Chiefs Pro Clean Retriever
 

I came across this product from a Max Muzzleloader video and was wondering if anyone has used one?

By looking at the picture it looks like it cleans out the rifling grooves unlike a regular patch and cleaning jag. Suppossedly improving accuracy. Although i would think you would just be pushing the fouling back down toward the breech plug and not getting it all brought back out of the barrel.

Other then that, it sounds like it would work, i was just wondering if anyone here has used one and what their thoughts were on this product. The product is barrel specific so it obviously isn't a one size fits all.

A while back a fella on here had one and said it did pretty good. You are correct about pushing the fowling down the bore but if your breechplug is removable then no worries. I would not use that on a traditional rifle that would bunch up a lot of that crap in the breach. Unless you shoot a lot of lead conicals I see no reason to get one if you shoot saboted bullets. My gun usually gets everything nice and clean within 5 patches and the grooves are nice and shiney.

My barrel looks real shiney too being stainless, and the grooves look clean, but alot of people thought that my accuracy problem could be plastic fouling from the sabots, which is why i thought this tool might work.

I plan on shooting at least 100 rounds in a day here soon and i don't feel like taking the breech plug out every time i use it. So i may just pass on it unless i hear good results from others.

I seriously doubt that your accuracy problem is due to plastic fouling.what rifle,powder, bullet/sabot combo are you using. Ray

I shoot a Knight LK93 with a stainless barrel and 3X9X40 scope. Loads are 100gr of 777 and a 260gr Barnes Red Hot Bullet or Expander MZ.

I'm sure it gets the grooves cleaner than a standard cleaning jag and patch, but I use the Otis system to give my muzzleloader (and all other guns) a thorough cleaning. You can make the patch impossibly tight, so you know that the grooves are getting cleaned well (and you can clean from breech to muzzle). What I don't like about this product is that it claims that it is NOT one-size fits all, yet it lists the #102 Retriever as being able to clean the Omega and a whole HOST of other .50 muzzleloaders. Point being that the Omega is known for its tighter bore.

I also do not like the USA&Jag spinning adapter as it is ripping off the SpinJag concept. I hope this company gets their asses handed to them in court.

Iowabucks44

I have not read all the posts in this thread... so if I walk something I am sorry - did not do it on purpose....

I do remember reading some where that you might have some concern about plastic fouling in the bore. With the older formulation of sabots, this is/was a possibilty. Looking down the bore and seeing how bright it might be is not an indication of a clean bore. There is probably fouling, especially plastic fouling caught on the leading edge of a land, powder fouling especially can easily be had with water and a bore mop as the powder is fouling is water soluble, while pastic residue is not. The newer sabots that are available today using a new formulation of polymere does not present the problem that the older formulation did.

The 'TOOL', I can not really speak for it or again it as I have never used one. I have seen them before and looked at the adds but realy never felt it was a advantageous to me.

If you really want to rid the bore of any fouling and especially plastic fouling then I would suggest it needs to be stripped back to bare metal. One method is using JB's bore paste it will do a very good job but it is possible to still leave some plastic fouling in the bore.

Here is a video explaining the JB method:

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/lid=1...G_Bore_Pellets

If you really want to get everything out of the a ML bore I think the best method continues to be to flush the bore with clean boiling water and then while hot use a bronze brush to brush out the loosened materials.

If you do this and you have a blued barrel, dry the bore as quiclky as possible - I blow compressed air through and then dry patches. You still may get a bit of flash surface rust.

If you have a stainless bore you will not have to dry as fast and you probably will not experiance flash rust.

The boiling water expands the the metal in the bore flushes the pores of the bore, cause lead or copper fouling to flake and softens the plastic residue to the point it will not adhere to the metal.

On a gun that I shoot a lot, I will do this procedure a couple of times a year. Others may not get this treatment only o very few occasions. All that I am having accuracy issues with will get this treatment after I have eliminated stock to brrel issues and sight/scope issues.

