Need some help
 

Is there any honest outfitters out there. When you pay for a bow hunt for $4.500 and your tag. The outfitters don't wear camo and he sit next to me. I ask him do you think I should be 20 yards from you. I feel he was a rifle hunter or don't want no one shoot his elk.

Never hired an outfitter. You can bow hunt elk on your own in any western state for less than $4500.

OK let me ask you this, HOW Much research did you do on HIM before you hired him
DID you ask HOW he sets you up?
a guided hunt, sadly doesn't mean a quality hunt, at ANY price range

its up to YOU to ask and get answers you want and then CONTACT previous hunters from them both successful and NOT
and from a few yrs back to present
lack of doing your part, is YOUR fault

but YES lots of GOOD outfitters out there if you work to find one

My suggestion is THIS
maybe rather than Hiring an outfitter
go hunt yourself

been doing DIY hunts across the USA for 20+ yrs, and never had a BAD one yet
I make the added effort to do a LOT of home work

not sure why folks rather anti up and pay a guy to sit with them to hunt?
sounds like cheating to me?
or lack of willingness to do some honest hunting!

might as well just go to a high fence and shoot a pen raised critter? , if all your after is a kill?

Sorry
but hunting isn't that hard if you TRY to lean and be good at it!
like all things in Life, you get out of them what you put into them!

Hiring an outfitter is tough. Reviews and referrals are critical.

So helpful! And without really knowing why he chose to hire an outfitter.

Turk: tell us more about your hunt. Where did you hunt, and did you see elk or have any shot opportunities? Did they pack you in on horses, or was it private land etc. Public vs private land hunting can be a lot different. No, it doesn't sound right if the outfitter was not dressed in camo, and while different people have luck with different strategies, generally the outfitter will stay with you until you locate some elk, then he will separate from you, with you getting closer to the elk and him trying to call a bull in for you.

Do you want to try another outfitter in the future or has this soured you on that avenue. As stated, there are plenty of do it yourself opportunities in the west, and some people online can be very helpful in helping you figure out where to start.

Yes it is helpful. He asked about honest outfitters and I don't know any because I've never hired one. But for the price he's quoting he can do a DIY hunt in any state for less $$$ and have as good or better of a chance of getting an elk than in the circumstance he describes.

If you don't like my comments, don't read them. After all, nobody makes you and the comment wasn't directed to you in the first place was it?

Play nice everyone.

Turk, I've never used an outfitter. But if I ever do, I think doing allot of research is a good idea before paying $$$$. Get references of others who have used them. Even references from other unsuccesful hunters. Do your research. A good guide will have faithful and loyal clients. Also, a good guide will still get *mostly* positive reviews from unsuccesful hunters as well. Because the people will see how hard they work and how committed they are to the hunt. You can't guarantee a kill, but a good guide will put the effort in to do the best they can.
-Jake

I was in Colorado, on private land walk in We heard bull about 200 yards and he didn't want to go no closer. I don't no why because the bull did not come. The outfitter is paying 30 thousand to lease the private land. I think he get all the client he can and tell them there elk there and don't want no one to shoot them.

Guided Hunts or DIY Hunts?
 

I would like to comment on mrbb's position on guided hunts as opposed to DIY hunts. He makes some excellent suggestions concerning the need to do thorough, in-depth research before booking an outfitter or guide. And DIY hunts can offer a sense of satisfaction and achievement that can be missing on guided hunts. However, some of the comments on guided hunts were troubling. These comments included:

- "not sure why folks rather ante up and pay a guy to sit with them to hunt?"
- "sounds like cheating to me?"
- "or lack of willingness to do some honest hunting!"
- "might as well just go to a high fence and shoot a pen raised critter? , if all
you are after is a kill?"

I have been hunting big game for over forty years and have taken over seventy animals in North America, Canada, Africa, and New Zealand on both guided and DIY hunts. Some of my guided hunts have been far more difficult and challenging than DIY hunts: lung busting climbs at 6,000-8,000 foot elevations for mountain sheep and goats, overnights on freezing mountain tops with just a space blanket for shelter, 10 hours straight of tracking through thorn brush for cape buffalo, etc.

There are some excellent reasons for hiring guides and outfitters. If you are a non-resident and want to hunt Dall or Stone sheep, mountain caribou, woodland caribou, grizzly, and many more species, by law you must be accompanied by a guide. This is especially true across most of Canada, and Africa. Even in the U.S., Wyoming, for example, requires non residents to have a guide when hunting in designated wilderness areas even when hunting common species such as deer or elk. If you insist only on DIY, you will be foregoing the opportunity to hunt many species and many prime hunting areas.

