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-   -   American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real? (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/black-powder/124248-american-pioneer-powder-real.html)

Strutter 12-08-2005 04:22 PM

American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
I bet this has been talked about before but I can't get the search function to work and I am curiousif this powder is as clean shooting as advertised. Read where it was shot over 5000 times without having to clean the gun. Does it shoot well and is it equal to pyro and goex? What's thescoop on it?

Thanks,
Rob

Sharp Shooter 12-08-2005 04:48 PM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
Pyrodex and Goex are more dirty. If you want clean go with Triple se7en or go with Black Mag 3.

cayugad 12-08-2005 05:18 PM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
American Pioneer Powder is very clean burning. It leaves a gray dust in the barrel when used. Pinnacle is another very clean burning powder. Whether you can shoot 50 or 5000shots without swabbing or cleaning is a mute point because at the end of the day you still have to clean the rifle. Although with Pinnacle and American Pioneer Powder, it will usually clean up in about five patches.

Triple Se7en is another clean burning powder. It is user friendly also. There are issues with crud rings in some inline rifles, but Triple Se7en really isa good powder.

I've never used Black Mag3.

Hookset 12-08-2005 05:26 PM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
i used to shoot pyrodex. started shooting APP last fall. it is much cleaner. i still run a patch thru between shots just to be sure. it is remarkably cleaner.
i use the the 3f. the 2f is like gravel, just didn't have confidence in it's consistency (load wise).
as far as power, i've never chrono'd APP or pyro. i do know my bullets group the same with 90 grains APP or 90 grains pyro.

i believe powerbelt bullets were meant for this powder. you do not want to use a pre-lubed bullet. it will increase your fouling (defeats purpose of clean burning powder). i have shot pre-lubed bullets like maxi-hunters and hornady great plains bullets with good accuracy. the lubing just fouls the barrel more (still less fouling than pyro).

i do question it's effectiveness in wet weather. i've heard the new premium grade of APP called Shockey's Gold is more moisture resistent (i hunt in texas, so this will be a good thing). i will try this after i shoot up my last can.

hope this helps,


hookset

diaedy 12-08-2005 06:20 PM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
One of the cleanest burning is goex pinnicle. Burns xtra clean ,at least for me, as long as your not usuing bore butter or equivilent. Does not like solvents either. Very little swabbing between shots if any for 30 40 shots straight shooting
Rising Sun

eldeguello 12-10-2005 09:08 AM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 

ORIGINAL: diaedy

One of the cleanest burning is goex pinnicle. Burns xtra clean ,at least for me, as long as your not usuing bore butter or equivilent. Does not like solvents either. Very little swabbing between shots if any for 30 40 shots straight shooting Rising Sun
Aren't APP and Pinnacle the same powder? I have heard that APP makes Pinnacle for GOEX...

GOEX did have their own BP substitute called ClearShot. It worked very well in all respects but one-it gave very low velocities, especially in FFg granulation. Th FFFg was not so bad, but it took 140 grains of ClearShot FFFg to give me the same MV with .50 Maxiballs that I used to get with 120 grains of Curtis & Harvey Musket powder (BP) with the same bullet. (However, ClearShot was the only BP substitute I have tried that was totally non-corrosive. I fired an old clunker ten times, no swabbing between shots,with ClearShotone fall, and then left it sitting in the corner of a room uncleaned for two weeks here in southern PA. At the end of the two weeks, I cleaned it, and there was no hint of rust or corrosion ion the bore of that rifle.

Sharp Shooter 12-10-2005 09:13 AM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
I heard that Black Mag 3 is the cleanist.

cayugad 12-10-2005 09:28 AM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 

ORIGINAL: eldeguello

Aren't APP and Piunnacle the same powder? I have heard that APP makes Pinnacle for GOEX...

GOEX did have their own BP substitute called ClearShot. It worked very well in all respects but one-it gave very low velocities, especially in FFg granulation. Th FFFg was not so bad, but it took 140 grains of ClearShot FFFg to give me the same MV with .50 Maxiballs that I used to get with 120 grains of Curtis & Harvey Musket powder (BP) with the same bullet. (However, ClearShot was the only BP substitute I have tried that was totally non-corrosive. I fired an old clunker ten times, no swabbing between shots,with ClearShotone fall, and then left it sitting in the corner of a room uncleaned for two weeks here in southern PA. At the end of the two weeks, I cleaned it, and there was no hint of rust or corrosion ion the bore of that rifle.
I don't think the Pinnacle and APP are the same. Pinnacle 3f is jet black in color and a nice fine grain. It shoots light projectiles and roundballs excellent. The heavy conicals for some reason it does not like in my rifles. The APP is gray colored and not as fine a grain and the Pinnacle. Of course they could have dyed the powder.

I did send Goex and APP a e-mail with this same question but they did not feel the need to answer me.. Oh well.

As for clean up, this picture tells it all. I had shot my Knight Wolverine 12 times in a row shooting, without swabbing, using240 grain T/C Mag Express XTP (and then ran out) and decided to swab the barrel and change projectiles. This picture shows the five patches I ran through the barrel. The red is Rusty Duck Black Off - Black Powder solvent.




I really like the powder. I just hate the price. I can get two pound of Goex Black Powder for the cost of one pound of Pinnacle.

Triple Se7en 12-10-2005 10:40 AM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
The only difference between APP and Pinnacle is granule color dye.

In Blackpowder Hunting Magazine last edition, APP was rated slowest of all substitute powder & middle of the road for accuracy.

diaedy 12-10-2005 03:40 PM

RE: American Pioneer Powder: Is it for real?
 
http://www.goexpowder.com/product-ezload.html


There is an article about this powder on this site. I paid 21.00 a lb for the 3 lbs I bought. I've been shooting 80 grains(weighed) in my hard to clean 50 cal. rolling block with 1/24 twist. I got the( no excuses bullets) from an address here on this site. Think they are 465 grain. Clean up is not bad and still have an excellent group. Maybe the twist, I do not know yet. It is a very clean powder with hardly any swabbing but I do just to check. Clean pathches like the ones shown.


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