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Why are hunts so damn expensive???

Old 03-05-2008, 12:48 PM
  #41  
Fork Horn
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

I don't have a problem for what they charge but I choose not to pay an outfitter some of what I think is ridiculas.
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Old 03-05-2008, 06:37 PM
  #42  
EKM
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

I agree, hunting with an outfitter is more expensive than alot of us can afford, myself included. It's a shame, but a large part of that expense is caused by the rules and regulationsour government hascreated on guides/outfitters. In most states, Just anybody can't set-up shop and start charging to take us hunting. In nearly every state, there are mandatory training & testingin safety, emergency first aid, guide skills, etc. that they must first take & pass. Then after they get all of that out of the way, they have to purchase a guides license. Usually, that's from someone who already has one because the state has put a limit on the number of guides/outfitters it will allow & theyhave already filled all available guide licenses. Next, in alot of places they have to find landowners willing to lease them hunting rights to private property within the area they are licensed to hunt. Even on public land, they have to apply for the exclusive rights to guide hunts in a given area of the National Forest.Once againvirtually all of those rights have been previously assigned to someone. Thus, again, they are looking for an existing outfitter willing to sell their rights to hunt in a given area of public land. Once they get all of that lined up, they then have to purchase or lease all of the tents, horses, stoves, bedding, lanterns, trucks, trailers, fuel, etc necessary to get their new clients to the camps. Finally, since they only have the short period of time alotted to hunt (the season), they must take on enough clients simultaneously to make the operation pay enough to cover expenses and make a decent living. Finally, do to our current "sue everybody climate" here in the U.S, you can't forget the cost an outfitter must put out to purchase insurance for his business. Ever look into what it costs to purchase the insurance necessary to cover you and your businessif you have an bunch of guys with rifles climbing aboard horses and heading up the side of a 40 degree slope?? Not to mention the fact that no one can guarantee howmuch experienceyour clients have either handling horses orusing firearms. Think about how much it costs you to get liablity insurance on your car, then think about how much it must cost to get liability insurance against the possible lawsuits if a client were to get killed by another client or seriously injured by a horse or mule. Heck, even the insurance to cover the possibility of a client having a heart attack and dropping dead while on a hunt would cost a small fortune since his/her family may just decide that they want to holdyou responsible in a court of law. At any rate, all of those things add up. And any outfitter must cover those costs in just a few short weeks every year. (By the way, I'm not an outfitter; never have been, and have only used an outfitting service once in my life. That was on a bighorn sheep hunt & I had no other way to get myself and my gear into the hunting area. I checked, and it was going to cost me almost as much as I spenton the guide just to rent the horses to do a proper job of scouting, and then rent them again for the hunting season. Guess what, once again, when I checked into why, I found out our state has regulations dictating who and how many people can rent pack animals within the National Forest. There are also regulations dictating how much insurance such an individual must have in order to rent horses on public land. Not to mention the fact that when you take pack animals into the national forest, you must also pack in "certified weedless" feed for them while they are there.And thanks to PETA, we now have regulations dictating how the animals must be looked after while they're being kept in the hunting camp.)

Regards, & Good Huntin',
LlindeX
One ofJack O'Connor's best lines, "....you need to learn how to use paragraphs."
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Old 03-06-2008, 12:41 PM
  #43  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Missouri
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

I pay for outfitted hunts. I'm not ashamed of it either. I see fellow hunters from my area make the annual trek to colorado to stomp around with the other nomads in over hunted areas. Once in a blue moon one of those guys brings home a rag horn. generally though the trip is considered a succes if one of the 5-6 hunters bags a cow. and there certainly isn't anything wrong with that. They have a great time. It just isn't for me.

I would rather stay home, then drive out there and fight the rest of the idiots for elbow room. It really doesn't suit me to be in the elk woods and hear 4 wheelers running the roads all day:

"Oh whats that?" is it a bull? cow? Nope its a polaris.

