My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/4156/huntingphotos073rs8.jpg

Today I did some serious shooting!!!! I used the Omega only--even though I planned to use the old Woods Rifle. I started at 100 yards and proceeded to shoot a 3/4 inch group with open sights!!!!!! The link to the photo is above.

The best group was obviously that one. I used plain Winchester primers, 300 grain XTPs of course, and 110 grains of American Pioneer. It's very strange because I normally only use Pyrodex. That is basically the best group I've ever gotten at 100 yards with open sights and yet it was with the powder I use the least.

When I tried 110 grains of Pyrodex the first time today, I shot about a 2 inch group. They were all low and two even missed the paper(they were still a nice group). If you'll notice with the APP, they are all quite high of center. I noticed that the APP shoots about 3 inches high while the Pyrodex shoots at least 3 inches low. Interesting, huh?

I also tried 150 grains of Pyrodex and APP at 100 yards. They were not impressive groups. With the Pyrodex, the recoil was tolerable and I shot decent, putting two a half inch apart and the other a ways away. I think I must have flinched on that one. The APP was horrible. I couldn't stand the recoil so I shot once with 150 gr. and twice with 120 gr. It was not better than a 6 inch group.

At the end, I shot 3 times with 110 grains of Pyrodex again--this time at a big target. It was about an 8inch group, which I'm guessing was due to a build up of fouling. I swabbed after firing every group today but towards the end the barrel was pretty nasty.

The difference in recoil is astounding between the two powders. I can barely stand the APP but the Pyrodex is fine.

I definetely think I should start using the APP for accuracy, butI still think the Pyrodex is better quality. Have any of you had any similar experiences with APP versus Pyrodex? I always thought Pyrodex was so much better but now I'm not so sure.

By the way, those plain Winchester primers aren't as good as the Triple Sevens. They won't come out as easily and leave it much dirtier.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

APP is a goodpowder depending on what you're shooting. I have yet to see it shoot a conical well. As for sabots, it does a good job. Pyrodex while filthy for the most part normally produces excellent accuracy in about any rifle you want to shoot it. I actually like Pyrodex to shoot.

That is some good shooting for open sights and all. I bet it kind of made you smile a little. :D

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

That group did make me smile--big. :D;) The rest were mediocre but I'm not beating myself up. [:@][&:][8D]

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Actually, Pyrodex made loading much easier. The APP is cleaner but makes it harder to stuff the sabots down for some reason.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Well, I just had to try my luck at 50 yards. I fired my last 5. The first didn't hit the target. It was with 100 grains Pyrodex and shot low for some reason. I boosted it up to 110 and shot a 2.5 inch group with the last 4.

Pretty good day!!!!!:)

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

outdoors, with the RS, You may want to pick up some regular shotgun CCI 209's and give them a go. They shoot best for me.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

They shoot best for me too. I do like the Triple Sevens the best because they shoot clean though. I couldn't afford the extra for them though, so I bought the regulars. I'm not gonna complain but they aren't super great. I had a hell of a time cleaning the breech plug just now.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

same here, the regular w209 winchester primers swell up when i shoot and then i need to use my tool to remove them. Fouling is pretty good also and gums up inside the bolt area. Never tried the triple 7 primers yet.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

I can't even see through the hole in the breech plug after shooting them. With every otherkind I can. I have to grab them and pull them out at least half the time.

Give the Triple 7s a try!

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

I think the APP POWDER is like triple 777 burns fast and sharp
I can handle 120 grains of pyrodex select in my inline but stop at 85 grains with triple 777 powders.
I never tried the APP powders I choose only the triple 777 powder only for the main reason it burns cleaner then real black

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

It nearly blew my arm off. I'm only 140 pounds so it killed. I could feel my arm going numb after it and it almost threw me off the chair. I'll stick to the Pyrodex for magnum loads. I'm not gonna shoot over 110 or so with the APP.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

:D:D:DGet yourself a limbsaver recoil pad and those mag loads will feel like you loaded butter down the bore. I know what you mean when your arm goes dumb lol. Thats a horrible feeling and does not make you feel comfortable when you load up the next shot. Just make sure when you scope it, if you ever do, to keep one hand across the barrel or else its gonna pop you between the eyes.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

haha I did put a scope on once and it popped me square between the eyes.[&:] I think it bled too. I'll never use those things again.

I am gonna buy one of those pads eventually. I love Limbsaver stuff.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

make sure you get the pad that screws on. Im not happy with that slipover stuff. the sleeves always rot off.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

yaeh I noticed that

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Nice group outdoorslover! You should have stopped while you were ahead.:DGoing to be hard to reproduce that group.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

How do you measure your groups anyway? I am going to have to start using your method. ;)

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Scope with high recoil rifles can be painful. Eye relief becomes a very important point with this. Also the way you address the rifle will make a big difference in recoil. Of course I am not bothered by recoil too much. I like at least 4" of eye relief in a scope. Have you considered a peep sight?