Further, guided hunting offers some excellent learning experiences. Beginners can often gain enough hunting knowledge through reading, local experience, the internet, etc. to be successful on species like whitetails and antelope. But on many other species it is difficult to pre-scout hunt areas and learn game habits if you live a thousand miles away. In these cases, going on a hunt with a competent guide will allow you to watch, ask questions and learn firsthand from an expert with years of experience. After you have such a hunt under your belt you will be in much better position for a successful DIY.

Guided hunts may have other attractions. Often they are held on private land or exclusive use areas. Strict harvest practices can yield a much higher quality experience without competition from mobs of "if it's brown it's down" hunters. Also often guides have horses and pack animals to access remote areas and pack out your game. If you are on a DIY hunt, you'd better think twice before you drop that 700 pound elk several miles from where you can get to it with a truck or atv. Back packing game in road less terrain is an experience only for the extremely fit.

In summary, by all means consider DIY hunts; but if you can afford them, don't write off guided hunts. They are definitely not cheating, dishonest, or akin to hunting a high fenced, pen raised critter.

Great post and a side of the issue seldom talked about. You made some compelling observations that could be of interest to many people. Thank you for posting.

Hard to really say about your hunt, but if you were paying $4500 to hunt private land and were in to elk, but never closer than 200 yards, sounds like something was amiss. There can be some legitimate reasons why someone wouldn't want to move in toward a bull, but combine that with no camo and not getting you set up closer to the bull than he was, something is fishy. If you feel strongly enough about it you should contact the outfitters association and tell them what happened and see what they have to say.

The only reason I got a outfitter is because I live in Illinois and it's hard to scout big game by myself when you don't know where to go. I wished I had gotten some tips while hunting elk.

Bernie

The only reason I got an outfitter is because I live in Illinois. Its hard to hunt big game when you don't know where to go. I wished the outfitter would of gave me some tips on hunting elk.

I live in PA, and have done self guided hunts all across the USA and I don't feel any were a BAD hunt
you don't have to live close by to scout, all the more so in todays modern world
between google earth and all the info on the world wide wed, the ability to contact folks in areas you hunt(wardens, DCNR< locals, folks on forums and so on)
its really NOT needed , all the more so if you know how to read sign
I personally tend to call a DIY hunt a learning experience and a challenge
I use the first day or two to be my in field scouting, as well as hunting, and fine tune from there
its NOT honestly all that hard to do if you put in the effort
the harder part might be recovering the game when its an elk , if your all alone!
BUT many places out west offer recover service's
, or drop off camps, or??
the options today are almost endless
the real key to anything done right is doing YOUR part ALL you can
yes there can always be BAD experiences and folks that scam you
But again, the more you do to weed them out, asking right questions and research on them, the better off you are

you cannot just HIRE a outfitter and HOPE Its going to work out
and NEVER just take 2-3 peoples word as a reference
dig deeper, outfitters loose help as often as any business, so from one yr having GREAT guides, the next eh can have BAD one's

the key is asking, HOW Long the guides have worked for SAME outfitter, and like wise questions

again, you get what you put into things MOST times

but a guide isn't needed if your willing to do the work!

If you want a more easy hunt, then an outfitter can SOMETIMES offer that, with the right one, that is
other wise, you can be just spending a lot of extra cash for NOTHING!

Well, I was raised in CO but have hunted in CO, WY, MT, UT, NE, KS, TX, AL, FL, NC, VA, PA, NH, CA and HI. I have never paid an outfitter a thin dime. I've taken whitetails, mulies, blacktails, elk, pronghorn, hogs, black bear, mountain goat, bighorn sheep, bison and alligator all on my own without the services of a guide so it can be done.

Sounds like you need to develop some friends that elk hunt. You are not much farther from Colorado/Wyoming/Montana than I am here in Texas, but it is a Long drive by yourself. You can get lots of good info online, but there is nothing like having someone to share the experience with. Find a shooting range in your area and try to hook up with some guys that elk hunt. Or meet them at church, work, you get the idea. Or introduce a niece or nephew to hunting. Always better to have 2 strong backs to haul an elk out. My whole family hunts so that makes it easier.


Colorado has the easiest tags to obtain, but has the most hunters and it can be hard for a newbie to figure out where to go to find elk away from the crowds. Can be done, but easier if you hook up with someone who has been there before. Montana is essentially an OTC state, so you can get a tag every year, and it has way less hunters, but you have to find an area that is not thick with wolves.


