new muzzleloader?
 

I was looking for a new muzzleloader for my daughter. Iam trying to find something that doesn't have much recoil at all. Does a .45 caliber have much less recoil then a .50 caliber? Also what is the least amount of powder you can shoot, and still be able to hunt out to 75 yards or so? Also do lighter bullets have less recoil? She is only 12 years old and small. I wanted the least amount of recoil for her at all. Any good recomendations for .45 caliber muzzleloaders?Any info would be great thanks!

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

Well whether the .45 will kick less I am not sure since I do not shoot one. I personally would get a .50 caliber and load it light. Maybe 80 grains of powder and a 200 grain Shockwave or XTP and that should be a 75 yard rifle. The other alternative is a traditional rifle in .50 caliber with 70 grains of powder and a patched roundball. This might be the extent of this load, but it would not have much recoil at all.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

Lighter bullets do have lesss recoil. I would still get a 50cal. There are bullets light enough. You can find a load with around 60gr depending on the rifle and projectile that will have plenty of power but not too much recoil. Are you thinking Traditional or Inline? A traditional 50cal with 70gr FFG and a PRB will be light on the recoil side. I personally think a 50cal will be fine with around 60-70 grains of powder and a light bullet below 350gr. A 45cal would be good to but it is hard to find accessories. When she grows older she might want more power and something to elk hunting with.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

I have a t/c encore, and shoot 90 grains of powder, and a 200 grain shockwave. I think that might kick a lil much for her. How much less powder could I use than that? Also what is the lightest bullet that they make? any help would be great!

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

.45 caliber muzzies are a pain in the butt. What kind of money were you willing to spend for your daughter's gun? That might help narrow down the selection. I wouldn't get anything weighing under 7lbs, either. I think lightweight guns are best reserved for experienced shooters who know how to handle heavy recoil. I'm thinking Omega w/ cut stock or buy the bantam walnut stock for your encore for her to use.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

Different rifles have different recoil amounts. For instance, I shoot a Wolverine LK-II with a 22" barrel. With 80 grains of Pyrodex and a 270 grain ballet, I really do not think it has recoil at all, but then I am not a small child either. I really do not know what to tell you then.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

I think I'm more jittery over the BOOM a muzzleloader makes than the actual recoil. I'm more leery of my short barreled White Mountain Carbine than my encore, simply because stuff is happening closer to your face, and it's louder. Just something to think about if a carbine is in consideration for this young lady.
I like Cayugad's suggestion of the buffalo ballet. Shockwaves don't do well (lack of expansion) with lighter powder charges.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

blondiez24

You know if they are legal in your state Hornady makes a 200 grain 40mm bullet both in a Shockwave (to fit a Thompson Center) and an XTP. If you purchase a box of Hornady 200 grain 40mm XTP's you woul also have to purchase some sabots.... Something like an MMP-40cal/50 cal.

At close range (75 yards and under) I really think 70/80 grains of T7 would work just fine - especially with the XTP - and that really might kick that much... it will still make a lot of noise.

I do not have an Encore - I use the Omega - how much does the Encore weigh?

There is a calculator for that at this site... but you do have to plug in some information....

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/rescources/calculators/php/recoil.htm?bw=260&bv=1750&cw=110&w=8

I do not know if this will help or not...

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

Interesting link, Sabotloader. My current load (240 grain xtp, 80gr triple 7), has 17lb of recoil. Compare that with the 150 gr triple 7 pellet load and a 250 grain shockwave: 41lbs of smack. You look at the the recoil table from http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm and 17lbs is about what you get from a .270, and 41lbs is a tad MORE than a 9lb 375 H&H gun will kick.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

Has she shot with the electronic headphones? Some cut back alot of noise and that boom doesnt seem so bad. Could also double up with ear plugs and headphones.

Arent those Buffalo Balletes 240 gr in .50 cal?

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

I would think about a traditonal 50cal roundball shooter with 70gr FFG. If it must be an inline try using 60-70gr FFG and a 200gr Projectile.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

im not sure what my encore weighs, but it does kick a lil bit with that load I killed a 9 point last year at 120 yards with that setup. I igured maybe dropping the powder charge quite abit, and shooting the same bullet might not be bad. can you tell alot of recoil difference between 90 grains of goex ffg compared to say 60 grains of goex ffg? Do they make any bullets lighter than 200 grain shockwaves? I shoot 200 grain shockwaves. I used to use hornady 240 xtp bullets, and I couldn't tell much if any differance between them.Does certain powders have less recoil than others? I hate for the scope to hit her in the face, and scare her from shooting a gun again! Thanks

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

I agree with you.. I would worry about the scope hitting her. Instead since the shooting will be close, get her a small Wolverine LK-II they have a short barrel and stock so the weight would not be too bad. They are very accurate. In fact you could shoot roundball out of them if you want. Just load 50 grains for starter. Then have her shoot and keep upping the charge. Have her tell you, when the recoil is too much. With open sights there is not the danger of the scope, and since she is shooting short range with young eyes, she should not have any problem working up some kind of a load.

The only reason I worry about getting too light a bullet is then you are loosing the benifit of the rifle. Another good rifle might be a White G Series Whitetail or Bison. They are a solid rifle, recoil is not bad, and they can shoot a conical bullet with deadly accuracy. I shoot 70 grains and a big conical, but I could just as well shoot 70 grains and a sabot projectile. Just another thought for you.

RE: new muzzleloader?
 

You will basically have to do one of two thing to lessen recoil.

1. light bullet , lighter charge

2. heavy bullet, even lighter charge

Basically recoil with be determined by the momentum of the bullet and powder. The momentum of the rifle will equal that. The lighter the rifle is, the greater the velocity the rifle recoils at. What you are trying to do, is lessen that velocity.

So it is also possible to lessen recoil by increasing the weight of the rifle. This would be no problem if the child is not required to carry it alot. But if you add weight try not to get the balance (justlike a teeter totter)behind the trigger guard.

Regarding the shockwave, it probably isn't the best choice for a light charge load. An xtp will probably give better expansion better serve the harvest. To 70 yards, a 70 grain charge ismore thansufficent to kill a deer cleanly with the 250 xtp , probably even 200 xtp.If you choose a heavier bullet, you can actually reduce charge, because muzzle energy, but more importantly, down range energy can still bemaintained on the lighter charge if a heavier bullet is chosen. An example of a load which will deliver in excess of 800 ft lbs to 75 yards is 50 grains 3F Goex and 385 GP conical (the recoil of this load is relatively mild, roughly 3/4 12 gauge shotgun's recoil).

A person is only going to get a hunting load's recoil down so much. I suggest you start her out on lighter loads than she will be hunting with. Have a good time at the range with her and increase charges in increments so that you can both observe and build her tolerance. It is very important she isn't bruised on the first shot. To take a hit after the confidence and enjoyment has risen and fear has subsided usually gets shrugged off. This thread suggests some low recoil loads which could be considered introductory. http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=1863067&mpage=1&key=daughter&amp ;#1863934

Good luck with it and congratulations on your new shootin and huntin partner.