bear hunting
 

ok thats enough

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

uhh....well...cooning isnt unethical. The dog has to work at it, and the dog likes it. So I dnno, Id rather hunt bear out of a stand, but I wouldnt bash anyone for hunting bears with dogs...just my personal opinion

-Travis-

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

If that's not "ethical" in your book, is using dogs to hunt upland birds "ethical"? What about using dogs to hunt mountain lion? Ethical? What about using dogs to hunt rabbit? Ethcial?
Dogs are used in many ways, to hunt many different animals. To many, the best part of the "hunt" is the "chase"! And at the end of a "chase" if I can make a clean shot and a quick kill, than I've been "ethcial" in the hunt!

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I have done it. but its not for me. I wouldn't put anyone down for doing it though. Just out of curiosity, have you ever gone before???? Its not as easy as you may think.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I agree with howler 100%. Alot of people believe that by chasing an animal using hounds with the intent to kill is harrasment of wildlife. My turn for an opinion. The bear has a chance to get away from the houndsman and his dog alot more than if the bear was baited in. Or say those who bait in deer or put out food plots where it's like a candyland that brings in the wildlife. What about fenced in hunt's and exotic's. Here's a real ethical hunt go on a standard buffalo hunt out west where you drive up to the herd and get out and shoot.

I would love to run bears with hounds but it's not legal in colorado. Mountain lions you can, and that's a hunt. Half the people that you know couldn't keep up enough to go on a lion hunt. I've tracked lions clear into dark and started fresh the next day. Maybe to some it's not ethical but when an animal has just as much chance as getting away as to being killed then I think it's fair sport. An elk that has a pack of wolves don't get that good of break. To one what may seem like cheating is just another way someone else hunts. I would rather run hounds than go sit in a tree stand and wait for a whitetail coming into a food plot but that's just me.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I don't see anything wrong it.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

It dosen't matter to me either way, but I do know us hunters have to stick together as long the law is not being broken. Good luck.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

ABSOLUTELY!,
I have ran hounds for years on all types of game and bear too.
Running bear with hounds is more than meets the eye.First of all not all hounds make good bear dogs.You might cull 50 dogs before you get a good one.Then you have to break them off deer and other game you don't want them to run.And then train them on bear.Usually with other dogs.I have ran 2 dogs on bear and even had one that could tree them but it is best to use atleast 3,incase you get a salty boar that will not tree.You have to exercise the dogs everyday,either hunt them or road them.take them out on an old dirt road and turn them loose and follow with a truck.It gets them in shape and toughens their pads so they don't slip while hunting.You have to put in lot's of hours to get good bear dogs and running hounds has cost many divorces,I know because it caused mine.Not to mention all the money in high protien dog food,shots and vet bills and gas to hunt.Then you have your tracking equipment and shock collars.After all that then the fun begins.I know some dogs that you can't even buy and some you can are selling for $25,000.Some guys would rather shoot the dog than to let the bloodline get out into the wrong hands.Anyways when the fun begins I used to drive the back old logging roads and look for fresh tracks I had a hood pad on the hood of my truck and would put a good strike dog on and drive.When the dog winded a bear I would stop and check the track.If it was a good one I would turn the strike dog loose and listen.There is nothing like a good bawl mouth dog on track.It is kind of like an elk bugel up close and echoes through the canyons.If the strike dog lines the track out I would turn a few more dogs loose and when the race was on I would put in my pups.You can tell alot what a dog is doing by their bark and when you hear them chopping,the bear is usually treed.Then you have to get to the tree.and it can be as enduring as a long 15 mile elk hunt through the rockiest,steepest and brushiest country on this earth.If you come up on the bear tree too fast sometimes the bear will jump and run you over.I had a few knock me down.And Iv'e seen grown men scared to death.And if you are out of shape stay in the truck because you will never want to do it again.And if a bear chases you run as fast as you can,they can't catch you because they will be slipping in your $hit.
Also I think hound hunting is ethical because once you have the bear treed you can tell if it is a sow with cubs or a boar.If you have never tried hound hunting give it a try and see how easy and unethical it is.I think you will find otherwise.
Elkshed

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

woody19792000 please tell me what equipment you use, what areas you hunt, how you hunt, etc etc and I'll degrade you and tear apart your choices as unethical, pathetic, and unfair.

Yes, I can play the same game to you, that you play towards houndsmen

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

Woody, you are of course entitled to your opinion but I have to believe you have never been on a bear hunt over hounds. It is easy to think of it as unethical if all you have seen is pictures of bears in trees and guys standing at the bottom of them shooting bears from 10 yards away.

