Cold Weather Accura(s)
01-01-2011, 07:57 PM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
Posts: 3,732
Cold Weather Accura(s)
This morning when we made coffee, it was 4 degrees. Near dawn it was zero degrees. After breakfast it seemed i should take the Accura(s) up into the hills, and see if they would shoot. The rifles have been left in the truck loaded with BH209 for days, or weeks, and the past 2 nights have been quite cold. By the time i left the house it was 2 degrees. The road was snowy, so i took my time. Upon arriving where i wanted to be, it was zero degrees. When i finished firing each rifle it was -1 degree.
There was a bleach bottle near full of water in the truck, and it was frozen. I used it for a target at about 90 yard, and gave the pre-2010 Accura a chance. The rifle fired instantaneously, and the bleach bottle was smucked.
The breech plug in the rifle is the same as these ones. It is sized so there is a slight crush of the STS primer, and there is zero leakage around the primer.
The flash channel is 1/8", and the flash hole is .028". The plug has, thus far, been 100% reliable igniting BH209 in all kind of conditions. Whether it be hot, or cold, or clean, or dirty, the plug just works. This plug certainly isn't successful because it has a large flash hole, or an excessively large flash channel.
Then the V2 was given a chance. It also hit where aimed, and the BH was ignited instantaneously by STS primer. Here is picture of the QRBP in the V2.
The flash channel of the QRBP was accidentally drilled to 1/8", and the flash hole in the Precision Rifle vent liner is 0.032". The powder chamber diameter is 5/16", and it looks to be about the same depth.
It seems i won't ever have any issues igniting BH whilst hunting with either rifle. If i can keep from shaking/shivering, and/or jerking the trigger, both rifles will bring home the meat.
There was a bleach bottle near full of water in the truck, and it was frozen. I used it for a target at about 90 yard, and gave the pre-2010 Accura a chance. The rifle fired instantaneously, and the bleach bottle was smucked.
The breech plug in the rifle is the same as these ones. It is sized so there is a slight crush of the STS primer, and there is zero leakage around the primer.
The flash channel is 1/8", and the flash hole is .028". The plug has, thus far, been 100% reliable igniting BH209 in all kind of conditions. Whether it be hot, or cold, or clean, or dirty, the plug just works. This plug certainly isn't successful because it has a large flash hole, or an excessively large flash channel.
Then the V2 was given a chance. It also hit where aimed, and the BH was ignited instantaneously by STS primer. Here is picture of the QRBP in the V2.
The flash channel of the QRBP was accidentally drilled to 1/8", and the flash hole in the Precision Rifle vent liner is 0.032". The powder chamber diameter is 5/16", and it looks to be about the same depth.
It seems i won't ever have any issues igniting BH whilst hunting with either rifle. If i can keep from shaking/shivering, and/or jerking the trigger, both rifles will bring home the meat.
01-02-2011, 08:02 AM
#3
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,605
Both are very close in TB's 32cal PRB fps test but the flame from a RemSTS is supposed to be hotter. The Win209 is the longest and the RemSTS is the shortest of all the common primers. One of Rons custom Omega type plugs worked great this year in my old Accura 45 Vi after being loaded for over a day and left out in the cold all night.
Last edited by Gm54-120; 01-02-2011 at 08:23 AM.
01-02-2011, 09:20 AM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Saxonburg Pa
Posts: 3,925
First off, .028 is not a large flash hole. Secondly 1/8" is not a large flash channel.
Just because you drive up a mountain and shoot one shot out of two different guns means nothing at all. And just because you know how to use a drill and tap doesn't make you any more educated on breech plugs either. You keep telling people what's right and wrong and actually you don't know yourself.
A .028 flash hole and a 1/8" flame channel will work just fine if you wanna take care of your plug thru the season. I do not want to take care of my plug thru hunting season. Right now my plug has about 75 shots and has been in three states and has not been touched. This is the advantage of a 5/32 flame channel. The flash hole size wont matter if the plug is built/constructed correctly.
