Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
06-01-2009, 10:05 AM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3
Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
Okay, first of all I'm an experienced paper shooter....... on flat 100-600 yd ranges. So, I was appalled at myself for missing my target at 20 (flat) feet.
Here's the scenario, my buddy takes me hunting for black bear (my first big game hunt in Alaska) I've gone out to hunt deer in in the past in upstate NY but never actually set eyes on anything. This time I'm thinking BEAR..... maybe I should use something with a little umph behind it. So, I grab my largest caliber rifle which is a Savage 111 FCXP3 in .300 Win. Mag. I zero it in the morning of the hunt with the result of about 1.25 MOA @ 100 yds. When we get to the site (with bait station) I find the tree stands set up within 30 feet of the station. I think to myself how easy a shot this will be. Not long after getting set up the first of two bears comes into the target area, this one belongs to my friend (after all it is his bait station), he takes his shot hitting it just behind the left shoulder. As we are waiting, giving it time to run its course, the second bear enters the area. This one is for me to harvest. I let it sniff about the station, watching as it stands and sniffs a nearby tree licking maple syrup. I waited patiently for the "quartering away" shot to get a nice clean shot. When it finally presents itself the bear is about 20 flat feet away from me, I am about 12 feet up in a tree stand, I aim low (about 2" above the under side just behind the fron leg/shoulder) as you should with an angled shot, I squeeze off the round and........ I miss. According to my friend I shot low, what did I do wrong? Was the shot just too close of a range? I can honestly say that I noticed no discernable physiological change (increased heart rate or heavier breathing) when taking the shot, no "buck fever" as my step-dad equates it to deer hunting. I look back on it and wonder if I would have been more successful had I drawn the .44 Mag. I had holstered on my hip. Regardless of not having a freezer full of bear burger and hot links, I still had a fantastic time. Seeing bear free from the confines of a zoo's pen is an experience I won't forget and look forward to doing again in the future. Once the freezer is filled, I will probably go sit out there and watch for them again just on a "photo hunt". It reminded me of when I raced sailboats as a kid, extraordinarily calming yet with moments of excitement that leave a smile on your face.
Regards,
Chris
Here's the scenario, my buddy takes me hunting for black bear (my first big game hunt in Alaska) I've gone out to hunt deer in in the past in upstate NY but never actually set eyes on anything. This time I'm thinking BEAR..... maybe I should use something with a little umph behind it. So, I grab my largest caliber rifle which is a Savage 111 FCXP3 in .300 Win. Mag. I zero it in the morning of the hunt with the result of about 1.25 MOA @ 100 yds. When we get to the site (with bait station) I find the tree stands set up within 30 feet of the station. I think to myself how easy a shot this will be. Not long after getting set up the first of two bears comes into the target area, this one belongs to my friend (after all it is his bait station), he takes his shot hitting it just behind the left shoulder. As we are waiting, giving it time to run its course, the second bear enters the area. This one is for me to harvest. I let it sniff about the station, watching as it stands and sniffs a nearby tree licking maple syrup. I waited patiently for the "quartering away" shot to get a nice clean shot. When it finally presents itself the bear is about 20 flat feet away from me, I am about 12 feet up in a tree stand, I aim low (about 2" above the under side just behind the fron leg/shoulder) as you should with an angled shot, I squeeze off the round and........ I miss. According to my friend I shot low, what did I do wrong? Was the shot just too close of a range? I can honestly say that I noticed no discernable physiological change (increased heart rate or heavier breathing) when taking the shot, no "buck fever" as my step-dad equates it to deer hunting. I look back on it and wonder if I would have been more successful had I drawn the .44 Mag. I had holstered on my hip. Regardless of not having a freezer full of bear burger and hot links, I still had a fantastic time. Seeing bear free from the confines of a zoo's pen is an experience I won't forget and look forward to doing again in the future. Once the freezer is filled, I will probably go sit out there and watch for them again just on a "photo hunt". It reminded me of when I raced sailboats as a kid, extraordinarily calming yet with moments of excitement that leave a smile on your face.
Regards,
Chris
06-01-2009, 04:47 PM
#2
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Very S. Indiana
Posts: 155
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
I dont have a ballistics chart handy right now, but you shot under if he was at 20',and you were sighted in at 100yrds. Ok your line of sight is a direct line from your scope to the target - 100yrds. the round is sitting 6 or so inches below in the barrel, when it leaves the barrel it is on a incline up to whereat some point it crosses the line of sight, then as it travels on downrange it will drop back in to where you have zeroed into - 100yrds. with a ballistics chart you can tell where it crosses the line of sight both times , say 30yrds and 100yrds. then you know you can place the crosshairs on target,with it sighted at 100 and still hit dead center at 30 yrds too. Or as in your case hold it on the bears back line at 20 ft. and still do the job.
