The new 50 caliber Knight Mountaineer Ultra-Lite
 

I finnaly got the new Ulta-Lite to play with. I thought this was gonna be tough to talk about since i own a custom NULA from http://www.newultralight.com/HTML/mz.html

Its not really fair to compare a Knight Production Muzzleloader to a custom NULA but i will anyway.

1-Knight did an excellant job with the stock. Its made out of Kevlar like the NULA but its not slippery. The Nula stock is slippery to me and i really appreciate the new Knight Ultra-Lite stock much better.

2-The barrel on the Knight Ultra-Lite is stainless. The NULA Muzzleloader only comes with blued barrels. The stainless is a huge up grade for me in the nasty weather i hunt in, in Pennsylvania and Ohio.

3-The bolts are equal in quality, but the Knight bolt is 50 times easier to load the primer into. The NULA bolt is a tad smoother to work, but the Knight is pretty smooth.

4-The Knight ram rod is wayyyyyyyyyy better then the one that comes with the NULA. The NULA has the worst rod on any ML i have ever used. I dont use either and replace the factory rods with Knight Power rods.

5-Triggers in my opinion are very close. The NULA is a tad smoother right now.

6- Accuracy at 100 yards so far the NULA is slightly better. At 200 yards the Knight is slightly better. Not really a fair comparison yet because both guns werent tested for accuracy with the same bullets. I also didnt try any other combinations with the Knight.

7- Both Muzzleloaders do not have open sights. Both ML'S pull up very well with scopes on them for me.

8- The NULA is 1 pound lighter scoped ready to hunt. The Knight scoped ready to hunt weighs right at 7 3/4 pounds.

9-The breech plugs are equal but the Knight plug is better made in my opinion only. I believe it will handle higher peek pressure in the case of a double load or a big mistake is made. I will verify this in the future. Right now my opinion only.

10- The Knight is half the price of the NULA, i dont think you need me to figure out the rest.








All Targets were shot with 120grns by volume of BH209.

The target below was 3 shots at 100 yards with the 250grn Bloodline and Harvester sabots.



The target below is the same load at 200 yards.





This target below was shot at 100 yards with the 300grn Bloodlines and the supplied sabots.





This target below was shot at 200 yards with the same 300grn Bloodline and supplied sabots.





As you can see i didnt really spend any time trying to develope a good load. I just shot 120grns of BH209 by volume and two bullets. The accuracy with both bullets is good enough for me to take this gun to Colorado in October. Im hoping to shoot my first Bull Elk with the new Mountaineer Ultra Lite.:s4:

Great review and it sounds like It's a great gun. I sure would like to handle one and see how it feels. Maybe Cabelas will get some in. Of course you could stop by on your way to Colorado and let me shoot it
:s4:I

That is a nice looking gun. I to hope Cabelas gets them in stock. Also, what base are you using on it?

A very nice looking rifle Grouse. For not a lot of charge experimentation that is good shooting.

The base is made by Lehigh for Knights. I'm not sure that Knight has agreed to sale them or want them yet. It's actually to high for what I like but I'm going to keep it on for now.

I like it. I would want it lower too but it looks pretty good and solid. Is Knight going to come out in any other calibers with the UL?

I sure hope a 1/20 twist 45 caliber.

That was pretty much what I was curious about lol.

I sure hope not, because if so, i will be $1000 poorer, and own one.

What bullet are you planning on shooting in Colorado?

You and me both . :s4:

Probably the 250grn Bloodline.

This is a sabot? From my thread you should know you can't use less then a 50cal bullet. It's the problem I ran into when thinking about using a 50 cal sabot. No way to do it.

Maybe the 52 cal Knight makes? Would that be a 50cal bullet?

Your telling me I can't use a sabot in rifle season?

From the Colorado Game Laws


attached to muzzleloader during muzzleloading season.


It says sabots are prohibited during muzzleloader season so I would think you would be fine during rifle season for sure.

I called the DOW and I wanted to be sure I was clear. The normal restrictions for muzzleloader season don't carry over to the rifle season except one. The 50cal minimum for elk also applies for using a ML in rifle season.

