54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

You guys know that I have a 54cal Renegade that my grandpa gave me and it is shooting good. I want to be a PRB shooter and it is doing that. I have had problems with this barrel like pitting (I think), and I think it could be bulged. When I was shooting conicals and when cleaningthere are two tighter spots closer to the muzzle and it gets real loose in a few big spots near the bottom. I am thinking about just getting a new Green Mountain roundball Barrel for it. I just dont like my barrel but it doese shoot ok. I would get a 54cal or 58cal. I did ballistics and the trajectory is not far apart between the two, the energy is not too far apart either. I know where to get stuff for a 58cal so that is not a big problem. I am almost thinking the 54cal since it will do the job, roundballs are cheaper, and it is easier to get stuff for. (but the 58cal is somewhat easy to). What do you think? I will use it for the Rocky mountains here in Colorado. (Elk, deer, some day moose). They will both do just fine on these animals. I know that if I start casting, Lee makes a mold for the 54cal to.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

The .54 caliber is much cheaper to shoot, and still has a lot of energy for taking game. Many people believe them to be the perfect caliber for large game such as deer on up. I've never shot an elk with a muzzleloader, but would not be too worried about doing it with a .54 caliber as long as I could get in close and place my shot. Although let me say, I have a real soft spot for the .58 caliber. If you never shot one, they are really something to shoot...

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

I have had both and used both I ended up with the 54 it took deer elk and bear for me with out any problems it is my preferance because it has the best trajectory a matter of twist available and handelable recoil. Lee

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

For elk and moose, using a PRB, I'd definitely prefer the .58. The .54 will do as well, but the .58 will provide a little more of a margin for hard to kill game.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

The 58 caliber Green Mountainis my first choice. Prior to purchasing it three years ago, I never envisioned it to beas accurate as most inlines at 100 yards. That outstanding accuracy can be achieved using either the 280 Buffalo roundball or the 405 Buffalo Ballet HP. I have never tried the 500+grain Buffalo Bullet -- but I bet it wouldn't disappoint me.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Either way it will be a Green Mountain Slow Twist Barrel. I am thinking that maybe the 58cal would be worth it in the long run. If a 100yd shot comes up on a big bull and I couldn't get any closer I think I would wan't that 58cal over the 54cal. I am not the type of person who shoots 50+ shots every week. I would like to start getting to the range more and shooting 20-30 shots a week though. I guess I would still have my 54cal barrel! I think I will go with the 58cal. Probably get it in the summer.

Cayugad, What do you mean you have never been elk hunting? I have been with my rifle and I can't wait to go with my muzzleloader!!! You need to get over to my neck of the woods and go on a guided elk hunt. I am sure you can find some good guides!!! Let me know when you decide to come to CO. Send me a PM and I will help you find a good unit to hunt.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

I've never elk hunted with a muzzleloader. In my youth I traveled quite a lot hunting elk, moose, bear, even mule deer but always with center fire rifles. When I got into the muzzleloader end of my hunting, I stayed pretty grounded and hunted lots of deer and small game but have yet to make it out west again for elk. I would like a guided hunt where I go in on horse back and they do all the work. :D

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

I have the 58, and like it. The price of shooting both isn't that much different. I'd rather have too much gun, than not enough.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

I still don't know for sure. It is a tough choice. The 58cal might be worth it.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

They will both do the job, I just like to be able to make the 150 yd shot if I have to and the 54 I have has a 35.5 inch barrel and groups real tight it likes a max load and that helps too. Lee

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Personally SharpShooter.. if I lived where you did, I would go with the .58 caliber. I am not saying that the .54 caliber would not take care of your business, but when hunting large animals, I like to push as much lead into them as I can. The .54 caliber roundball I cast weights 224 grains. The .58 roundball is 284 grains. That means your pushing 25% more lead down range. Also these Green Mountian Barrels you're looking at, I shoot 100 grains, but I can push it to actually 115 grains and still keep accuracy. There just is no need for me to shoot that large of a charge at a white tail. The 100 grain Goex 2f charge is plenty.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Sharpshooter,

I don't see what harm it would do to get either .58 or .54 caliber GMB. If I got a new one, for me, I think I would like the .58 better. But you know, considering the rifle is a gift from your granddad, and it is shooting well, I would be tempted to leave it just like it is, (like my .50 cal hawken my dad gave me). Taking an elk or deer with the rifle your grandfather hunted with sounds really cool to me.