06-01-2009, 06:50 PM
#3
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Garfield NJ USA
Posts: 3,067
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
ORIGINAL: bowdaddy1964
I dont have a ballistics chart handy right now, but you shot under if he was at 20',and you were sighted in at 100yrds. Ok your line of sight is a direct line from your scope to the target - 100yrds. the round is sitting 6 or so inches below in the barrel, when it leaves the barrel it is on a incline up to whereat some point it crosses the line of sight, then as it travels on downrange it will drop back in to where you have zeroed into - 100yrds. with a ballistics chart you can tell where it crosses the line of sight both times , say 30yrds and 100yrds. then you know you can place the crosshairs on target,with it sighted at 100 and still hit dead center at 30 yrds too. Or as in your case hold it on the bears back line at 20 ft. and still do the job.
I dont have a ballistics chart handy right now, but you shot under if he was at 20',and you were sighted in at 100yrds. Ok your line of sight is a direct line from your scope to the target - 100yrds. the round is sitting 6 or so inches below in the barrel, when it leaves the barrel it is on a incline up to whereat some point it crosses the line of sight, then as it travels on downrange it will drop back in to where you have zeroed into - 100yrds. with a ballistics chart you can tell where it crosses the line of sight both times , say 30yrds and 100yrds. then you know you can place the crosshairs on target,with it sighted at 100 and still hit dead center at 30 yrds too. Or as in your case hold it on the bears back line at 20 ft. and still do the job.
Why did you think you had to hold under? Point of aim right behind the shoulder socket is the sweet spot unless your looking to anchor the bear by taking a shoulder shot.
06-01-2009, 07:20 PM
#4
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Very S. Indiana
Posts: 155
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
First of all I was trying to explain to him the angle of it, not giving him a presise diagram. He wanted to know why he missed, not why your a jump up and down, hey look at me poster.... Besides why would anyone bring a 300mag sighted in at 100yrds for baited bears...and have a 44 mag in tow?....If cm72 acually went bear hunting.."went in upstate NY but did'nt lay eyes on anything"? Maybe he had a "been there dun that" buddy like you for his advisor...
06-01-2009, 08:07 PM
#5
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: fort mcmurray alberta canada
Posts: 5,667
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
With a typical low or medium ring set up,the crosshairs are about 1-1/2" to 1-3/4" above the bore.At 20' the point of impact would have been less than that from point of aim regardless of the angle.With any decent hold that 1-1/2" or so would not have resulted in a clean miss.
06-01-2009, 10:50 PM
#7
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
Why did you think you had to hold under? Point of aim right behind the shoulder socket is the sweet spot unless your looking to anchor the bear by taking a shoulder shot.
06-02-2009, 04:04 AM
#8
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: fort mcmurray alberta canada
Posts: 5,667
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
From an article I read on angled shooting ("Angle Shooting" Correcting for the effects of gravity By Ward W. Brien) which stated that when shooting at an angle (regardless of whether it is an incline or a decline), the effects of gravity are reduced. Thus causing a flatter trajectory that impacts higher than a flat plane shot. The article refers to long range shooting, but I figured the same principles apply.
06-02-2009, 04:50 AM
#9
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Garfield NJ USA
Posts: 3,067
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
ORIGINAL: stubblejumper
At 20' it is meaningless.
From an article I read on angled shooting ("Angle Shooting" Correcting for the effects of gravity By Ward W. Brien) which stated that when shooting at an angle (regardless of whether it is an incline or a decline), the effects of gravity are reduced. Thus causing a flatter trajectory that impacts higher than a flat plane shot. The article refers to long range shooting, but I figured the same principles apply.
By the way if your relying on having been out in NYS and not having seen anything and printed articles for your prep of a paid hunt you were not ready for it in the first place. Especially an Alaskan bear hunt.
06-02-2009, 04:52 AM
#10
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Garfield NJ USA
Posts: 3,067
RE: Angled shooting...... How did I miss this shot?!?!?
ORIGINAL: bowdaddy1964
First of all I was trying to explain to him the angle of it, not giving him a presise diagram. He wanted to know why he missed, not why your a jump up and down, hey look at me poster.... Besides why would anyone bring a 300mag sighted in at 100yrds for baited bears...and have a 44 mag in tow?....If cm72 acually went bear hunting.."went in upstate NY but did'nt lay eyes on anything"? Maybe he had a "been there dun that" buddy like you for his advisor...
First of all I was trying to explain to him the angle of it, not giving him a presise diagram. He wanted to know why he missed, not why your a jump up and down, hey look at me poster.... Besides why would anyone bring a 300mag sighted in at 100yrds for baited bears...and have a 44 mag in tow?....If cm72 acually went bear hunting.."went in upstate NY but did'nt lay eyes on anything"? Maybe he had a "been there dun that" buddy like you for his advisor...