Just another thought if you are using a bore oil with teflon in it, or a petroleum based bore oil, you might consider switching to a synthetic oil.

Hope some of this might help...

I wouldn't really want to use this product. Any stubborn fouling should come out with quality nylon brush and the correct solvent. Followed by a good tight fitting patch.

wouldnt work in my barrel due to the rifling design. And if it did fit, i still wouldnt use it

Can i get a little info on making sure i don't have any stock to barrel issues? I have seen info on tv about how a free floating barrel helps and heard of different procedures of seating the barrel. I will be putting a new stock on my gun very soon (broke the original one), and don't want to have issues there.

Iowabucks44

I can share some information with you for sure... One thing to remember 'floating' a barrel is not the best for accuracy it is the cheapestest so that is why you see many companies floating barrels. Compainies can not afford to spend the time (money) bedding a barrel to the stock properly so the best thing is to 'float' them. With a would stock the temperature of the barrel on the wood will make the POI change unless they barrel is bedded in glass or some such feature. In a composite stock if the barrel were bedded into the barrel channel correctly the heat would not be a problem but the flexion of the for arm of the inexpensive stock create a POI shift - so the answer 'float' the barrel.

In your case... since I think you said you have a Knight and if you are getting a Knight composite stock you might not have any of these problems. When I put a barreled action in a Knight stock I set the action in the stock and start the lug screw in. Tighten it with the allen wrench until it starts to pull the action down. Then stand the gun vertically with the recoil pad on the floor. Gently, and honestly i am not that gentle, tap the gun on the floor to assure that the recoil lug is all the way back in the pocket. Then tighten the lug screw up snugly to hold it all in place. Forgot to say make sure the ram rod is not in place.

After the lug screw is tight, place the gun horizontal and sqeeze the nose of the forearm and the barrel together as tight as you can. If there is no movement - your done the barrel is seated on and in the barrel channel. Put the ram rod in and repeat the test. If the test is the same your done... go shoot it and give it a check for accuracy.

If during the squeeze test (ram rod removed) the barrel moves down into the stock or the stock moves up to the barrel... release the grip and note if the barrel moves (on its own) back to the original location. Everything should be good - the barrel is floating. Next repeat the test again noting where the barrels returns to. At this time grip the barrel and the forearm of the stock and pull them apart easily. If you feel the barrel stick at some point then you have a problem. If the barrel appears to lift slightly but when you release it - it returns to the orginal location and you feel no points of stickyness - you are good. Put the ram rod in and repeat the test.

During the squeeze testing if you felt some stickyness in the spring of the floating barrel you will then to do some very light sanding in the barrel channel to relieve the tight spot. You might be able to locate the tight spot by running a dollor bill under the barrel and between the stock to locate the tight spot. Do not sand any more than you need, in fact in my little world the thinkness of a single dollor bill is the max thickness the barrel should be off the stock. I normall use a strip of white computer paper for this test it is thinner than a dollar bill - heck it might be worth more than the dollar bill also!!!

Hope this might help you... when you get your new stock and if I can help give a shout....

mike

Hey Mike...why should that be the max thickness?

Damn straight.

7.62NATO

Originally Posted by sabotloader
Do not sand any more than you need, in fact in my little world the thinkness of a single dollor bill is the max thickness the barrel should be off the stock.

Hey Mike...why should that be the max thickness?

It is just a personal thing.... but where I hunt if you get a gap much thicker than that you will end with the barrel channel under the barrel full of needles, twigs, and other useless things. They also could defeat the purpose of floating if they add up and apply pressure on one spot on the barrel - remote that it might happen but...

Hope that makes sense....

Perfect sense. I thought it was related to accuracy in and of itself...in a vacuum, so to speak. Thanks.

Thanks for taking the time to type that out Mike!

ubetcha...

but u really can not call what i do typing...