Go Back  HuntingNet.com Forums > Firearms Forum > Black Powder
 209 primers - too hot or not? >

209 primers - too hot or not?

Black Powder Ask opinions of other hunters on new technology, gear, and the methods of blackpowder hunting.

209 primers - too hot or not?

Old 07-25-2007, 12:18 AM
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 22
Default 209 primers - too hot or not?

I have been told that some 209 primers are too hot for using with pellets and actually "blow past" the pellets andnot all of the pellet powder gets used. Any suggested 209 primers on the market that address this problem? I hear Remington may have come out with a "cooler" 209 primer to address this problem.
user06 is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 12:53 AM
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 31
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

buy them and shoot them.seem all to shoot well for me. I bought a 25acp adapter and YES it worked but not any differnece I could tell. and primers are cheaper. I did try the T 7 primers las tyear and they seeemd to shoot well but just more expensive.
salukidawg is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 10:01 AM
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 591
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

I don't think that's true. A nice hot primer will give you a reliable ignition. Themyth is that they affect accuracy because they blow the bullet off the powder charge before the powder starts to burn. If you really think your accuracy is going to improve, then any of the "clean" primers are the reduced power ones that'll 'address' that issue. Remington Kleanbore, Triple Se7en primers.
rem 700 is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 11:29 AM
Dominant Buck
cayugad's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

The main concern of a lot of shooters with hot primers was;

The force of the primer moved the main charge prior to full ignition. And it is true that even though slight, some of the chronograph readings do support that certain primers do add actual velocity (or take away) how ever slight. Whether it effect accuracy, only rifle rifle knows for sure. Try the primers in your rifle and see how the accuracy is.

The hotter the primer, the more the crud ring possibilities. While hotter primers can make an impact of fowling or the crud ring issue, crud rings can vary between rifles, geographical locations, powders, and also vary in severity of the crud rings. Some shooters report little or none with one primer and powder. Others report they can not safely load a second projectile without a thorough swabbing of the bore.

Hotter primers tend to expand more and hence get stuck in the breech plug more. I personally felt that this had more to do with rifle design then primer properties. Again, only your rifle will answer that question concerning expansion of primers.

When I was shooting pellets I personally wanted as hot a primers as I could get to make sure that as much fire possible was thrown through and around that pellet making for a more consistent ignition. This is especially true in hunting situations where the weather might be damp and powder ignition could be effected. I used Remington Kleenbore Primers with loose powder, but used Winchester W209 primers when shooting pellets as they are a little hotter then the Kleenbore.

I think you need to get some different brand primers and try them out with different powder and projectile combinations. Find the one that works for you best for you and your rifle and stick with it. I would recommend the Remington Kleenboreor the Winchester W209. I have not shot the new Winchester 777 primers so I will not comment.

Have you seen the price primers and caps have jumped? It is getting crazy out there.
cayugad is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 01:05 PM
Nontypical Buck
wabi's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: southwest Ohio
Posts: 1,047
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

I could never understand why inlines need 209 primer ignition. Since the path for the flame is straight, it seems like a regular old percussion cap would be plenty. I've been thinking about switching to the brass 209 sized holders that use a small rifle/pistol primer.
But for an answer to the question, I've used regular 209 primes and the new milder (Winchester T-7 & Remington) primers & can't really see any difference in accuracy or cleaning.
wabi is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 01:28 PM
Dominant Buck
cayugad's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

Most of my inlines are #11 cap ignition, and they work just fine. As long as you shoot loose powder. I think the 209 came into life because people wanted a hotter ignition source, easier to handle, and more weather proof (although a #11 cap IMO is very weather resistant). Then when they started shooting the 209 in loose powder and shooting pellets they discovered the advantage of the 209 overall for pellets.

When the crud ring issues all started coming to light, almost at once, less powerful 209 primers came out and then different loading systems like the 25 ACP came in. With loose powder in my inlines, I have never had a #11 not do the job.
cayugad is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 01:36 PM
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 426
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

I have used the kleenbores and 777 primers in my Optima. The expansion problem cayugad mentioned was a problem for me with the kleenbores. After a few shots, I would have to use a primer pick to get them out. I had more crud ring with them as well. I switched to 777 primers and do not seem to have as much crud and they do not expand.
oldrookie is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 01:50 PM
Typical Buck
Chris W.'s Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 686
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

I said earlier that I'd used the 777 winchester primers last year and really liked them. I fired off several dozen last year while testing different bullets at the range and while hunting. They worked like a charm and crud ring was pretty much nonexistant. A few weeks ago, while breaking in the KRB, I had 3 of the 777 primers not ignite the powder charge. They just made a weak poof sound and then nothing. The rifle went off with a second primer, but it made me wonder about what I've heard concerning the 777 primers and their reliability. Next range trip, I'm going to try so regular Winchester 209 primers.
Chris W. is offline  
Old 07-25-2007, 02:17 PM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,180
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

I finally got to try a pack of triple 7 primers the other week. I only had the 360 minnies that dont shoot that great, but i didnt notice any better accuracy. They pretty much fell out of my breechplug when i opened the bolt. Thats one thing i do like about them. I have to get more great plains bullets to really see if they hurt or improve accuracy in my rifle.
frontier gander is offline  
Old 07-26-2007, 10:11 AM
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Virginia
Posts: 76
Default RE: 209 primers - too hot or not?

To comment on user06's question.I'm the one that passed on info.to him(we're hunting buddies)concerning the "too hot 209's moving the bullet off the charge theory".I have been reading this over the last year or so and decided to find out for myself.I'm shooting a scoped (3x9 nikon).50Omega, JB'dw/shimmed lug pockets,this floated it nicely.Loaded w/.452 gold dots(thx sabotloader)in hp12 mmp sabots on top of 110 gr.pyrodex pellets,and winchester 209's.Have used this combo for two years now and have been extremely pleased with accuracy and deer results.Consistant 1 1/2"@100 and bang flop game result.Decided to try the Vari-flame primer just the other day w/cci440 sm.rifle primers..Cleanedbore of Sheathw/windex/91% alchahol.Fired two 209's to foul and loaded my usual load.Off Rock Rest and bags got my normal 3 shot 1 1/2"grp.I clean between rounds, one damp stuttered down,turned over,down again,then two dry patched.Allow to cool 20 MIN.,use spin jag.Loaded same load w/variflame.WOW,GROUP WENT TO7/8".user06 saw the results.Did this back and forth with same basic results for 7 cycles.I'm convincedMY GUNlikes the vari-flame.Only concern is cold weather ignition.But can revert to 209's then.Sub 2" is notBRprinting but for hunting will probably be ok.Gonna try the 25acp next for grins. hunt4me
HUNT4ME is offline  

Quick Reply: 209 primers - too hot or not?

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.