CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

HUNITNG WITH OUTFFITER in area 51 most northwest corner of WY outside Yellowstone . in third week of Oct. packing in int about 12 miles!

Would it be adviseable to carry a hand gun in thei area! not really concerned about the days cause I always have a hunting rifle but if you get up int he middle of the night and have to take a leak!

Read alot of your posts here especailly form you guys that are out ther in in this country?

PS have lots of handguns would consider carrying a comapct 45 auto!!

all thoughts appreciated!!

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

I will tell you now leave the auto home,unless it' s a desert Eagle 44 or 50A.E..If you wan' t to take one do so.I live in Montana and have packed a side arm when with rifle of hiking.It' s not that much weight.Alot of guys here have never been confronted by a Grizz @ 20 yds.(I have, twice same day)[X(] It makes it easy to go to the john and not have to carry a rifle.
But if you do make sure you don' t fire early if charged,do every thing in your power to avoid confontation.BBJ

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

If your hunting in Griz country, carry a good bear spray. I for one think that I' d have a better chance getting a blast of capsicum in a bear' s face at 5 yds than I would try to get a 45 slug into a vital area without really pissing him off. If you' re rifle hunting, you got enough gear to tote any way(spotting scope, extra clothes, water etc). That pistola is just more weight that you don' t need.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

A .44 Rem. Mag. is the min. Good luck.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

I agree with BareBack jack, leave the auto home, that would just cause you some big problems, I was attacked by a big black bear while field dressing an elk several years ago, the 44 Mag w/240 hollow point made it' s mark, but to be honest having this big black coming at me, and hitting it at 20 yards, would tax any hunter, I don' t care how much experience they have. Play it safe!

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

You might as well jus' piss on a bear than try to defend yerself with a 45 ACP. A good camp dog is still the best defense in the mountings. Now I carry a 44 mag in the summer, but its a last resort an' I don' t have a rifle with me then. More likely I' ll need it to put a horse down after he gits hisself hurt in a cluster fuk. Besides all thet, a handgun is damn heavy to hike with in rough country. You fellers been watchin too many movies. There ain' t bears ahind every tree, an' a lil' common sense will keep you safe.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

I posed your question to a friend at work who for quite awhile lived in SW Montana. He said if you were going to carry a 45 for protection from griz/blacks, you should think about filing the front site clean off the gun. He said that way, when the bear shoves it up your a$$, it won' t hurt so much;) Seriously, pepper spray would be a better deterant. If you must carry a side arm, he said go with a 44 as a minimum!

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

BareBack Jack and BeaverJack - Please share some more of about what you mean by " avoid contact" and " use commonsense" , for those of us who have no experience with bears that are a whole lot bigger than black bears we have in these parts.

It' s a bit intimidating to be in the woods where we' ve seen the marks a grizzly makes 9' in the air on a big pine tree, knowing they might not react like blackies back here do 95% of the time and run away when they see a person.

I know not to run away from a grizzly and not to look them in the eyes if they look at me. Do you just stand still and look from the corner of your eye, ready to use your rifle, sidearm or spray only as a last resort, look for a tree to climb quick or what?

30 years ago, my brother-in-law and his friend had to spend the night in the top of some pine trees in Yellowstone Park. He had a young dog with him that got the bear pizzed off at them I guess. He had the dog in between him and the tree with his belt around them both and the tree. He said the bear went back a forth all night hitting the trees trying to shake someone loose I guess. Not a picture I' d like to see first hand.

More than commonsense, I' d like to hear first hand experiences from those who' ve lived near and experienced Grizzly Bears encounters. I hope I never see one up close, but I' d rather be prepared to react right. In N.W. WY where we' re hunting Elk again this year, they do have some that they say have been moved out of the Park.

Thanks!