You can use a scope, pellets and sabots. Even smokeless powder in rifle season, but your bullet can's be smaller than 50cal.

I know it's stupid, but that's the law.

The rules clearly say you can use a 50cal Muzzleloader and a 250grn Saboted bullet in rifle season. Thanks Flounder33

I'm not sure of what combination there is that allows you to shoot a .50 cal bullet with a sabot?

a .54 Knight MK 85 would allow you to shoot a 50 cal bullet in a sabot. .

I wonder how them 50 cal Lehigh DOA bullets would shoot in a .54. I might have to try them sometime and see and if they would work in a sabot.

If i didn't already have a NULA i would really consider the Knight Ultra Light. Mine is actually a 26" barrel and has a slightly heavier contour than the standard Melvin spec build. You cant really compare the two since Melvin will build them to your specs including LOP and the other options like a Jewell trigger.

Im still in the market for a faster twist 45 that weighs close to my NULA. My Savage Pacnor 45 is a heavy beast but it convinced me a 1-22 twist works great. Its just a terrible platform for a Ultra Light build.

BTW i love that scope base. I think ive seen it somewhere before. :D

They sure do and my DISC based GMB54-120 shoots a 50cal bullet great. Its still my favorite gun for shots out to 100 yards. The MK85 54cal was fairly light too even with the standard length barrel.

I should have never sold my NIB MK85 SS 54cal to the guy that never did a range report or even fired it. :s8:

If you look on page 12 of the Colorado DNR Big Game regulations brochure it shows a chart of what you can and can't use for the different seasons.

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteColl...me/biggame.pdf

I'm not guessing, and the rules don't say that. Ignorance will not get you out of the fine and loss of points. Show me where it says you can use less than a 50cal bullet for elk in the laws? You can use a 50cal sabot for deer. Not elk.

Call the DOW and find out for yourself.

1-303-297-1192

you should consider the ultra light to go with your NULA. You might as well have both.:D:D one for blackpowder, one for smokeless.

I could post a pic of it I guess, but as far as a range report,.... well, it's still a virgin.:D

Grouse

This comes from the Colorado regualations. As I read the regulations During Rifle Season.. the rule states.... And as you look further down the regulations you can see the specific regulations for Muzzleloading Season. The rules for the 2 season are different... They make a point of saying.... During the muzzle-loading firearm seasons for deer, elk, pronghorn, bear, and moose the following additional restrictions apply:

#203 - MANNER OF TAKE

See also #000 in Chapter 0 of these regulations for other applicable manner of take definitions.

A. The following are legal methods of take for all species and seasons listed in this chapter, except as otherwise noted. Any method of take not listed herein shall be prohibited, except as otherwise provided by statute or these regulations:

1. Rifles using center fire cartridges of .24 caliber or larger, having expanding bullets of at least seventy (70) grains in weight, except for elk and moose where the minimum bullet weight is eighty-five (85) grains, and with a rated impact energy one hundred (100) yards from the muzzle of at least one thousand (1000) foot pounds as determined by the manufacturer's rating providing that any semiautomatic rifle used shall not hold more than six (6) rounds in the magazine and chamber combined. A fully automatic rifle is prohibited.

2. Muzzle-loading rifles and smoothbore muskets, provided the minimum caliber shall be forty (.40) for all big game except elk and moose. The minimum caliber for elk and moose shall be fifty (.50). All muzzle-loading rifles and smoothbore muskets from forty (.40) caliber through fifty (.50) caliber must use a bullet of at least 170 grains in weight. All muzzle-loading rifles and smoothbore muskets greater than fifty (.50) caliber must use bullets of at least 210 grains in weight.

a. During the muzzle-loading firearms seasons for deer, elk, pronghorn, bear, and moose only lawful muzzle-loaders and smoothbore muskets may be used by muzzle-loading license holders.

b. During the muzzle-loading firearm seasons for deer, elk, pronghorn, bear, and moose the following additional restrictions apply:

1. Propellent/Powders: The use of pelletized powder systems and smokeless powder are prohibited.

2. Projectiles: Sabots are prohibited. For the purposes of this regulation cloth patches are not sabots.

3. Loading: Firearms must load from the muzzle. Firearms which can be loaded from the breech are prohibited.

4. Sights: Any muzzle-loading rifle or smoothbore musket with any sighting device other than open or "iron" sights is prohibited.

