Mike Hill

I have been reading the Forums and am wondering do the 209 primers really make a difference in accuracy. Can I sight in with CCI and switch to Winchester latter or other primers.
If so how much and does powder charge (meaning caps have no difference with X amount of powder or less ,or more) come into play.
Just want to get everyones views.
Also this being asked are all caps equal as far as performance and being clean. Or do some caps stand out from the others. Mike

Mike AR

I've always hunted with the old Hawkens with #11 caps and roundballs so my experience with 209 primers is limited. I bought my first in-line (Traditions Pursuit) last November and got some Remington 209's since they were advertised as "clean burning".(I had trouble with the gun staying closed and sent it back toTraditions). Anyway,with the Rem 209'sI had lots ofhard crudbuilduparound the nipple and fouling in the receiver area only after a couple of shots. If Win or CCI or any of the other brands are any dirtier, I wouldn't want to use them. However in all fairness, the fouling problem probably had a lot to do with the gun not having a good tight fit against the firing pin face plate but I'm not sure.Any thoughts or opinions?
Mike

Mike AR

Sorry, I may have strayed a little from your original question but as far as accuracy goes, my gun with the Rem 209's shot really well right out of the box using a variety of loose Pyrodex RScharges. Couldn't ask for much better accuracy and don't know myself if other brands of primers have any effect or not. Would be interesting to know if anyone else has noticed a difference.

MLKeith

I haven't compared 209 primers of different makes however I did find a noticable difference in velocity using a 209 Winchester vs a .25ACP conversion with small rifle primers. I believe the more powerful standard 209 added to the velocity and I have a source that also backs this up. I believe that primers of different power will affect the final velocity so the newer "made for black powder" primers may shoot a little slower than the old standard shotgun 209 primers. Be careful when selecting primers as some of the ones packaged for black powder are just standard shotgun primers repackaged. Some are actually reduced power primers. RWS now makes a specific black powder 209 primer but I cannot find them anywhere.

sabotloader

Mike Hill

Mike I do believe that primers can effect accuracy. The amount if heat applied to the charge will begin the burning of the powder. The more fire the a larger amount of powder ignited - the faster the spike occurs. There is a difference in velocity from very hot 209's down to cool 209's.
If you change from one brand of 209 to a different brand but they are in about the same heat range the accuracy should not suffer.

Just my 2 bits again

cayugad

Any time you change any part of your loading or shooting procedure, there is a chance that it can effect the accuracy of the projectile. It might be to only a short degree, but it can. I suggest find a primer that works for you and your rifle, and is in your price range and stick with it. I for instance really like the new Remington Kleenbore Primers because I shoot loose powder 99% of the time and the cooler primer seems to be just the ticket. If I shoot pellets I then use Winchester W209 primers. They have just a little more fire and seem to make the pellets ignite andbehave better. Therefore they effect accuracy.

lemoyne

They can affect accuracy in several ways,Using myself as an example but knowing other people have experanced the same.
My system one 54 cal. barrel loads smooth and ease works well with #11 or musket cap but when I got the conversion to 209 the groups openned right upthis gun shoots 4.5 inch groups @ 200yd with musket caps with 209 some group but some will be a foot away.I was using 777 aty the time it has a higher ignition temp. and I think it was moving the sabot some befor the powder ignited,to check I loaded with out powder and measured the location of the bullet and sabot, when I fire 209 it moved an inch. The 50 cal barrel for that gun has the same problem. My new Omega is tighter and I am using APP which is the easiest of all except black to ignite and it will shoot sub one inch groups with winchester 209's.
It is one of those things where a lot of other factors can change it. Lee

Mike AR

Has anyone noticed any significantfouling (breech plug and receiver area) differences between Remington Kleenbore 209's and other brands?

cayugad

When shooting loose Triple Se7en I think using the Remington Kleenbore Primers made the crud ring "softer" but it still had to be removed. I could feel it only in my Wolverine LK-II. In the Black Diamond XR if there was a crud ring it was not as large.

Mike AR

When I bought my new in-line and shot it a fewtimes and saw the crud ring, I considered what I was seeing tobe excessive fouling, but from the sound of things, it must be pretty normal. I just hadn't anticipated that. Muzzleloaders will be muzzleloaders I guess.