MinnFinn

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

Well, I' ve been around quite a few browns in Alaska over the years and have a few photos I took of a sow with two cubs looking at me. Second shot she is in the creek pushing water and the third is trees ' cause tough old me backed away real fast which probly would have got me eaten if she didn' t have the cubs to go back to. I had a small airhorn in my waders per advice from a buddy but it went off when I bent over and about froze my weiner off so I got rid of it.[:o] I have tried carrying a pistol and it is a big pain to haul the extra weight so haven' t done that for ten years. Most dangerous time on any bear or cat is when your cutting fish or game and then the gun would be nice but I still bowhunt without one. Good hunting.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

Common sense in bear country:

1. Keep a clean camp
2. Make noise when you ain' t hunting
3. Have a friend near when field dressing
4. Don' t come up on a carcass too quick or quiet when returning with pack animals
5. Carry pepper spray
6. When confronted by a bear, back away and avoid eye contact
7. Keep a good hound in camp
8. Clean all yer fish at once and leave right away, putting the fish in a plastic bag
9. Store yer elk quarters between two trees and 12 feet high
10. Whistle or sing as you ride out with yer meat
11. Move yer quarters away from the gut pile before heading back to camp for yer pack animals
12. Keep yer rifle in reach when answering nature' s call, particularly at night
13. Don' t have wimmin in hunting camp if you can help it
14. Be sure you are in eminant danger before poppin' off at any bear, especially a griz; the G&F people are very good investigators an' not too unnerstanding when they decide you were jus' bein' macho when you kilt an endagered species to protect a elk, a dog, a horse, or jus' cause you cain' t lay off the trigger when you see fur
15. Store yer food high an' away from yer sleeping tent
16. Don' t eat ANYTHING where you sleep
17. Often a bear will give a false charge before comin' full bore after you. Hit him with the spray as soon as it looks like he ain' t gonna go quiet. If you gotta shoot him, do it when he' s within 20 yards and keep shootin' til he ain' t movin' . Best he has pepper spray on his coat when the G&F arrive, fired from where you say you fired it, an' his tracks prove he was chargin' an you were dead in front when you plugged him. Anybody usin' a handgun may not have to worry about the last part too much cause it ain' t sartin yer gonna stop a real charge with that gun. A handgun is best used in a tent or at extremely close quarters when you got no other choice.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

Beaver Jack summed it up pretty well.The best advice I can give you is always be aware of you suroundings.Bears are sneaky and can come up on you in a hurry.If you stumble on one with cubbs your best defence would try to put some thing between you and her,something to stop the charge.Try to make your self as small let them be the dominate one.Donot Run this will trigger predetor vs prey and the may not wan' t to eat ya but play abit.Sometimes there is nothing you can do sh** happens.If you are alone and dressing you animal keep the rifle close.Don' t be so engrossed in cleaning that you don' t listen,pairs work the best (1 cleaning and ! watching).You game calls will also atract predetors so keep alert.If calling put your back agianst a tree and keep eyes,ears and nose open.I dout your guide will put you in harms way,but you never know.If one attacks your guide don' t run help him out.Clients and freinds have ran at the sight of a bear attacking the other.

One more bit of info if you are attacked by a Blackie DO NOT PLAY DEAD,fight back as hard as you can.
BBJ.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

MinnFinn,I had never encouterd a grizz till about 5-6 years ago.We were hunting north of Linclon MT.We were huntin a area that we had heard had a grizzly in it.We figured everyone else had steared clear of it so we hunted it.I reameber it was snowing/rain and was just about dust.I was walking side hill down a ridge in some prety thick blow-down timber.I was going slow and looking for movement when I saw him,he wasn' t a big bear like on t.v but big enough.We both made eye contact and he huffed ,stood up and ran.I yelled bear and moved out.

My 2 encounter was when I was hunting south of Ennis MT in the Gravley Range about 3 yrs ago.I was hunting south of Jonny Rige road when I came apon a elk kill that was buried in the dirt,had grizz sign all over it.My mout went dry and I went to defensive mode in a hurry.I started backing out with my rifle in hand and the beltloop of my pistol,when he came out not 20 yds away.he came at me and hit the breaks @ about 6 feet.He popped his teeth and blew snot.I was so scared I never even took the saftey off my gun.I had also dirty pants from bracing for the hit I tensed up so much.(Hence beaware of surroundings)


My 3 came the same year same area 20 miles south on the auto tour raod I can' t remember the name of it.We were hunting clear cuts and dark lodge pole timber.I kick a bull out of his bed and i was hot after him,when I herd some noise not 100 yds to my left I figured it was the bull doubling back so I was stalking slowly and quietly.I seen move ment and it was a grizz about 3 yrs old he had a insulated thermos and was chewing it,he smeled me and ran leaving the thermos.I took with me cause I figured no one would belive me.His teeth had gone through and kool-aid was leaking out of it.I don' t know were he got it cause the road is a good 3 miles away.
Well there are my bear stories.BBJ

