skeeter 7MM

Our group was discussing what appears to be a change in the peak rut in this province(well at least the area we hunt). Previously the first week of rifle (middle sept) was peak rut, however the the past 2 years it has happened a week or two prior(1st of sept). My question first of all is - has anybody noticed a similar trend? Secondly a theory we have discussed is warmer winter/springs, less snow in the spring to melt off & warmer summers with less moisture may possibly be forcing or allowing if you will the first peak rut to pushed up a few weeks. Could this have any relevance?

Pressure is the same for hunting, food sources and habitat is similar.

The pop. numbers for elk has exloded in this part of the province though and I think this may have an effect as well (the rest all think I should stick to deer and my rut theories). Is this a possibilty?

So I come to those with more knowledge than I, any merit to these theories or anybody noticed similar things happening? Any input?

BTW the biologist or elk know alls in this province flat out deny any changes and still peg the peak mid sept. but the hunter and CO's all agree it just ain't the same as a few years ago.

Thanks

bigbulls

In my limited ammount of time that I have hunted before, during, and after the rut I have noticed the same thing as you. I think the weather does has a good deal to do with it. IMO it changes with the ammount of moisture in the area. The more wide spread the moisture the less concentrated the elk are around known watering spots and the less competition from other bulls. The cows are also less concentrated which leads to less estrous in the air to exciet the bulls.



Here are two back to back years with very different ruts.

Two years ago the rut was getting into full swing opening day (last weekend in August) and continued all through September. It stayed strong the entire month of September then began to wind down. There were so many bulls bugeling I didn't know which way to go at times. It was very dry this year and I believe the elk were much more concentrated around watering areas, which is where we hunt, and this led a higher concentration of elk and ultimately a earlier and longer lasting rut because of the added competition and hot cows in the area.

Last year The rut really didn't get started until the last week of September and went through mid October. It never really did get going hard though. I had a hard time getting a rise out of anything until the last week of September. This year there was a good ammount of rain which I believe to have spread out the elk more and there was not as much competition from numerous bulls nor as many cows around to get the bulls as excited leading to a more "relaxed" rut.

elknut1

skeeter
Your findings could certainly be true! Hard to say though from here in Idaho??
As far as our rut goes, it's pretty much the same as usual. It's possible for an early rut with the older more mature cows, it can happen the last week of Aug. to the first week in Sept. it's not the peak rut though. The peak rut or when the majority of cows come into heat is around the 17th to end of Sept. here, and then two more can follow.
But other than that, it all seems pretty normal!! elknut1

noway

I would say it has been getting later here in Idaho or maybe what we are seeing here on Oct 15th for the start of rifle is the second rut.
I hunt about 15 miles from where Elknut hunts and he hunts archery and I hunt rifle.
Archery is in Sept and rifle starts Oct. 15.
I think the second rut must start around Oct. 15 th and some years it is stronger than others.
Three years ago and two years ago they were rutting very vocally on Oct. 15th.
Last year they did not seem to be as vocal on Oct 15th even though the bulls were still responding to the cow calls. I called in two five points in two successive days before the sun came up.
We were tired that night after packing those two bulls up the hill the second day.

Hiawatha

I find this kind of unfortunate in a way because these so called biologists and government people sit in their little cubical in the office and think that they know whats really going on. Meanwhile the hunters are out there actually experiencing it rather than just sitting back and estimating when the rut is happening. On a september evening we can walk out of the house and listen to hear the bulls screaming at night out in the farmland. The bulls seem to be bugling, scraping up, wallowing more early than normal. So Skeeter I agree it seems to be happening ahead of schedule. As for why this is happening is difficult to lay a finger on. I will go along with a few of your theories, the easy winters may have something to do with it. Also remember these last 2 years end of Aug-Middle Sept were very very wet. We got a pile of rain in those few weeks. It may be possible that the sudden weather change from being dry all summer turned them on a little early. I am not sure if where you hunt also got this moisture or not. Another theory of mine is that we haven't had those cool mornings where it dips down below freezing. The elk seasons have recently been fairly warm. I have found that on a cold night the bulls will scream all night long, if you choose to stay up and listen to them. In my area it seems that by the opener of rifle elk the bulls are slowing down and the rut is finishing up. This was one of the reasons I purchased a bow, I seem to get them talking pretty good in the earlier archery season. But whatever this fall brings I will be hunting them Aug 23 until I tag out or the end of Sept rolls around.

txhunter58

There have been several interesting discussions on this topic in the TR Tips section including: http://forum.hunting.net/asppg/tm.asp?m=358222 He makes the distiction between the peak BREEDING time and the peak BUGLING time, which aren't neccessarily the same. I suspect that the peak breeding times in your area don't vary that much from year to year. The differences in the peak bugling time (what I suspect you are calling the peak of the rut) is harder to explain, and I supect is due to lots of factors, some of which are: WEATHER (probably most important), increasing elk populations, variations is hunting pressure, etc.

Dirt2

In defense of wildlife biologists, they are waiting for all the facts to come in. Science is by nature rather conservative. Now, if you have ten years in a row where the rut kicks off earlier, then I'm reasonably sure the biologists will get on board. Remember that something like the observations of a single hunter are highly subjective, and prone to wild swings in results due to just random chance.

That said, one scientific rationale that might be advanced is that strong, healthy animals are documented to breed earlier than weaker specimens. If those Canadian winters are getting milder, that would lead to healthier critters since northern winters can be so brutal. A growing herd is probably a healthy herd, so it all fits. However, I'd still be very cautious about selling out to a conclusion on only two years of anecdotal information. In other words, I wouldn't change my hunting plans for the year to come just yet. Just my opinion.

elknut1

If you go to T/R.s site and read on you'll find that peak breeding is peak rut. Peak rut without a doubt is peak bugling time. Staging/Displaying time running a close second!!
elknut1

skeeter 7MM

Thanks guys for the input. I guess one can't predict just hunt and hope it all works out. I know I will be looking at the first week of sept(last week of archery) to be out in the woods bugling my lips off and if they don't respond I can only hope 2 weeks later it will be back to the norm for rifle, bugle and here he comes!

Hiawatha,

We hunt 48 and 56. I believe your in 49, right? So very similar in both elk, habitat and yes the moisture. However I don't remember to many elk season were the roads weren't muddy/rutted up and I didn't need my rain suit..to me this area and elk season means wet weather. 2 years ago was an exception to the heat I remember shingling the barn were we have camp with no shirt b/c it was +30, that week was very warm and hunting was hard. Last fall we never had the hard frost but on the same token at least I found the weather to be pretty typical(rain, sun and minimal wind). Have to wait see what 04' brings, can't wait!!!

Hiawatha

Skeeter, I am in south east of pocupine plain so i am in 48 also. The elk season may have always been a time for moisture to accumulate but in my opinion these last 2 years have been more than usual. I am just going by the problems we have had harvesting the last 2 years. Rain would come, then when the grain was just about dry the rain would hit again. In 2002 it ended up that we didn't get a kernal in the bin. The moisutre just kept coming and all the crop was left out over winter for the elk to feast on. The fellows that hunt on my place in the archery season ended up leaving their camper here and coming back for it a week later. They have been coming up for 6 years now i believe, and they have never had a problem traveling the back roads with the camper before. But if this really has any effect who can say. Just talking to the local hunters around my boss especially, a great hunter for several years, the feeling from most is that the elk are rutting earlier every year here. So maybe this trend has dates back further than we think, but anything you hear at a local coffee shop should be taken with a grain of salt.