Then again, with the way your shooting.. just keep it up.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

I measure from center/center bullet hole. How do you do it, cascadedad?

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Since I usually can't see the center of the hole because it is gone, I measure from the ouside edge of one hole, to the inside edge of the other hole. In effect, center to center.

I was really asking Outdoorslover though. Also, what caliber bullet were you shooting?

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

.50 for the both of us. Not sure if that ?? was meant for me or outdoors.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Whichever.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

A wise man once made a post in the "100 yard accuracy" thread. :D

Sorry, I couldn't resist. Just funnin with ya. :D

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Tried Triple Seven and the 300 grain .44 caliber XTP bullets in my CVA Mag Hunter. Great accuracy at 50 yards. Will report fully on it when my range gets unflooded and i can shoot at 100 yards.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

FG

Actually I believe Cdad was asking about the size holes not the caliber of the gun, granted you both shoot 50 calibers, but outdoorslover is shooting an Omega so I would be my bet that he is shooting a .452 caliber bullet. In his post he indicates XTP's - but then he could have been shooting .430's also...

In any event the size of the hole is likely less than a 1/2 inch....

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

I never thought I would shoot a group less than an inch but I did it. I'm not so sure I'll accomplish it again. Someone who could accomplish that on a regular basis is truly gifted.

I have made some rather hasty assumptions about groups due to my lack of skills but now I know that such groups are POSSIBLE.

I am shooting a .50 caliber. I don't know what the exact size of the bullet is but it's the 300 grain XTP Mag.

I measure the distance between the two shots furthest from each other, edge to edge. Is there something wrong with that? I hope that's the correct method.

I could post the pic with something on the target--a quarter or a ruler or something. Let me know.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

There are very few times when the hole in a target will accurately indicate the diameter of the bullet. In a gross way - yes, but not so far as determining small differences in bullet diameters. Look around the edges of your holes in that cardboard and you will see the inward impressions around each. The diameter of the bullet that passed through that hole is somewhere between the diameter of the hole itself (which isn't round) and the diameter of those impressions around the hole (neither of which are round).

Which is also why edge to edge measured groups are inaccurate - especially when the measurer then subtracts a full bullet diameter. Dat ain't rite! The closest you can come in reporting a group is to measure the widest spread between hole centers (as best you can place those centers).

.504 conicals sometimes leave holes that might measure .35 and sometimes look as if cut with a razor edge at almost full diameter. Much depends on the target material, backstop, and speed and alloy of the bullet.

And that is the end of my holey dissertation, men.

Good group outdoorslover - but some of these days you'll think that it's too big. ;)

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

outdoorslover

Who cares about the measurement..... The picture says it all just fine. I am a simple person so pictures work fine for me. I am/was impressed but again what does that matter??? You are the one that should feel impressed... congrats..

Your XTP's are .452 unless you are shooting a 44 cal bullet - in that case they would be .430...

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Well well. I just measured it center to center, as close asI could get. The group is 1 inch that way. You happy now? :D

I posted a question on that subject a while ago and everyone told me that the correct way to measure is from edge to edge of the farthest shots. That's why I have been doing it that way.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Who cares about the measurement..... The picture says it all just fine. I am a simple person so pictures work fine for me. I am/was impressed but again what does that matter??? You are the one that should feel impressed... congrats..

I just want you to know I'm honest.

Thanks

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Ah wuz happy b4. :D

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

and I believe most matches DO utilize the edge to edge measure - the ctr to ctr thing is my opinion - and it's sort of like loading - it doesn't matter so much how you do it - it matters that you do it the same way each time. :D

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

There you go outdoors! Now just bring it down an inch and a half and it will be perfect.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

never doubted you for a second.. :D I measure center of hole to center of hole at the longest distance possible. But then again, I normally do not measure my groups anymore. Besides, my plastic caliber is a POS and I think I can do better with a ruler.

If the sabot you're shooting with the XTP is black in color, they are normally .452. If the sabot is green, then the bullet is a .430. If the sabot is orange, then they are .457-8

No matter what they are, that is some excellent shooting on your part.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

There you go outdoors! Now just bring it down an inch and a half and it will be perfect.

It shoots 3 inches high(maybe) with APP but 3 inches low with Pyrodex. That's why I haven't adjusted.

Thanks for tightening that group up Underclocked!:):D[8D];)[:-][&:]

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

The XTPs are black

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

I was watching a shooting comp on tv and the judges measure the outside of the 2 furthest holes and subtracted the bullet diam. Any of these will work center to center, edge to edge.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Great shooting.

RE: My bones are still rattling but I couldn't be happier!!!!!
 

Just for your future reference then, they are probably a .452 sabot and that is the size of the projectile you would order should you ever start buying in bulk to save money.