 mm bullets are .446

The thicker paper allows for more of a chance for the bullet to not be seated straight. 9# onion skin works very well. If the bullet is not straight at the launch then where it hits is anyones guess. Ron

Ah-ha. That do make a difference.

As the King of Paper Patching, you should post your tutorial in the reference section.

Ron,

Are you factoring in the paper? Being a machinist all my life, I had to convert mm to inch and inch to mm frequently.

To convert mm to inch, divide the mm by 25.4, but I'm sure you know this. Thought I'd post it in case any others would like to know.

11(mm) / 25.4 = 0.4330

To convert inch to mm, multiply the inch (as a decimal) by 25.4

1/4" (.250) x 25.4 = 6.35 or slightly over 6mm, which is .2362

BPS

BPS, I think what Ron is saying is that the 11 MM mold throws bullets that are actually .446. So the bullets are not truly 11 mm (similar to a ".45 caliber" mold throwing bullets that are actually .452).

I understand what you're saying Semi, but as a machinist, if I had a dimension that was 11 mm on a print, I converted it to inch and machined it accordingly. We would usually leave .006-.008 on an O.D. and .004-.006 on an I.D. leaving grind stock after hardening processes unless it was a "hard turn" which we were usually given plus or minus .0003 - .0005 depending...

I would machine an 11 mm dimension to .440 O.D. and .438 I.D. for pre-harden spec and .4332 - .4328 as hard turn with those given tolerances.

BPS

Blackpowdersmoke, No I am not figuring in the paper. I am not saying that their 11mm name is the correct measurement. I am just calling it what they call it.
RCBS sells this mould as a 11mm but the bullet falls out with soft lead at .446
They also say that it is a 370 gr mould. The standard lead that is used for this is #2 Lyman mix that is actually hard, 15 BHN hard to be a little closer to exact. So when I pour these with 8 BHN hard softer lead the bullets come out at 409 grains but they are still .446 diameter.
With paper these bullets are in the .451 range with my paper. I size them to .446 for this rifle. The paper will puff out a bit after sizing so they slip easily down the bore but they don't fall out if tipped down. If i had a sizer die that was .448 I would probably use it so it was a pinch tighter but I like the way these shoot as I have them. This is the info on the mould.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/695...ProductFinding

That's interesting Ron...

Probably because the softer lead mix you pour is denser (less porosity) than the 15 BHN mix which accounts for the additional weight while still maintaining size.

However, I still think it kind of odd that a manufacturer of quality conical moulds would list the size as 11 mm with it being .013 oversize but then again you can buy round ball moulds that significantly vary from the size that they're listed as...

.36 caliber as .351 or .375 (somewhat of a size spread there, Eh?)

BPS