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You still didn't define muzzle loader. What is a true muzzle loader?

Your argument that past inlines are not the same as modern inlines doesn't hold much water either. Neither are modern full bore projectiles, modern side locks, modern flint locks, manufacturing techniques, powders, etc... etc...

What powder, projectile, primer do you use in your "traditional" or "true" muzzle loader?

Swiss, PRB, and a #11 cap.


btw My .270 is open sights. With my eyes I can't shoot it any farther than my ML. Since I'm a still hunter who only hunts in timber. It's does fine.

Long CF shots annoy me more than inlines. Spot and shoot. More sniping than hunting.

I'm not confusing primitive with what we have. Colorado thinks they have a primitive season. Pennsylvania used to have one, but I hear you can use sabots now. Yeah, that's primitive.

My thinking isn't original. Go to a Rendezvous or any BP shoot, and you'll find a bunch who think the same.

Interested in how I feel about food plots and tree stands? :D

:s2: No. Not particularly. Are you interested in how I feel about intolerant closed minded people? ..:biggrin: ...:kiss:

LOL ! well said!

I realized where I missed the boat on this thread. The volicity of a 44 Mag at the muzzle is about the same as the volicity for Ron's load at 320 yards (according to the chart he posted) so the bullet should open up just fine. :arms:

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wow! that looks like .338 territory to me! I wouldn't even know where to begin with a MZ if I was hunting there

Must be why we are here at HNI, more tolerant people. Us inline guys don't bash the primitive guys.

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What's to bash? They're doing it right.

Seriously for a minute. I'd give up hunting if that was all that was available. I know some guys like it, but I need trees. :confused0024:

For those who know me. I'm busting your chops, but deep down. It's how I feel.

I'm just not as intolerant as you think. :p

You still haven't defined a muzzle loader. You listed an example of one but did not define what one is.

Pa.flintlock season opens 26 Dec.Flintlock only,Roundball only,open sights only.Buckskins are optional.

It is daunting when one wanders around out on the prairie with a muzzle loader equipped with iron sights. The chance of getting a reasonable shot seems virtually impossible.

This muzzle loader season has been on going since the first day of December. Yesterday i finally got a shot, when i was headed back to the truck. Five deer were kinda walking toward me about 1/4 mile away. The furthest one out saw me, became very nervous, turned, and walked away. The other 4 walked right by my truck, and continued toward me. I just happened to be next to a group of Juniper,and sat down between two of them with another behind me. The wind was exactly wrong. I 'knew' there would be no chance.

Them deer finally winded me. Even though they winded me, they kept coming towards, and i 'knew' i would never get a shot. As i watched them deer feed, they kept winding me, but continued on a path bringing them ever closer, but not directly at me. After quite some time, it seemed they were as close as they would ever get, and they were quite nervous from my smell.

The shot seemed some too far, and i cannot hardly focus on the front sight. The shot was taken, because i wanted meat. The bullet was guided somehow, and one of them 4 deer came home with me.

Yeah, that's tough hunting with open sights on a ML. I wouldn't have fun.

I thought I read Grouse saying he was using sabots in that season? Maybe not.

I wish Colorado would have a season like that.

To make it simple for you, because you seem to demand an answer. A sidelock. Preferably with a slow twist barrel.

I have a friend that has a lyman side lock that he can keep about a 4" group at 200 yds. Using a bullet and sabot. So, this would be acceptable as a traditional mler, to you.

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Your nick name indicates you hunt for antlers.

Not acceptable. :poke:

Well at a chance as sounding arogant. Most that have your opinion have never killed a buck worth keeping, if you had the pride and excitement of doing what most don't have the skill to do. Would change your attitude.

So, you go ahead and keep using a 75yd. Gun and leaving your little antlers in the field and I will keep filling my freezer and my wall. I wont push my way on you and you quit pushing yours on everyone else.

You act as if you think it makes you special, it doesn't.

Yeah I am seeing that. Side lock is a side lock is a traditional gun. But I guess to someone that makes his own definition to suit his agruement, there is no discussing, with! Because he will change that definition as his agruement fails!!!

Just like your wall doesn't make you special. Just a braggart.

Even your name is bragging.

You also assume too much, but I guess that makes you feel better. You can't handle that I left on the ground something better than your wall.

If you can't handle a little ribbing. Even after I tell you i'm doing it. It says a lot about you.

How would you describe a traditional muzzleloader?

But I am just busting your chops! You can't handle it?

A flint lock. Just because a sidelock was made to look traditional, don't mean it is. If you do not go back that far. You are just agrueing to argue.

Braggart or not. I have proof of what I have or do. I guess I will just take your word, you have left bigger in the field. Now that I have actually typed that, I will call bs. Talk that **** to someone else, I don't believe you.

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That's good shootin with a traditional. open sights or scoped?

I said sidelock. I never mentioned cap or flint. Probably a better way for me to say it would be.....caplock or earlier.



As for you kidding me? Doubtful.

Scoped and the faster twist as MM pointed out. I guess I should also state he has been a competitive shooter for about 20 years as well. One of the best, I have seen.

Some people are just naturals at shooting and others have to really work at it lol.

Well per your own words, your not kidding, either. Soooo whats your point?

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my wife thinks that santa hats are the way to go, this time of year. Thats alot of ribbons, good thing you have all them antlers!!!

I am serious about how I feel. I'm not serious about it meaning anything to me. I don't care how anybody hunts. We all have our own ideas and opinions.

I like still hunting timber, but I wouldn't like it if everybody felt the same way. The timber areas would be full of hunters. It's rare that I see another hunter where I hunt. If I do we have a lot in common, and usually stop and talk a bit.

Sometimes I get bored, and stir it up here. A mod usually lets me know when to stop by PM.

btw I really have left some good antlers behind. I'm sure someone put them to good use. For me...it's just more weight to haul out. I'm not a trophy hunter, but even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then.

Aw..........................................really ? You have accomplished some good. Your disdain for my equipment led to my doing more research, and now i find the 45 Elite will kill deer out to 400 yard. Why stop in Chicago, when you can go to New York, 'eh?

Seriously, i'd like you to make that shot. It's not for me, but I can appreciate the skill it takes. Good luck.