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

Are there bears in the Gunnison, CO area? I' d hate to end up as a bear turd because I didn' t take a gun with me when I went to take a leak in the middle of the night.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

Only blackies down in Colorader. But they kill more people than grizzlers do. You ain' t gotta worry bout takin' a pee at night. More likely you walk up on a sow an cubs, or she saunders into yer tent cause you fergot to put the cap on the toothpaste an' laid the tube down next to yer boots. I' d say you would be better to worry ' bout lightning strikes while glassing than becoming a bear turd in camp.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

It seems like this thread comes back prior to hunting season each year as it seems we just recently answered this same question earlier, but sense you ask, here my two cents.
Beaver, #6 does not apply to Blackies, but only Griz. When approached by a Blackie, yell at it, wave your arms and try to be the dominate creature. Don' t do this with the Griz encounter as you want to appear meek, humble and inferior in its presense. You are dealing with two different type bears and both treated totally different. I live in the Kootenai National Forest just at the base of Glacier National Park and I have had several black bear encounters with bears seeing me at the same time and once a sow that had two cubs that I encountered at 20 yrds dureing bow season, most black bears will avoid an encounter if an exit route is availiable. A Griz has a personel space of something like 50-75 yds away, if you are within this perameter, you are in immediate danger. You will know real quik if bear are pesent because of the amount of scat/signs in the area, and if there is, then you need to be bear-aware. Since I live in Griz/Black bear country, a pistol and bear spray are all standard equiptment, even if its not used it gives me a sense of assurance and confidence needed at times. You never know when you may have to put an animal down such as feral dogs or such if need to be. I' d rather have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.
I made a post last year about a friend of mine that was attacked by a griz while he was hunting, in what he thought was a moose he kicked out of a bed turned out to be a Griz Sow with a cub at 30 yrds, the griz charged Chris and then took the cub to safety and came back at Chris one more time, lightning fast speed and at point blank range he fell back and shot the griz with his 7 mag. The bear fell dead. Chris got law enforcement. Biologist and feds investagated the site and bear, Chris was not prosecuted as they found evidence of powder burns being on the bear and it was a justifiable shooting. I asked him later, " What if you had bear spray?" His repley was, " You got a 7mag and bear spray, stick with what works."
But if you do, you better make sure your life is endanger.
Due to the overwheming amount of non-residents shooting Griz thinking they' ll black bears, all non-residents and residents are required to take a bear identifacation test prior to receiveing there bear permit.
I am not trying to make you feel paronoid, but just go prepared and be aware of your surroundings, just as you would if your hunting in snake country. Bobby ;)

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

I stand corrected. I don' t worry much bout blacks, cause they have also always run off when we see each other. The question of bear spray is relative to yardage. A surprised, non-charging bear at 20 yards can be shot with bear spray an' he will leave more often than not. At 10 yards with snappin' an' swippin with a paw, I' m flippin' off the safety on my rifle.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

This one time at band camp......

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

Pepper spray is very effective for all bears and much lighter than any side arm. I would learn a little about the behavoir differences between black and grizzlies, they are very different species. Leave the side arm at home to avoid snickners.

RE: CARRY HANDGUN OR NOT?
 

I don' t see what a sidearm' s got to do with candy bars. But I do know them folks in colorady thet got torn apart in their tent a couple weeks ago probly wisht they had a snickers bar right now, or any other candy thet don' t have dirt an' worms in it! Lost does make a good point, with respect to learnin' ' bout bears, but the backcountry is still the backcountry, no matter how many cell phones an' trail signs. I carry a sidearm in the summer, an' will be alive long after most pink arsed mama' s boys et their last granola bar an' died from exposure cause they couldn' t signal a rescue team or shoot thet rock chuck that was the only chance for a meal in a week. Lots of busted up corpses wished they toted a firearm I' m bettin' . Signaled my ol' lady with my 44 a couple weeks ago when she took a wrong trail.