My hawken has similar problems with looseness towards the breech. I found that a meal filler really boosted the velocities without hurting accuracy.Like your .54, it still shoots very well inspite of the pitting.

Good luck with your decision.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Lee, What is your load?

I know a guy on another forum who loads his GM with 120gr FFG KIK and it produces really good accuracy. A load like that would really be good for Colorado.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Another vote for the .58 Gm bbl. I load mine with PRB and 120grs Pyrodex RS. I am going to switch to real black powder after this can is gone though.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

I have noticed alot of you guys like the 58 caliber. Please note I am not knocking the 58 caliber.

I would like to make a point and ask a simple question. I cast a 525 grain 50 caliber bullet, from an RCBS adjustable mold. I load 120 grains of 3F blackpowder in a Knight MK 85 rifle(1650 fps). The rifle wears a Williams target peep sight. I can consistently shoot 2 inch or less groups at 100 yards, and have shot deer and elk to 150 yards.

What possible advantage would a 58 caliber rifle have over this scenario? I do not feel any roundball load should be shot at 150 yards at an elk, or am I wrong? I realize that the 58 caliber would leave a bigger hole, but I can not believe 50 caliber hole from a 525 grain bullet is not big enough.

I will admit I have only shot a "Big Boar" TC a few times, so I really have no experience with the 58. But I sure am not above buying one and trying it, if you guys think I should(please tell me I should). I will also admit that my MK 85 kicks like a mule. The stipple on the bolt cuts the webbing between my thumb and forefinger every time I shoot it. But it is God awful medicine for an elk or whitetail. Tom.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Buy your self two green mountain barrels a 54and a 58 you can never have to many guns ask cayugad.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

I'd have to say that your load is "some" medicine indeed :D. Wow. As far as advantage I would say there would be none. But then, there is little if any advantage with a bow, but many find it rewarding. So some want to use roundball.

Alot of bison fell to 45-70-500. Your load is 50-120-525 and in terms of a 2f BP conversion its 50-132-525. There was a Sharps rifle made in 50-140 and I think it shot a 525 grain bullet. It came a little late to kill many bison. In any event, this rifle weighed 20 lbs so probably had half the recoilyou've been experiencing. Thought some might be interested in the ballistics of your load.

Pretty amazing thump at 150 yards.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Head1,

Good God, I just calculated the recoil of your load (assuming 8.5 lb rifle) and got 76.3 ft-lbs. Almost 4 times a 12 guage clays load. You've been eating your Wheaties!:D The 50-140 sharps using the same bullet weight and charge would be around 32.4 ft-lbs or around 1.5 times the 12 guage load.

RE: 54cal Roundball vs 58cal Roundball
 

Pglasqow-As I stated, the load kills at both ends. It is not the load that I shoot every day in the rifle. However it is the load that I hunt with. I have shot two elk with this load. Neither elk went over 30 yards. You could tell that they were truly sick when the bullet hit them. Both were good behind the shoulder shots. It brings the blood to my hand about every time I shoot it. I also would not recommend the load to anyone, I believe I am overloading the rifle. It definitely kicks considerably harder than my 45-70's. I cast a 405 grain bullet for it. Thanks for your stats. I knew the load was stout, but truly did not realize it was that stout. The velocity was chronographed around one foot from the end of the barrel. I have a 45-70 load(405) grain that comes out at 1850 fps. It is also a very stout load. My normal load for the 45-70 comes out about 1350 fps. Tom.