RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

The newer ones will have 3lb triggers. I think the lawyers got involved.

Not to side withthat uglyFG... but Mike, most sane people should have no desire to shoot more than 100 grains of loose powder. :D

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

UC

I know I was there for several years... but the 110 all the inlines except for the Knighta 120shoots so good and you already know for me "velocity" is the key vital point. I'll take "velocity" with the corresponding energy boost all day. In fact i thinky ou would find more than a few of us.

Still I can shoot your "shorts" in any gun I own not to mention the 460 grain Bull Shop grenades - which is the best conical that I have ever found... and I know that is problem also cause I shoot 90 grains T7-3f.

The one thing you have to remember for me - the only recoil that I have a second thought about is a 3 1/2" #5 Federal Turkey shot shell - that one would be difficult to shoot all day. Everything I shoot in a ML has less felt recoil than my 300 Win Mag - so that is not an issue. Accuracy, Velocity - Energy - Penetration - Terminal Performance is theorder that works for me.

For a hunting rifle.... now I am talking HUNTING - a 3# pull isprobably saferand really OK if there is no creep and it is crisp... I think about a Renegade with the set trigger pulled - that really takes some practice to get on a target and not prematurely touch the boom trigger - I am not sure I would want a really light trigger all the timehunting.

I am so darn unconventional in every thing I guess...

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

What about expansion and shoot thru, which is closely related to your penetration and energy and terminal performance, but not quite. Expansion gets you the big hole going out and the jello inside, shoot thru gets you blood trail. Agreed, Accuracy is #1, penetration is #2, #3 is expansion and number 4 is shoot thru gives you terminal performance in my mind. We all know bullets that don't penetrate, begins wih a P and end with a t, and we all know bullets that don't expand well, begins with an S and ends with an e, and we all know ones that do all 4 of these things and they time and time again give us he termainal performance. Maybe no fragmentation, but that gets to penetration and shoot thru.
Accuracy 2" is very good, lower is better
penetration at least 12"
expansion at least 1.75x bullet diameter
shoot thru is obvious it is either there or not
no fragmentation at least 75 or 80% of origonal weight
terminal performance most are boom flops or <= 50 yards tracking.

I think that is a ML bullet. I can think of some that can do it all. We all know what they are also.
Chap

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

Chap

I guess I included "expansion" in "Terminal Perf".... I hate to come right out and say "expansion" because someone will throw up a picture of a soft lead bullet that "pancakes" and call that expansion (which it is)... So "terminal performance" for and all the things that go along with it.. including the jello and the hole out the other side... but there a lot of good hunters out there that believe al the energy should be expelled in the animal... for me I like my formula with the meaning it has to me...

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

Shoot! I thought Chap was talking about pure lead conicals! :)

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

UC

He was! yer kind of pure lead conical... post that picture of an expanded Bull Shop over here... That is a good looking bullet that has expanded - not pancaked

The only thing wrong with it is the route.... the route it has to take to get todistant targets... but ifn i am required to shoot lead conicals those 460's are the cadilac/Hummer of the conical world...

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

that day the scope on my optima took a poop there were a few guys shooting some OU break opens, Every one of them just slammed the actions shut. I hate when people do! I had a .410/.22lr combo and my step brother kept shooting it and slamming it until it finallu broke. So much needless wear.

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

Can't find that one, Mike. Found one that Batchief posted over at MM that is fairly impressive though.

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

UC

Ya that one! even though it is 496 - Can you post it here -I would feel bad ripping off a Chief post - I do not want him mad at me! - he could scare me easy - I really think that is how a bullet should look when it come out or goesacross the body...

See when you post it - it meets most of my criteria (velocity excepted) and even though it be a an all lead conical - it really meets Chap's also...

I get pancakes @ "I Hop" - I get bullets from Nosler - Bull Shop - Speer

RE: Torn Between Two Rifles
 

:)