I can assure you it is so much more than that. Hunting bears with hounds is a year round endeavor. Those dogs don't get put in the safe at the end of the year. They are out in the yard and in the kennel and NEED good exercise and training. The cost of agood pack is enormous and the time and devotion to training is a true labor of love. The hunt itself is extremely challenging, as you are talking true wilderness areas. Guys don't run those hounds near highways, their dogs mean to much to them to be hit by cars. In addition, while it may seem that each cast results in a bear up a tree, that is just not the case. Some real big bears will NEVER climb, they may just bay and fight. Wading into an all out brawl between dogs and a boar and placing a single killing shot is not easy. If you think buck fever gets your adreneline pumping. A true houndsman often loves his dogs so much he'll often wade right into the fray if he sees a dog in trouble. In addition, some bears that are treed are females and the ability to look over closely the bear and spot cubs really helps eliminate shooting sows. Sitting a stand over a wildblueberry patch does not give you the same ability to look for cubs which is important in ethical bear harvest.

Lastly, some hound/bear hunts are the most physically challenging hunts left in North America. Once a bear is treed or bays there is only so much time to get there. This often means running through thick swamps and brush so tight as it reduces you to crawling.

I'll wrap up and sayI can understandyour opinion from someone who has not taken part in a hunt like this. But it is a hunt, and truly one of the most exciting and challenging you may ever do. That said, it is absolutely not for everyone. It is different than deer hunting on so many levels. The "thrill" is not the killing of the bear at all as it so often is with deer or other animals. The "hunt" is in the sounding of the hounds, the chase through miles of woods and the reward of working so closely with great dogs. If you are not aware, this type of hunting has been around as long as man has been hunting, and the domestication of the dog was for this very purpose. A true houndsman feels this in their hunt.

Dog hunting, whether for birds or bears is not for everyone. But if you try it, even just once, I promise you will at least understand and appreciate the ethical nature of this type of hunting even if it is not for you.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I also feel it is perfectly ok. And lot less bear is killed here by hunting with
hounds. The only time I felt frustrated is when setting waiting for a deer
during archery season to have hounds run by you. But, that is ok with me
as they have a right to hunt too. I was once driving in to go archery
hunting and saw a big buckrun across a dirt road on the way in. Wouldn't
you know it a big bear came right out behind it. It stopped in the road for
about half a minute, and then continued on the chase. Others went in and
tried baiting it and had no luck, as, the bear preffered meat over sweets.
So, I asked a freind if he would run his hounds through there. He said no
way, forget it that bear will not tree. He continued on and told me how
this big bear had already killed 2 of his hounds on him. And as stated
above they cost them way to much time and money to have this stuff
happen to them. And of corse there is times they chase them for miles
and miles and never get to see the bear at all. So I would have to say
that the bear still has a better chance at getting away than hunting over bait.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I personally don't bear hunt but that is just my opinion. I hunt the deer family and upland game. Something about shooting a bear doesn't appeal to me. I see them regularly in both bow and rifle seasons and always pass on them. Baiting here is illegal and hound hunting is legal. I guess the rational is that it is too easy to kill them over bait. The hounds are pretty effective at treeing them and gives a hunter a much better chance then trying to still hunt them. I have friends who hunt with dogs and they usually tree several each season. Most of the time the dogs are pulled off and the bear is allowed to run another day. The guys focus on the chase not the kill. The only bears that are usually shot are boars. I don't think it is unethical to hunt with them and respect the guys for their focus on the chase and their selectivity of the kill. Bears are a really fascinating animal and every time I see one I am in awe

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

Guys watch out for these kinds of posts. Sounds like morePETA bait to me. I can hear it now. The majority of hunters on a leading forum feel hunting with dogs is unethical.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I agree with Howler... I have huntedbear to birds with dogs. Granddad was a houndsman from @$LL. Can't remember any hunt that was easy for bear or lion. Running behind a pack of hounds is thrilling to say the least. Stillhound hunt bear and cats and 1 out of 10 chases might end at the tree. Nothing easy about that. I also agree with Stack62 sounds like somebody wanting to cause problems with hunters and make judgements on the ethics of hunting with hounds and/or baiting bear.

Goatslayer....

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

People who hunt with hounds put more work into them than anyone that doesn't hunt with hounds can even comprehend. I have never hunted for bear with hounds & probably never will......But these are hunters rights to hunt with hounds, Just like you wouldn't want a bow hunter telling you rifle hunting is uneithical.:eek:
Here in Michigan a few years back they had a ballot proposal to get rid of running beardogs....Yep thenthe anti's got in & added several more attachments......WE SHOT THEM DOWN SOUNDLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![:-]

Just because you don't agree with it.....lets not fight & take other hunters rights away from them.:)
Take care J

