GPH results - So far.
 

I finally got out to the range this morning to shoot my Great Plains with the new 50 cal Hunter barrel. It was bright and sunny and 31 when I headed out to the range and the road in was frozen but looked like it had been a bit muddy from previous days of warmth. I'll get back to that later.

I only had 7 460gr No Excuses left and I wanted to try those out first. I decided to open up my new jug of 777 3F just because I like 3F powders in my sidelocks. I also decided to try 70 grains as a first load. I was not disapointed as the picture below shows.



It took 4 shots to get the 57 peep zeroed 1" high at 25 yards. I then moved to the 75 yard target and shotthe above3 shot group of .780" outside to outside. So if I take 1 caliber off of that it works out to .280" group (did I do the math right?). Man was I stoked. This is the first time I've really tried a peep sight and I was shocked how well it worked. The orange dot is 2" in diameter and was kind of hard to see at 75 yards but it must have been good enough. The left hole was the first shot, the other 2 were virtually the same hole. I did swab between shots and had a slight hang fire on the second one.

I also tried some Buffalo 285SSB's and found that the sabots must be a bit small for the GPH. They slid down easier than the NE's, too easy. With 90gr of powder they shot a group of about 14" at 75 yards. Need to work on those some more. That all took a bit over and hour and I was concerned about the fact that it was warming up and could get muddy so I packed up and started for home.

Back to the road goingout ofthe range. On my way out the temp had risen to about 45 and the road had turn into a mud hole. I almost made it to the top of the hill then got stuck in a rut and lost traction. I tried to back up and get another try when my rear tires jumped out of the rut and slid right off the road and into about 12 to 14 inches of snow. I was not getting out of that without help. I had to walk about a half mile to the nearest house to call someone to come pull me out. Since I am now typing this you cansee they were able to get me unstuck. He had chains on his 4x4 that I didn't have and he just barely got me out.

That was my adventure for the day. I think I will wait a little longer for the mud to dry up before going out again. Next time I should have my new chronograph that just shipped today.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Sweet!!

Thats just an awesome group, Dave.

Peep sight works great. Yes, by my calculations you are .28 on group size. Thats .375 MOA. Great shooting.

Glad you got out of the stuck place. Not fun getting stuck, but like you said, gave you some adventure today:D.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

WOW!!! nice shooting. It looks like you have a good rifle on your hands. As for mud.. that's half the fun. Glad you got out.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

3/8" at 100 is as good or better than the best group I've ever shot out of my scoped inlines. It rivals my 7mm RM which shoots under .5" all the time. And without magnification is awesome. If I had got this rifle to start out with I may never have bought an inline. The inline may become my backup gun now.

Next time out I'll have to try some more powder settings to see if it holds together at higher velocities. Based on my shooting results I'm estimating it around 1100 to 1150fps. That works ok for 100 yards or so but I was planning on setting this rifle up for longer range, out to 150 or longer if groups hold together. I'd like to get it up to around 1450 to 1500fps while maintaining accuracy. The NE's did go down very easily so I may need to get the .504 version instead of the .503. I also may need to add a wad over the powder. We'll see for sure whats going on when I get the chrono and some more bullets and range time.

So far I'm a happy camper.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Wow. Shooting like that with open sights, I'll say. My front sight covers the target at 50, never tried 75 for that very reason. Great shooting.
Chap Gleason Va

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Chap,
I'm using an apurature (spelling?) front sight in the Lyman 17. The hole looks to be about 6 to 8 inches at 100 yards. I think of it as putting a circle around the vitals and shoot. At 75 yards the 2" dot is just visible for me, I use it as a center point and place the inner and outer circles of the front sight and the peep sight all concentric to each other with the spot as the center. Seems to be working so far.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

You settled my decision on which traditional ML to buy. Several members on this forum recommended the GPH but I was still undecided until now.

Great group!!

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

The GPH seems to be a good rifle and the group speaks for itself. The only complaint I have is the shape to the butt. I'm not a small person at 6'3" and 280lbs so the stock has a tendency to poke me it I don't get it just right on my shoulder. It's better in the field than on the bench though.