This has been tested and proven with 1000's of shots with a variety of people and Many different Muzzleloaders. The carbon build up in lesser plugs will get ya when you don't expect it. The Omega will fail, triumph, Endeavor, and all others eventually if you don't take care of the plug. That's the advantage to a 5/32 flame channel. No maintenance needed and the gun will go boom every time.
Those folks that are getting plugs made have two choices.
1- Small flame channel and clean the plug all the time and hope it goes off when needed.
2- Large flame channel and worry about nothing till after hunting season.
BTW- The vent-liner is the best way for a flash hole. Period
01-02-2011, 09:35 AM
#5
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
I also live where the Temps get real COLD, -0 I dont have a modified BP in My ACCURA's (V1's) but I also dont fire many shots inbetween cleaning the BP's. I also have the muzzle covered with a piece of Masking Tape to keep out the mositure. I have had the ACCURA in the warm House, out into the Cold Truck, then warmed up, then out into the Cold again to Hunt then Back to the cold Truck, then warmed up and back into the Warm House again and then repete this again the next day.
I have never had an issue with the V1 not firing. As long as you keep your BP clean and keep moisture out of the Barrel you should be fine. I know Im not using BH and this is harder to ignite out of some BP's, but the rules should apply to most reguardless what Powder your using. Take care of your MLer and it will fire when you need it to.
(BP)
I have never had an issue with the V1 not firing. As long as you keep your BP clean and keep moisture out of the Barrel you should be fine. I know Im not using BH and this is harder to ignite out of some BP's, but the rules should apply to most reguardless what Powder your using. Take care of your MLer and it will fire when you need it to.
(BP)
01-02-2011, 12:03 PM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
Posts: 3,732
Geez, all i did was go out and shoot my rifles, then share the results with these forum.
Yes, that is my point exactly.
Why not? When i drive up a mountain, throw a rifle over my shoulder, and hunt in the cold, i want to know it will go bang when i pull the trigger the one time, the first time.
My wallet tells me i have burned a way way too many bottles of BH209, and that has, in fact, educated me some about breech plugs, and what makes them work or fail. Here are some things i 'know'.
These plugs for my Accura are similar but different. The plug on the left has a 0.030" flash hole. The plug on the right has a 0.028" flash hole. The plug on the left has a 0.118" flame channel. The plug on the right has a 0.125" flame channel. A plug like the one on the left has failed to ignite BH in my Accura several times. A plug like the one on the right has never failed to ignite BH in my Accura. A plug like the one on the right has been allowed to go uncleaned for far too many shots, and it has never failed to ignite BH, even when the flash channel had shrunk down to 1/16", due to the carbon. The data seems to indicate the size of the flash hole, and the flame channel, are not what leads to successfully igniting BH. It is quite obvious to me the secret to successfully igniting BH, is to use a breech plug that has a powder chamber.
If i have ever written something that was wrong, i wish i wouldn't have. I have tried as hard as i could to be factual and accurate.
Makes sense.
I don't really understand why this would be the case. I can see that if the flame channel is drilled out with a #21 drill all the way through, it would make for simpler cleaning of the flame channel, and that is indeed a minor plus. However, when one doesn't use a vent liner, one can make the flash hole any length, within reason, that one chooses. When one uses a vent liner the flash hole has to be near 1/4" long, which is excessive. Why make a flash hole 1/4" long, when a flash hole 1/8" long will work as well or better. You do realize, that when using a vent liner you are stealing volume from the flame channel, which you can give back by just drilling a flash hole 1/8" long.
Myself, i have no problem using or not using a vent liner in the Accura breech plug. It just isn't important to me. Sure, if the flash hole in the enlarges, it can be readily replaced if it is vent liner provided. If there isn't a vent liner, and the flash hole erodes too much, a vent liner can then be installed. Kind of a non-issue.
When it comes to the QRBP, modiflying the plug by using a vent liner to provide a powder chamber, and a flash hole, is a very very good solution towards making the plug work with BH.
You sure came down hard on this old man; you know, you coulda hurt my feelings.
