app or 777 in fffg
 

I have a omega 50 cal and would like info on using app 3fg. I understand that app is cleaner but is it as reliable and consistant burning as 777. I also wonder if changing to the small cal rifle primers will work ok. I will be trying to get better acc out of this gun using 300 to 330 grain bullets.I would like to get 1 to 1.5 in grooping at 100yds. do I have a chance of getting this from app or 777 in 3fg ?

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

APP is the most variable powder out there according to the October issue of American Rifleman, authored by Bryce Towsley. Given that it is more variable than 777, anything that is variable affects accuracy. If you want to get to 1 or 1.5" then use 777 would be my opinion.
Chap Gleason

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

Here is the 777. Chap Gleason

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

Here is the Black Powder. Chap Gleason

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

Interesting barrel pressure there with the goex. Average 10,100 psi with 100 grains and a 240 grain sabot. 12,600 with 150 grains.

Do they give the pressures with the triple 7 and APP?

Just noticed the FPS with pyrodex Select. It seems to have the best #'s with 150 grains loose.

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

Last year i used JSG 3f powder. Switched to 777 ff this year. I feel the 777 is a lot more consistent.

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

The charts above in essence say this, JSG stick have a Standard deviation of 200, whereas the 777 pellets have a standard deviation of 23. If you go from 2 pellets to 3 pellets, usually it only makes a 400 fps difference. JSG stick are 200 FPS off from shoot to shot, that is huge in my mind---1/2 a pellet or 25g of powder. Values less than 40-50 fps are what I would expect, most other powders are below that value. If the JSG sticks and the APP sticks are that far off, I would not use them. The loose JSG and APP seem to be more consistent, but NOT as consistent as 777, which improves accuracy shot to shot, and that is what your trying to do, every thing consistent---powder, loading pressure, sabot, bullet weight, primer charge, every little thing makes a difference---shoot a loose sabot vs a tight sabot and accuracy suffers, shoot a Kleenbore primer vs a Federal Primer in a Savage and you have misfires, shoot an inconsistent powder and expect spread in your shots,etc.
Chap Gleason

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

Lots of folks get down on APP and JSGbecause theydo notspend the time to makethe powder work for them. With APP you have to weigh the charges because of the varying size of the powder granules. With JSG allthe granules are about the samesize and weighing is not necessary, although somefolks do it: Started doing it myself thisfall. Not sure what the standard deviation is with 120 weighed grains of JSG: However is cannot be much, because my Encore makes consistent 1.5 inch groups with that load and the 250 grain SST in the tight fitting black sabot at 100 yards.

1.JSG likes a very tight fitting sabot.
2. Youhave to really lean on the ramrod and compress the JSG. If your rammingis not heavy enough and/or is not consistentyour group will suffer.

RE: app or 777 in fffg
 

This is great info Falcon, just like FG on "how to shoot PBs" makes sense since the granuals are so big, and clump so easy. Thanks I love the cleanup on APP, very clean, powder. Chap Gleason