No when I go which isn't every year. I pay to be dropped in the back country. Lets get way back in where we won't see another soul. Sure I could do it DIY, and if I lived closer I would. But the pure logistics make it more sensible to hire it done. By the time I trailered my horses out, got them acclimated, scouted a camp site, packed in all the gear and food, and got camp set up, it would be time to head back to work. No I'll pay someone else to do that, plus they will hopefully know the area good enough that we can start off hunting rather than learning the country.

It costs a pretty penny, no doubt. But, what doesn't anymore. I agree that the costs are getting out of control. I will either have to bite the bullet and pay it or (gasp) stay home.
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Old 03-06-2008, 02:30 PM
  #44  
 
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Moses Lake, WA
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

I don't have a problem with people charging whatever someone else is willing to pay. It does sadden me to see it getting harder and harder for the average Joe to hunt but I don't blame that on outfitters. I also don't care if someone pays to go hunt. I am not at all impressed with anything they get if they are paying however. I am impressed with the guy that does it on his own. In other words when I see a mount of someone who pays tohunt I don't think "there is a good hunter" I do think "there is a rich hunter".
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Old 03-07-2008, 10:25 AM
  #45  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Missouri
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

ORIGINAL: MosesLakehunter

I don't have a problem with people charging whatever someone else is willing to pay. It does sadden me to see it getting harder and harder for the average Joe to hunt but I don't blame that on outfitters. I also don't care if someone pays to go hunt. I am not at all impressed with anything they get if they are paying however. I am impressed with the guy that does it on his own. In other words when I see a mount of someone who pays tohunt I don't think "there is a good hunter" I do think "there is a rich hunter".
mose,

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. I most certainly am not "Rich". I and my wife make a decent living. I save a couple of years of overtime and side jobcash so I can do what I love.

You can think of me what you want. And to be honest, I'm not over impressed with someone who goes year after year and comes home empty handed.What I think of Is "Sad". I hear them talk about how cheap it is, and how much they save compared to me.But,what I see is guys going 5,6,7 even 10 years before they tag anything. Even at $1,000 a year that would pay for avery nice huntwith considerably better odds.You know the definition of stupidity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.

Granted if you hunt every year Totally DIY and bag game more times than not, then you are probably a better hunter than me. No newsflash there, I've known several people that I consider better hunters than me.

I don't hunt to impress other folks. I hunt for myself. I'm proud of my trophies hanging on the wall. I know how hard I worked to 1. save the $ 2. climbing the mountain 3) hauling out the meat etc. And FYI just because its guided doesn't mean that you don't have to hunt. Its not like the guides have them tied up. You have to get out and glass and walk and "hunt". Despite what you might think guided hunt are quite often unsuccessful.

But I end with this: I wish the best of luck in all your endeavors. We will just have to disagree on this issue.
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Old 03-07-2008, 01:15 PM
  #46  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

ORIGINAL: ShatoDavis

...
I would rather stay home, then drive out there and fight the rest of the idiots for elbow room. ...
Being one of those, as you called us "the rest of the idiots",I can guarantee you that I have more fun in the field any day, harvesting animals or not, than you can have staying at home and waiting for the pile of money to get high enough to hire somebody to “guide” you to make a kill. I usually have 4 big game tags, and success rate is 25% or 50%. The rest is enjoying being out there with the “rest of the idiots”. On the other hand, I will never get myself in a situationwhere "guides" drags me arround by my hand, tells me where to sit, where to look, aim and take a shot for 10 grand or more, just to have a rack on my wall, or come back home empty, like so many of the hunters that pay do.

Anyway, please watch your language, as it may offend people who hunt on their own, fair chase on public land.
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Old 03-09-2008, 08:44 PM
  #47  
BKC
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

There are a lot of outfitters out there that are reasonable but the one's that charge 15-20k and are no kill no pay are high fence hunts and those are the ones that I do not understand. I was at the Sacremento Cal sportsman show a few weeks back and I was talking to a young guy that has 20,000 acre high fence elk hunt for 20k no lic or tags but it's like going to a cattle ranch and picking out the biggest bull a shooting it how much fun is that? This kid told me that he has even shoot the bull for the hunter before. He had a dvd running on a TV and there was a hunting showthat a few weeks before I seen the same hunt on the outdoor network on the TV show it took one shot on the real dvd this pro hunter missed twice and then it took four more shots put this 7x7 bull down I wish I could remeber the huters show and name I never laughed so much standing at that diplay an hearing this young man telling the story while I was watching the real show not the edited one
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Old 03-10-2008, 08:32 AM
  #48  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,429
Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