5. Electronic or battery-powered devices cannot be incorporated into or attached to the muzzle-loading firearm.

1874sharpsshooter

The NULA works fine with BH209 also but im actually kinda bored with 50cal sub guns. I only bought the NULA because i got a smokin good deal and my Savage is too heavy for my tastes. After i bought it though i called Melvin about getting a 45cal but he wont make them in 45cal anymore. I was and still am amazed at the quality.

I just love Ultra Lights and Brush Guns for hunting. I have a huge appreciation for them in the field. The only thing im missing is one in 45cal with a fast twist unless i cut down an Original DISC with a 1-20.

Yes, i must agree. The regulations posted by flounder33 indicate there are only 2 restrictions on muzzle loaders when used during rifle season for elk. The rifle must be 50 caliber, and the bullet must weigh at least 170g. Those are the only restrictions i read.

It is implicit that sabot are legal to use for elk in a 50 caliber rifle; that is what the regulation is. The regulation specifically indicate that sabot cannot be used during the muzzle loader season. Since sabot are allowed during the rifle season, and since 50 caliber rifle is allowed for elk during rifle season, it follows that a bullet that weighs at least 170g in a sabot is allowed during rifle season. That is what the regulation reads. The caliber of the bullet is only specified during the muzzle loader season.

One additional thing i did notice was smokeless powder is not allowed during muzzle loader season. This means Muley shouldn't have been using BH209 when hunting in the muzzle loader season. This i write, because Muley has long insisted Blackhorn powder is a 'smokeless' powder.

I thought like most guys that all the laws were waved if you use a ML in rifle season.

Even the guy who answers the phone didn't know the answer. He had to check with the firearms dept. 50cal for elk doesn't change no matter what the season is.

Sabots can be used for elk if it's 54 cal, or maybe the 52 cal. What size bullets do they use?

Also, sabots can be used for deer if the bullet doesn't go under 40cal.

The real question is, will the warden know what's legal? I'm not willing to take the chance.

looks to me , based on the regs. that a 50 cal gun with at least a 170 gr bullet is legal during rifle season. So a 50 cal with a saboted 250 gr bullet should be fine.

Ron & Sharp Shooter - the weight for a 50 is 210 grains as posted in the 2012 regs.

Muley is correct BH is a smokeless based powder, but it has been engineered to meet the standards of a Black Powder substitute powder, as it meters like any other BP sub.

Wrong. It says nothing about a 50 cal sabot being legal for elk.

As for BH 209. Colorado tried to make it banned. Just like they did with inlines. They got too much pressure and buckled under.

it says 40-thru 50 170 gr, greater than 50 is 210 is the way i read it.

I'm not sure why some of you think that shooting a 50cal sabot, is shooting a 50cal bullet?

The sabot is 50cal. Not the bullet.

who is thinking that? the regs for rifle season state the requirements based on the cal of the gun not the caliber of the bullet.

Muley... there is no size restriction on a ML during Rifle season - there is a projectile weight restriction.

According to the written regulations

I talked to the DOW. Did you?

A sabot solves my barrel problem. Don't you think i'd use one if it was legal?

It's really simple. Call up the DOW and see for yourself like I did. I'm not guessing at this like you guys. Ask the guys who are going to hand out the fines.

Muley,

Your hunting problems are solved. You can hunt elk during rifle season with a 195g Barnes pushed by 90g Blackhorn in your new rifle. You will be legal, and will suffer very little recoil.

Not true Mike. It has to be a 50cal for elk.

the written regs are what a person is to go by , they don't expect each person to call the DOW. The written regs seem clear to me. If i was going to colorado during rifle season I see no problem with taking a 50 cal muzzleloader and a saboted 250 gr bullet, according to the regs..