Non guided hunt
 

Me and my buddy want to go on our own hunt for something we don't have in central Texas. Bears, elk, jumbo mulies, aoudad, alligator antelope, whatever. It'd be easier to say what we absolutely won't hunt, whitetails, pigs, and high fences. We have a Polaris ranger and a camper we can use. We would really prefer to use the ranger, but it's not an absolute necessity. We want to spend less than $1000 each total. And we aren't doing that draw tag crap. So could someone hook me up with some information I would appreciate it.

It would be easier to help if you pick a state first. Colorado is the closest so that might be cheaper.

Mule deer is out if you don't want to go through the draw. Deer are all draw here.

If you don't want to draw an elk tag you'll have to get an OTC tag. That means tons of hunters doing what you want to do. The 4wheeler will make it worse, because anywhere you can use it will be full of hunters with 4wheelers too.

What weapon are you planning to use? Bow hunters have more opportunity.

Bow or rifle, either is fine. I'm not picky on states, it just has to be American

If you look at WY either find private land to hunt or forget the ATV. They aren't allowed on public land except for on roads where you can take your pickup truck anyway.
The "no tag draw" rule is going to severely limit you as already stated.

Do you have any kind of hunts to trade? You can trade for some good hunts if you could offer whitetail and hogs.

Not sure I would rule out the "draw tag crap" as many good tags can be drawn in 0-1 years. Best elk hunt for newbies would be a Colorado first rifle (elk only/draw only) tag. Many can be drawn with 0 points

Lot of limitations in your post. $1k limit, half will go to a tag, even an OTC tag you're going to fork over close to $500(or somewhere close), plus you have fuel usage, supplies, etc. As others said, sometimes you can still get a draw tag with no points. You can try in a couple of months when next year's draw tag apps come out. 4wd that is capable, with a camper that can make it are a plus. 4wheelers are cute, leave them at camp(yes I'm one of the haters). If you want to see elk, and not a sea of orange, you need walking boots to get back where the critters are, or a western horse/mule. 4wheelers running up and down the trails(only place that they are legal in many states inc here) only drive the critters you seek further into the woods. Remember, Elk once roamed the plains, but only the mountain elk survived extinction. That's because they are some smart animals and went to the higher, more rugged terrain where the bums couldn't reach them. So if you want OTC elk, Colorado will be one of your top choices then, with it being one of the western units. Just start getting in shape now, because those hills you have there are gopher mounds here

Ok, so all foot kind of thing. I guess if its the only way well make it work. If I wanted to do the draw thing I'd put my points in for alligators or exotics here in Texas. I just wanted something I could put together. What states have over the counter bull tags and lots of public hunting land? I'm nota worried about spending $500 or better on tags. I can eat beans from a can and tortillas. We're splitting the gas costs and Colorado is approximately 800 miles from my home. I might just take a tent and camp. If there's anything y'all want to pitch in id appreciate it

Colorado is $586 for a NR bull tag. You have a choice of 2nd, or 3rd rifle seasons. About 2/3 of the units are OTC. You don't need to buy the tags until you get here.

That's as easy as it gets.

My point on "points" is that you don't need them to draw a tag. You can apply for a first rifle season tag that can be had with O points. If for some reason you don't draw, you can get an OTC tag. In addition to the 2nd and 3rd rifle season, most units are OTC for archery. Your odds of getting an elk in the first rifle season would be better than the later seasons.

In fact , if I were you, I would consider putting in for a bull or either sex tag in the drawing as your first choice. Then as a second choice, you could put a cow tag. That way you would get to hunt the first rifle season next year and would be sure to draw the bull tag the year after. Cow tags are $350 and again your chance of success would be higher. Chances are you would get one of those tags. If not, you can still buy an OTC tag.

I have done a number of swap hunts that have worked out well. If you have something to trade, you can find someone who will show you the ropes and get you into a good area in Colorado. Otherwise, you are just taking a shot in the dark for the first year or two until you learn how/where to hunt in a given area.

I could offer hog hunts, but the hunters would have to stay in town 20 minutes away. And then it's not garunteed at that. And I didn't figure anyone would do that so I haven't offered it. What about pronghorns, or spot and stalk black bear? Still open on states.

Lots of people seem to do well for pronghorn in Wyoming, but again I think you have to apply for a tag, but they are easy to draw in some areas.

Colorado has lots of bears and the fall bear hunts have improved after they stopped the spring season. I elk hunt in units 42 and 70-71 and it is rare I don't see a bear during muzzleloading season (September). There are bear tags for september with a rifle that you can put in for. Bait is not allowed, but many people will sit near a gut pile

Muzzle loader, hhhhmmmm. What about archery? I don't own a muzzle loader, and frankly that looks more complicated than archery.

Just an observation but all the various game departments have pretty good websites. I would imagine an awful lot of your questions such as seasons and tags can be answered there. If it was me, I'd be checking each and every one of them, pick a state and then start asking specific questions.