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

Since you responded to me Stack I guess I'll return the favor. I can only guess you didn't read the whole thread or to make matters worse you didn't or couldn't understand. Choosing to not hunt a particular type of game certainly doesn't make a person a peta member. I explained that I chose to not hunt bears and I made it clear that I didn't have a problem with others hunting them by any means. For your information I don't hunt ducks either and I am a member of DU. I just never started to hunt them when I was young because the season clashed with bow hunting. I hunt all types of big game in two or three states and various far away places. I enjoy severalweeks of upland bird, rabbit, turkey and squirrel hunting every year. So before you preach to the choir you better get your facts straight.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

i'm a bear hunter i use hounds! i won't do it anyother way! it's more than a sport for me it's a traditoin that has been passed down through my family for generations! for me it's all in raising dogs from pups and watching them turn into awsome bear and hog baying dogs.
if you want a challenging hunt come and try to make it through the mountains behind hounds, you can sat a treestand all day. but how many can go where the game goes which is where the hounds take you, if you've got what it takes to follow them there. a lot of people just guess on where the game is coming from people who prsue game with dogs find out where it goes, it takes more than just turning dogs loose, you've got to have knowledge of the game to know where to turn them loose. myself i don't release a dog without first seeing the track! and will find the biggest track i can, i won't turn on anything i think will be less than 150lbs.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

well I use dogs for hogs and deer, so you know my opinion

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

Well I hunt bear by bait here in wisconsin minnesota canada and michigan. I wouldnt mind hound hunters if they would have more respect then the ones i have came across. I prefer minnesota for bear hunting because there you cant hunt with the aid of hounds. When I hunt wisconsin there always seems to be a dog hunter who will raid my bait stations and run my bears off. I know this do to them telling me, them leaving notes, them leaving video tapes. dog hunters around northern wi allways drive the roads looking for bait hunters spots so they can either place a small bucket full of bait close to our bait so they can steal bears from our baits then run their dogs there.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I've never hunted bears with hounds, but this post makes me want to! Been wanting to shoot one with my 454 Casull with those 370 grain hard cast bullets, anyways.:D

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

CI since you did not read or as you say understand my post I will spell it out more for your. I didn't call you a peta member, I said this could be peta bait. Why even start a post like this. The seperation of the hunting community in a whole will be its downfall. I don't care if you are member of DU or FU. There are just as many anti's watching these forum as hunters. I understand you have the choice to shut up and listen what you lack is the ability.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I dont think hunting with dogs is unethical it is a way of bear hunting just like baiting and calling. I have to agree with wayne johnson when he says dog hunters need to have more respect torwards other hunters though. I to hunt wisconsin for bear whenever i get a tag andI hunt minnesota when I dont. Its always a strugle hunting bear on public land here in wi because dog hunters will invade your baits. A lot of them will just run dogs up and down the whole road. Ive caught numerous other dog hunters screwing around my bait stations in minnesota you dont have to wory bout that.

Any of you guys bear hunting minnesota here?

Oh and stack62 i dont think there is a lot if any peta people on these forums like you say and thats preaty low to accuse a fellow hunter of being one which you did do so.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

You read the Peta press releases don't you? I know I do cause most of them are posted on this site. I did not call the guy a peta member. I apprecitate the guy being species specific in what he hunts. I just said these kinda post can be bait for peta. Don't be nieve in thinking hunters are the only ones watching what other hunters do. As long as I am hunting I am happy. No matter dog, gun, bow or whatever and I will support the majority of hunting avenues exceptfor this World hunting deal.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

Hey... we agree on something stack. I would like to add Canned Hunting to my list of things that are not hunting. I don't support that or the WHA in any way shape or form. I understand you reluctance to discuss subjects that might be used by the anti's but this is a hunting site which is used as a form of education to some of our new sportsmen. Many of the younger kids just coming up are getting the wrong idea of hunting by the sat Tv shows which are killing captive animals. The shows paint the sport as being easy and place unreal objectives in the kids minds. When it doesn't happen for them they get bored with it and fall away from the sport. I don't mind talking about it here because some of us want to spread the word about how real hunting should be. When my father first took me out at age 12 I expected a deer to be behind every tree. I quickly learned that I was playing on their turf and they had the advantage. It hooked me for life. I shot my first deer at age 15 which was 43 years ago and realize that like everything in life the good things come hard. If it was that easy it wouldn't be fun. Sorry to misinterpret your post Stack and have a great day.

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

I think all hunting is ethical if done within reason,common sense and the laws are followed.
I hope all the outdoorsman and women stick together,It would be a shame to self destruct and not be able to hunt,fish,trap or even use the outdoors.I think a lot of people would agree that hunting is more humane than mother natures ways,starvation,disease,predation.
If ignorance was compensated with knowledge then those non-hunting groups would understand.At this time I think they look like a bunch of fools.Just ask a game Bio.
Elkshed

RE: Is Bear hunting with a dog ethical?
 

No problem CI. All is well. Have a great season this year.