These plugs for my Accura are similar but different. The plug on the left has a 0.030" flash hole. The plug on the right has a 0.028" flash hole. The plug on the left has a 0.118" flame channel. The plug on the right has a 0.125" flame channel. A plug like the one on the left has failed to ignite BH in my Accura several times. A plug like the one on the right has never failed to ignite BH in my Accura. A plug like the one on the right has been allowed to go uncleaned for far too many shots, and it has never failed to ignite BH, even when the flash channel had shrunk down to 1/16", due to the carbon. The data seems to indicate the size of the flash hole, and the flame channel, are not what leads to successfully igniting BH. It is quite obvious to me the secret to successfully igniting BH, is to use a breech plug that has a powder chamber.
If i have ever written something that was wrong, i wish i wouldn't have. I have tried as hard as i could to be factual and accurate.
A .028 flash hole and a 1/8" flame channel will work just fine if you wanna take care of your plug thru the season. I do not want to take care of my plug thru hunting season. Right now my plug has about 75 shots and has been in three states and has not been touched. This is the advantage of a 5/32 flame channel. The flash hole size wont matter if the plug is built/constructed correctly.
This has been tested and proven with 1000's of shots with a variety of people and Many different Muzzleloaders. The carbon build up in lesser plugs will get ya when you don't expect it. The Omega will fail, triumph, Endeavor, and all others eventually if you don't take care of the plug. That's the advantage to a 5/32 flame channel. No maintenance needed and the gun will go boom every time.
Those folks that are getting plugs made have two choices.
1- Small flame channel and clean the plug all the time and hope it goes off when needed.
2- Large flame channel and worry about nothing till after hunting season.
This has been tested and proven with 1000's of shots with a variety of people and Many different Muzzleloaders. The carbon build up in lesser plugs will get ya when you don't expect it. The Omega will fail, triumph, Endeavor, and all others eventually if you don't take care of the plug. That's the advantage to a 5/32 flame channel. No maintenance needed and the gun will go boom every time.
Those folks that are getting plugs made have two choices.
1- Small flame channel and clean the plug all the time and hope it goes off when needed.
2- Large flame channel and worry about nothing till after hunting season.
I don't really understand why this would be the case. I can see that if the flame channel is drilled out with a #21 drill all the way through, it would make for simpler cleaning of the flame channel, and that is indeed a minor plus. However, when one doesn't use a vent liner, one can make the flash hole any length, within reason, that one chooses. When one uses a vent liner the flash hole has to be near 1/4" long, which is excessive. Why make a flash hole 1/4" long, when a flash hole 1/8" long will work as well or better. You do realize, that when using a vent liner you are stealing volume from the flame channel, which you can give back by just drilling a flash hole 1/8" long.
Myself, i have no problem using or not using a vent liner in the Accura breech plug. It just isn't important to me. Sure, if the flash hole in the enlarges, it can be readily replaced if it is vent liner provided. If there isn't a vent liner, and the flash hole erodes too much, a vent liner can then be installed. Kind of a non-issue.
When it comes to the QRBP, modiflying the plug by using a vent liner to provide a powder chamber, and a flash hole, is a very very good solution towards making the plug work with BH.
You sure came down hard on this old man; you know, you coulda hurt my feelings.
01-02-2011, 12:09 PM
#8
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Boncarbo,Colorado
Posts: 9,186
The 5/32 flash channel is super clean. I adjusted my Optima's head space a bit and tried it again. I forget how many times i shot it with BH209 but the primers had basically no black on them. I even use the .035" flash hole.
01-02-2011, 01:18 PM
#9
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Burlington,Vt
Posts: 173
Why is it on this forum when someone who shares something interesting to some of us it draws out all the "freakin experts" who do nothing but critizize all the time. No one even asks them for their opinion, they just stick some crap out to disrupt the forum. Them kind of people make me want to leave this forum and not come back.
01-02-2011, 02:21 PM
#10
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Yucca Valley,Ca
Posts: 2,496
Why is it on this forum when someone who shares something interesting to some of us it draws out all the "freakin experts" who do nothing but critizize all the time. No one even asks them for their opinion, they just stick some crap out to disrupt the forum. Them kind of people make me want to leave this forum and not come back.