Until you know what and where you want to hunt, nothing else matters.

Archery in Colorado for deer adn elk is OTC in most units and runs for almost the entire month of September

I do look at the other states websites and it is confusing. Colorado has GMUs that I think are like Texas' WMAs. Just more complicated, I'm going to call the Colorado DNR today hopefully and figure this thing out.

Their help desk at the main office in Denver is pretty good. What is it about GMU that you find complicated? Basically they divide the state up into the GMU based and geographical areas or herd structure. Some of the units (1,2,201, 10 etc...) are managed for trophies so they are hard to get tags for. Other units are easy to get tags for. They publish recaps every season that show the number of preference points for each unit and they also publish harvest statistics for each. This makes it easy to look over several years worth of data and get a historical average.

Another good tool they have on their web site is interactive GMU maps. You can apply various "layers" that will show wildlife densities based on different seasons. In other words you can see where elk are in the summer, fall and winter. This helps indicate possible migration routes or to show likely areas to look for game.

I grew up in CO and have hunted there most of my life. I don't find the GMU too complicated. The regulation brochure clearly tells where the boundaries between each are. WY uses a very similar system.

Which is why I asked what he found complicated. If I know what he finds difficult I may be able to "redneck" it down for him. Can't help the guy if I don't know the issue.

Yes, samething about Texas. I called them yesterday and the guy was real patient with me about it. He said I could hunt state parks and I had to know where I could hunt.

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Here is is:


Their help desk at the main office in Denver is pretty good.(The man had noted he was going to call so I told him the main office is helpful) What is it about GMU that you find complicated?(I'm asking for some clarification so I can help him) Basically they divide the state up into the GMU based and geographical areas or herd structure. Some of the units (1,2,201, 10 etc...) are managed for trophies so they are hard to get tags for. Other units are easy to get tags for.(Offering basic info as to the way the units are arranged and how tags are allocated) They publish recaps every season that show the number of preference points for each unit and they also publish harvest statistics for each.(More additional info that shows which tags can be easily drawn and to check harvest rates. You know, helping him understand where to get additional info on the specific GMUs) This makes it easy to look over several years worth of data and get a historical average....Deleted by CalHunter...

Another good tool they have on their web site is interactive GMU maps. You can apply various "layers" that will show wildlife densities based on different seasons. In other words you can see where elk are in the summer, fall and winter. This helps indicate possible migration routes or to show likely areas to look for game.(telling him about a very hepful interactive tool to show a lot of info about the particular units. You can even export the info and print out custom maps for your use. Have you ever used it or told anyone about it?)

I grew up in CO and have hunted there most of my life. I don't find the GMU too complicated.(Simple statement of fact, I don't find it complicated and because of that I can probably explain it. Note: THIS IS AT THE END OF THE POST AFTER HE SAID HE FOUND THE GMU COMPLICATED. ...Deleted by CalHunter... The regulation brochure clearly tells where the boundaries between each are.(Pretty clear. With the boundaries explained the info can be put on other maps such as topos. It clearly indicates the geographical locations and extents of the units. Note: I DIDN"T SAY IT WAS ALL EXPLAINED IN THE BROCHURE, just that the boundries are. ...Deleted by CalHunter... WY uses a very similar system. (A simple note, since the man is asking about several states, this info will also help him in WY.)

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If the originator of this topic would like some help understanding the CO GMUs and how to make them work to his advantage, I welcome him to send me a PM and I'll help him out.

Ok, Colorado is out of the question. I'm calling Idaho today. Colorado seems like a great state and all but I can't miss a week of school. Idaho has some summertime hunts I can go on more than likely. We'll find out in about an hour or so.

If you decide on Colorado later. Give me a PM. I'll do what I can to help.

Muley tells it like it is.
An old rimrocker mule deer buck is a lot harder to get than a bull elk. Personally, I'd rather
hunt the mule deer. Just as fun and less work to pack out. That gets more important the older and (hopefully) wiser you get.

I agree completely about the pack out.

Have elk got heavier?

LOL, that would have been good to know from the beginning. By for the most hunting seasons are in the fall during school. You might consider checking during Christmas break as there might be some late seasons for cow elk. But be prepared for hiking in the snow if you did that.

That said, you might want to consider just going on a pack in camping trip in the summer and hike and fish and scout for future hunting seasons after you get out of school in a few years. I go camping every summer and hunting every fall, and I always have a blast in the summer. There is no "season" to worry about so it is a lot more laid back and can be scheduled around your life. And I make it a point to explore a new area that I haven't hunted each year.

Haha, Idaho has some summer bear hunting seasons. I called and the lady gave it to me straight. Go to Idaho, buy a license and hunt. She said dang near everything is public hunting land, and I'll get an envelope in a few weeks helping me out. I figure with my luck we'll get there and it'll look like west texas. I think it said you can use dogs, but if you need to use dogs to catch a bear then I might be in trouble. An I don't think my bloodhound would be up for that haha. If anyone has information on public hunting land in Utah that'd be amazing. Thank y'all for y'all's help!