ORIGINAL: laufer303

ORIGINAL: ShatoDavis

...
I would rather stay home, then drive out there and fight the rest of the idiots for elbow room. ...
Being one of those, as you called us "the rest of the idiots",I can guarantee you that I have more fun in the field any day, harvesting animals or not, than you can have staying at home and waiting for the pile of money to get high enough to hire somebody to “guide” you to make a kill. I usually have 4 big game tags, and success rate is 25% or 50%. The rest is enjoying being out there with the “rest of the idiots”. On the other hand, I will never get myself in a situationwhere "guides" drags me arround by my hand, tells me where to sit, where to look, aim and take a shot for 10 grand or more, just to have a rack on my wall, or come back home empty, like so many of the hunters that pay do.

Anyway, please watch your language, as it may offend people who hunt on their own, fair chase on public land.
You know that wasn't my point. Besides I'm sure you know what Idiots I'm talking about. You may not be one of them but you know who I'm talking about.

I'll use whatever language I want. I've already got a daddy so you can stop worrying about me.

If you like hunting where the pressure is high then go for it. I don't. Do not try to belittle me or my hunting style. I will not stand for it. You can think that the guides lead us by the hand and do everything but shoot for me if you want. But I can assure you that it just isn't the case. I don't care what you think of me. When you state it on here then I get defensive.

I also hunt FAIR CHASE ON PUBLIC LAND. The only difference is I live a long way away so I pay an outfitter to get me into the remote areas. Have you ever hunted with a partner. Shared glassing duty to cover more ground. Helped a buddy stalk, dress, and pack his game? Well, thats what a guide is to me. I'll hunt my way, You hunt yours. Best of luck!
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Old 03-10-2008, 02:57 PM
  #49  
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 694
Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

I wonder where all these consultants (booking Agents)come into play?
Not sure I would want to pay for another middleman but someone is.. Seems like life is too full of these guys already......so how do they impact the final hunt costs?
just wondering
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Old 03-10-2008, 06:10 PM
  #50  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Posts: 149
Default RE: Why are hunts so damn expensive???

ORIGINAL: ShatoDavis

ORIGINAL: laufer303

ORIGINAL: ShatoDavis

...
I would rather stay home, then drive out there and fight the rest of the idiots for elbow room. ...
Being one of those, as you called us "the rest of the idiots",I can guarantee you that I have more fun in the field any day, harvesting animals or not, than you can have staying at home and waiting for the pile of money to get high enough to hire somebody to “guide” you to make a kill. I usually have 4 big game tags, and success rate is 25% or 50%. The rest is enjoying being out there with the “rest of the idiots”. On the other hand, I will never get myself in a situationwhere "guides" drags me arround by my hand, tells me where to sit, where to look, aim and take a shot for 10 grand or more, just to have a rack on my wall, or come back home empty, like so many of the hunters that pay do.

Anyway, please watch your language, as it may offend people who hunt on their own, fair chase on public land.
You know that wasn't my point. Besides I'm sure you know what Idiots I'm talking about. You may not be one of them but you know who I'm talking about.

I'll use whatever language I want. I've already got a daddy so you can stop worrying about me.

If you like hunting where the pressure is high then go for it. I don't. Do not try to belittle me or my hunting style. I will not stand for it. You can think that the guides lead us by the hand and do everything but shoot for me if you want. But I can assure you that it just isn't the case. I don't care what you think of me. When you state it on here then I get defensive.

I also hunt FAIR CHASE ON PUBLIC LAND. The only difference is I live a long way away so I pay an outfitter to get me into the remote areas. Have you ever hunted with a partner. Shared glassing duty to cover more ground. Helped a buddy stalk, dress, and pack his game? Well, thats what a guide is to me. I'll hunt my way, You hunt yours. Best of luck!
No wonder with your mouth that you have to pay somebody to be your buddy. Best of luck to you too.
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