Good luck if you do go that route. I'm sure you will enjoy it.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Wow Murphy! Guess you are a happy camper! Great shooting.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Dave,

I'm new to 777, but that just seems too slow. At 1150 fps, there is only 1351 ft-lbs at the muzzle. Blackpowder will do better than that I know. With 70 grains 3f Goex, I get 1490 ft-lbs using a 385 GP in the 26" sidekick barrel. On the lower end in the GPH, I think I would expect 1750 ft-lbs (perhaps 1310 fps) with70 grains3f 777.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

70 grains of Triple Se7en 3f and a 410 gr Hornady Conical with a wad is rated at 1383 fps. So a 460 gr would not be too far behind that. This information is taken out of Hodgdon's Basic Muzzleloading Manual. If that's any help.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Thats 1741 ft-lbs at the muzzle. The same muzzle energy for the 460 would be a little less than 1310 fps. One trick I use for predictingmuzzle energies for two projectiles using the same chargeis to take a ratio of the projectile weights. eg 460/410 = 1.12.

So the 460 weighs about 12% more. Now you can multiply the percentage increase in projectileweightby .45 to get the percentage increase in muzzleenergy, which is .45 x12% = 5.4%.

Then just multiply 1.054 x 1741 ft-lbs = 1835 ft lbs. After one has the muzzle energy, one can use a formula or a ballistics program to calculate the muzzle velocity. Given to the task of predicting velocity for the 460 in the barrel hodgdon tested the 410 with, I would predict a muzzle velocity of 1340 fps with 70 grains 3f 777.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

That's pretty interesting how you figured that Pglasgow... Then I remembered that Sabotloader shot some 70 gr T-7 3g 460 No Excuse over a chronograph and reported the results. 1390 fps. So you are right on the money there. I have to remember that trick.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

I figure that Sabotloader would do better than Hodgdon with the 410. I have found hodgdon's data somewhat conservative, but then every rifle is different and I suspect powders vary a little by batch (mostly in weight per volume)

Since you liked that one cayugad. Here is another trick. Say you want to increase or decrease the charge and want to know how that will affect muzzle velocity.This works especially well with black powder, but as works fairly well for subs.

Say Sabotloader gets1390 with 70 grains.How much with 80 grains? Just think of powder as energy. The muzzle energy per unit volume of powderwill depend on the projectile chosen. The greater the weight of the projectile the more energy one gets at the muzzle for a unit volume (grain) of powder.

One just takes the ratio of charge volumes. Or 80/70 = 1.143. There is 14.3 % more powder in the 80 grain charge. This means there is14.3 % more energy in an 80 grain charge. Since Sabotloader gets1974 ft-lbs at the muzzle with 70 grains, he should get 14.3% more muzzle energy with 80 grains or 1.143 * 1974 = 2256 ft lbs.

This corresponds to a muzzle velocity of 1486 fps in Sabotloader's rifle. I figure thats pretty close.

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

"I had to walk about a half mile to the nearest house to call someone to come pull me out. Since I am now typing this you cansee they were able to get me unstuck. He had chains on his 4x4 that I didn't have and he just barely got me out."

Half a mile in New Mexico is NOT BAD! You're li=ucky you weren't in Ojo Feliz........

RE: GPH results - So far.
 

Pglasgow,
You may be correct, I just went by the shooting results of about 1" high at 25 and dead on at 75 and threw in velocity numbers in my ballistics calculator till I came close to those results. It could very well be off since I didn't do an exact measurement of the bullet impacts. The good news is, my chonograph arrived today so I'll be ready the next time out to verify the velocities. If it is around 1300 to 1350 it will mean I can use an 8" PBR and shoot to 150 and be within +/-4" with that load and still have around 1300fpe at 150 and 1200fpe at 200. Drop at 200 would be around 28" so, if the distance is known, an elk would be big enough to shoot at that range by holding just about a foot over the top of the back.

Eldequello,
I'm not sure where Ojo Feliz is but I do think I was lucky. The house I used the phone at was the only house occupied within about 2 miles and I would have had to climb over at least 1 hill to reach the next nearest house.