Yes, as my legs have gotten older the elk have gotten heavier. Perception is reality on a snowy mountainside at 9000 feet.

Nope. I'm a 50 year old Navy Chief that can ...Deleted by CalHunter... My current command is Coastal Riverine Squadron 4 and right now I'm deployed to the Middle East. Ever been there? Kind of hot and dusty most the time.

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I'd like to point out that you have admitted that all you hunt is mulies and elk in CO. So just exactly what do you base the view point that they are the hardest when you haven't branched out? Have you hunted Blacktails? How about Couse Deer? Roosevelt Elk? Mountain Goat? Bighorn Sheep? Have you hunted mulies and elk in other states? Been to WY? How about MT? Hunted ID? NE? KS? TX? FL? NH? PA? AL? CA? H!? What about Canada and all the game they have? Or what about Mexico? They hunt mulies there. Nope, according to you all your experience is in one place for limited species. You undoubtedly have a lot of experience with those animals and I'm sure you know how to hunt them, but the world is a heck of a big place and if you haven't seen it then your claim is automatically voided.

Are elk and mulies difficult to hunt? Yep. Never claimed they weren't. Are they the hardest to hunt? In my experience no.

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You need to go back, and read the posts again. Not just this thread, but the others about the mule deer.

I said more than one time. Mule deer were hard in my area, the way that I hunt them. That's a simple statement that's not hard to understand. When i first brought this up on another thread. Someone mentioned they could get tags for 10-12 deer, and had months to get it done. I said that sounds kind of easy. At least it sounded easy to me, but i was only comparing it to what I face here. I struggle to a tag for one deer, and normally can't do it every year. As you know. Once you get the tag here they take all your points. Elk is much easier.

So, i'll say it one more time slowly. FOR ME....mule deer are harder to hunt here than elk. They are also harder to hunt than deer were in Mass, and all of New England when I lived there. Also harder than in California that I lived and hunted for 30 years. This is not just my opinion. All my hunting buddies agree. I hunt elk for meat. I hunt muley bucks for the challenge. I can call in elk. I can't call in mule deer. I can hunt elk in the timber where I do best. Muley bucks in muzzy season are above timberline. Elk are in the rut. Deer are not. My shots are close for elk in the timber. My shots are long for deer, and i'm using open sights. My vision is so bad that I have a license to use a scope in muzzy season, but I consider it unfair to other hunters, and won't use it. So, the long shots I have on bucks aren't taken. I have to get close, but i'm trying to do it in open country.

Altitude is also a challenge. No matter what shape I get into. 12,000ft will beat me up. I would be much happier hunting whitetails at lower altitudes in the timber. I've done both, and the whitetails were easier.

I repeat so there's no misunderstanding again. They're harder FOR ME!

You keep ragging on me for reading comprehension. Try to slow down, and read what i'm saying. I've also said so many times that I can't even count them. I don't push my methods on anybody else.

Ok, we've both had our say here. We've talked in PM's, and this is the end of it.

Jumping to conclusions about someone on a forum is never a good thing. It's better to give the benefit of the doubt, and not say anything.

You are misinformed about a summer season...theres a spring bear season and a fall season. If you are talking about a draw tag theres only three areas for that and either bait is prohibited and dogs are prohibited...plus you have to be lucky to get drawn for one of 215 tags...for "fall" season.

Let me tell you I hunted/baited for them in the spring...didn't get any bears even look at the bait...I hunted them in the fall and of the 2 months of season I had ONE day they came out right before dark...where I shot my first bear. That was after 3weeks of them hitting the bait... Sure they are around but seeing them are few and far between in daylight. if you are only hunting a week...your odds of getting a bear without bait or dogs is pretty much zero...from my limited experience hunting bears. I am however hooked on the challenge of getting bears...so next year will be my second year hunting them...


http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/...les/bgBear.pdf

On the subject of bears. In Colorado there's no dogs, or baiting either. It's just a fall hunt.

You have two methods you can use. You can spot and stalk, or a more exciting way is to call them in. Use a predictor call. The bears will come charging in to the call, and that's the exciting part. They're looking for an injured animal, and are hungry. They must be trying to beat any other bears in the area to the food source. You best be ready to shoot fast, and hope they don't come in on your blind side.

Fun stuff.


On a positive side. The tags are not hard to get.

This thread is temporarily locked at 4 pages so it doesn't grow to 8 or 10 pages of flaming before I can get back to it after I get off work. Any other mod or admin is welcome to jump in and moderate if they would like. If not, I'll moderate it when I get home from work and have the time.
CalHunter
Moderator


The thread is now open again after a few pages of moderating. Play nice gentlemen.
Cal