Another idea would be a trespass hunt in Colorado. They can be had for $1500-2500 and you don't have to compete with lots of hunters but it is essentially a DIY hunt. Here is one that has a good rep: http://www.rockymountainhunting.com/index.html Never hunted with them but hear good things

I've been pretty lucky so far with outfitters. From what I've found sometimes the most expensive isn't always the best. There are many reputable outfitters out there but there are also some sleazy outfits. There are a couple good sources for good outfitters that I know of. One is Cabela's TAGS and the other is the NAHC outfitter list.
But even these are not 100%. You need to get references, lots of them. Even talk to the game commission in that state and see if there are any bad reports on an outfitter you're interested in. And if its a bowhunt its best to get an outfitter that has bowhunting success.
If you decide on a DIY hunt you need to plan several extra days just for scouting the area.

You should also consider going on a cow hunt to get your feet wet. The link I posted has a $900 cow hunt listed. You could learn the ranch and think about hunting a bull in the future. I have 90% as much fun hunting a cow as I do a bull. Especially when you hunt muzzleloader or 1st rifle seasons when they are still rutting. And you learn a lot without dropping a lot of coin. The tag is over $200 cheaper too.

Also, do you have anything to swap? There are some big whitetails in Ill. Do you have a spot you can take someone? If so, you could do a swap hunt. I have done swaps with a lot of luck from mule deer to elk, to moose, to Alaskan fishing.

That is a pretty penny to pay someone that loves to be outdoors just as much as you do. lol. Where im from we hire good outfitters for a 12pack and half the kills to hunt on their land. :happy0001:

I have 270 acres of land that I hunt on and I shot some big whitetails in Fulton County.

Then I would say you have the makings of a good trade. Most of my swaps have been public land hunts in Colorado, but have been three times to Montana (2 bull elk and 1 moose!). Haven't been since the wolf invasion though.

There are quite a few hunting sites that list a swap forum including this one. Post up what you have and some pictures of the bucks and I bet you would get some interest.

Ramhunter71, well thought post. Turk, you don't need to justify to anybody why you went on a guided hunt. It sounds like to me your outfitter wasn't an archery elk outfitter. It is an important consideration when booking a hunt. He may be a great rifle elk outfitter, and has the references and reviews to back it up, but archery elk is a different animal. His unwillingness to move in on a bull makes me wonder about his elk archery savvy. Distance is the paramount to getting a bull in bow range. At 200 yards one could sit and bugle back and forth all day long with bull, that won't put him in range. Additionally, your guide wasn't in camo, which also makes me wonder about his archery hunting skill set in general. Like others have said, it is a matter of research and vetting your perspective outfitters. BTW, there are plenty of good, honest, hardworking outfitters around, I personally know many of them.

Exactly Twobear. Everyone can build their own house too, but doesn't mean everyone has to do it. I think it is funny that people argue whether or not you are really a hunter for things like if you use a stick bow vs. compound vs crossbow. And if you admit you use a rifle with that crowd, forget it! There is room for all. Do what you enjoy and don't worry about what others think. Turk, I am going to PM you another website you should check out too for info on hunting and outfitters out west.

Also, if you find an outfitter that you are seriously thinking about using, go on several hunting websites under their big game or elk forums and ask if anyone knows about them. Can usually get some good feedback that way. But I really think you should explore the swap hunts. The 2 elk and moose I killed in Montana were all taken on public land with the help of a swap friend.

Yes, lots of good, honest, reputable outfitters out there who want you to be successful. But, it's like finding a good woman, you have to sift through a lot and kiss a few frogs before you get the right one. My experience is you have to talk to someone you know who has hunted with a specific outfitter and get an honest report, a lot of time "references" are friends of the outfitter who are more interested in seeing the outfitter fill spots in camp, and not looking out for your best interest.

To answer the OP's question, yes, there are some honest outfitters out there. You've been given some excellent advice in this topic by members from the hunting side and also from the outfitter side. We have a classified section for outfitter hunts for sale and also a sub-forum with outfitter reviews if you're interested. The review sub-forum is still a bit slim but the outfitter hunts for sale has a lot of hunts that you could check out further and also see if other members have hunted with that particular outfitter.

If you're still interested in an outfitted hunt, start a separate topic asking for any recommendations. You will get more responses, however, if you list that you want to bow hunt for elk and what state(s) you would like to hunt. A lot of members are strictly DIY but there are also quite a few who do guided hunts and could probably point you in the right direction. Good luck and let us know how it works out.